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"But if you do what is evil, be afraid; for [the RS] does not bear the sword for nothing." (Rm 13:4) But what if that "evil" moves in on the flock, till an offending brother becomes a betrayal of sound trust & confidences: through backstabbing, in taking an ungodly adversary’s side during a...

We are to pray for "all who are in authority". That doesn't mean we are to cast aside the world's borders that God established. (Acts 17:26) I'll put it this way as simplest as I can, My concern over this is wherever an agreement over the RS for a country is struck. There's nothing really...

Fair question concerned of not only His will, but authority when defending my nation's interests, while treating that same authority differently when considering the interests of Christ's Church beyond my national borders. It is therefore of dual allegiance. That could be challenging in some...

Right, who still had not yet received the gift of the promise of power. Therein, two are present in the OP. Right again! Now are these concerns for the Church to cancel my points found elsewhere? I don't anticipating entertaining much more of these deflections concerning God's will for the...

Once a pestilence, , always. But finally, for once we don't have to grant more legitimacy to establish themselves forwarding their glossary of terminology which could be re-assessed. It may appear more fluid, but still offers an image of western legitimacy which the west seems particularly...

That is an identifiable stretch. Nothing is delineated except one clear one as seen in the OP by again, the use of a Christian. And I continue to wait for that Romans "servant" (RS) shown to be UN-Christian (post #11). Like most everyone here, you again leave off that which does not conform to a...

While that is true, it does not remain - unrelated from the words of the Master. For did He fail when delivering such depth of of commentary on imprisoned punishment, while not refusing ownership of weaponry?

From my AI/SI assistant: "The text certainly establishes the permissibility of possessing a sword, but the New Testament does not give us a developed doctrine saying: That conclusion may be argued from broader biblical principles, but it shouldn't be presented as though Jesus explicitly...

Below you will find an example of what this thread's general direction is concerned with, which remains centered on each of our opinions of Romans ch 13:1-5 and in regards to lethal force by God's will. Would be interesting in hearing yours.

Considering your post was indeed in response to the pastor, I considered tipping the scales with the unaccountable "FREE WILL". Due to this thread's concern, I'll assume you wish doesn't apply to anything concerning us?

Now is that stated in objection to the established RS?

Agree, as it's laid out, everything done "decently and in order" if I were to apply that to the institutionalizing of this office. I do however see the need to keep the perspective alive that the Romans 13 "servant" (RS) will be subject to, a ready and hastened state. Today, this all remains...

Please consider my train of thought here. We know the "established" "servant" maintains the sword. You correctly affirm the covenant use. Now, seemingly an unprecedented maneuver, if that 'servant' finally becomes 'established', the Gospel's use in civil matters is now furnished with an agent of...

As I used to maintain but, why I now remain adamant on this as him being included in His member-wide callings. For I no longer have to disturb the prayer house/Church door, for this servant to function seeing his duty is a divine distraction like no other Christian and highly specialized by the...

My-my HaH, how have I managed to miss this interest of yours? ⚖️ Oh please do, coupled with His timing and depth of increase 🙏. And no, I don't doubt Rom 13 as being one of Peter's examples, possibly among the chief of puzzle pieces.

Welcoming you with the others! Praying somehow, God will provide comfort!

Why do you discount so easily Romans 13 "servant"? He is also Christian. As it is written, he too is "God's servant" (v4, Rom 8:9).

Most certainly! In short, the missing institution and ‘establishment’ of the “servant”. He was put there for a purpose, not to sit and watch it be absorbed into some governmental unspoken protocol. To date, without that establishing, that governing authority simply acts as a lawful yet unjust...

I'm genuinely puzzled by Christianity's rich Biblical competence when it comes 'to all eagerness' to facilitate Capital Punishment (CP), especially by those who present themselves as devout proponents of New Testament accuracy? Are you one? I get the deterrent part (if only that same enthusiasm...

Paul did not know those disciples of John when he asked the question, all he knew to correctly ask was an elementary question which separates two distinct events of the candidate receiving Christ/Holy Spirit, and those many references that point to a subsequent event. Sometimes, you have to give...