American fundamentalist vs Muslim fundamentalists

[TheGrungeDiva]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Subhanallah, please say the shahada brother. you are doing just what allah wants. Subhanallah. you have helped the cause of Allah, Islam and muhammad. Inshaallah, allah will grant you 72 virgins in janna.

Perhaps you weren't aware of this, but the word "Allah" simply translates as "God."

So if anyone tells me I'm doing the will of Allah, then that is a compliment. After all, we Christians believe that there is only ONE God, so if I am doing the will of the ONE true God, then I must be doing good.

 

[leonardronaldo]

I have not read the entire book, nor have I read any in its original language. If you have, which translations have you read? Or are you fluent in Arabic?

Well the arabic speaking girl have posted things in arabic and you didn't even care what she posted. I am not an arabic speaker, but the LORD gave me logic and mind to think and seek.
There are many of translations and interpretations in quran, so you yourself can easily pick any of them.
The government of Saudi and Jordan., for example have a special website that translate the quran into more than 10 languages. So there's no reason for anybody to not read about Islam.
And you didn't have to live in Indonesia like me to see how 'peaceful' and 'tolerant' ('moderate') muslims are here, or other muslim dominated country, to know what Islam really teaches them.
It's just a matter of some clicks.

I am graceful that the LORD showed the truth to millions of muslims, and showed also the True Word of God to them. I am still praying for them, may the LORD continues to show his grace and mercy to more and more truthseekers. Amen

 

[leonardronaldo]

Perhaps you weren't aware of this, but the word "Allah" simply translates as "God."

So if anyone tells me I'm doing the will of Allah, then that is a compliment. After all, we Christians believe that there is only ONE God, so if I am doing the will of the ONE true God, then I must be doing good.

False, the word God in Arabic is ILAH. even muslims say that in their Shahada, LA ILAH ha ILLALLAH. (There is no GOD but ALLAH).
So, again, don't swallow everything from anywhere, rather think is it the truth or even logical?

There is One God, but of course not Allah of the Quran.
If that's a compliment to you, then I recommend you to really study Islam yourself.
Because it's an insult to me lol

 

[TheGrungeDiva]

Well the arabic speaking girl have posted things in arabic and you didn't even care what she posted.

I cared deeply what she said. Nice selective memory you have there. You seem to have forgotten that I was very concerned about her comments, and invited her to comment further, asking for clarification. I was also one of the first who recognized that she was from an Arab country.

So, the way you interpreted my concern for our Arab-Christian sister as "not caring," I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that you misunderstand, or completely make up your own ideas about what Muslims believe. You seem to spout off whatever you want and call that "proof."

I am not an arabic speaker, but the LORD gave me logic and mind to think and seek.

The Lord did indeed give you logic and a mind. Why don't you USE those gifts that were given to you?

There are many of translations and interpretations in quran, so you yourself can easily pick any of them.

Yes, I am aware of that. I have read from a few translations. Like I said, I have not read the whole thing yet. I was not asking you for advice on how to get the Quran in a language I could understand, I was asking for your input on which translation or translations you, personally, had read, and what you thought of them. For example, do you like one better than another? Do you think the website you mention is a fair translation or is it perhaps a biased translation?

I was asking, because at first, you seemed to be someone who had some experience in this field. After reading a few more posts from you, however, I see that you have no more expertise than anyone else. Even though you taunt others about how they should learn about Islam, you clearly have not done so yourself, which makes you the biggest hypocrite of all.

And you didn't have to live in Indonesia like me to see how 'peaceful' and 'tolerant' ('moderate') muslims are here, or other muslim dominated country, to know what Islam really teaches them.
It's just a matter of some clicks.

Uh-huh. Because everything that's printed on the Web is 100% true and accurate.

 

[kayem77]

She lives in a Muslim country???

Americans live in a Christian country ... Dont make all the teachings Christian does it?

My arrogance, in all honesty, has nothing to do with you.

I know Muslims. I have muslim friends. They have discernment enough to read the book as it's intended.

Yes, she lives in a muslim country , didn't you read her 4 or 5 posts? And there are others in this site that can tell you how muslim countries function. And you don't need to go by yourself to witness those things. Click on these websites and see by yourself.

http://www.persecution.com/
Persecuted Countries « Persecution of Christians & Persecuted Churches[/COLOR]

Why is it that Islamic countries are so hostile to Christians or other minorities? Why is it that Islamic countries are the ones that oppress women the most? I met a man who fled Irak many years ago because he didn't like what he saw there.
Btw the reason why I emphasize Islamic countries is because I'm aware there are muslims in non-Islamic countries, but these things are not common in those places.

The USA is not a ''Christian country'' since there is no such thing on Earth, so pointing out that there are false Christians doesn't prove anything. But you can't decide to just ignore the HUGE difference between the ''Christian world'' and the Islamic world.

Saying that Islam teaches love is slapping the face of all the Christian martyrs (and non-Christians too ) who have died or suffered in hands of muslim authorities in Islamic countries. And that's why it bothers me.

 

[TheGrungeDiva]

Saying that Islam teaches love is slapping the face of all the Christian martyrs (and non-Christians too ) who have died or suffered in hands of muslim authorities in Islamic countries. And that's why it bothers me.

I like a lot of what you say. It is true: women are treated horribly in countries where Islam is the official religion. Then again, women are treated poorly in some countries that are not predominately Muslim (I'm thinking of South America and some African countries).

I'm still not comfortable saying that the fundamentalist, extreme, violent, hateful things you see in these countries is "representative" of Islam. Even if you could show that a "majority" of Islams agreed in the theology of "death to the infidel" and "women are cattle" and all the other stereotypes we hear about, I know there are Muslims who read the Quran daily, who have devoted their life to Allah, and who decry the violence against non-Muslims.

Here's an example:

Perhaps you've heard of a denomination called "Metropolitan Christian Church" or MCC. If you have not, go ahead and google it. Now, they are nowhere near a "majority" of Christians in this country. But for argument's sake, let's pretend in one place, oh, I don't know, let's just say in San Francisco, they were the majority.

Let's say someone totally new to Christianity was from San Francisco, and this particular denomination, this MCC, was the only Christian Church they knew. As far as they knew, all Christians were like that, believed what they believed, and accepted those teachings. That would be a very wrong idea of what Christianity is, wouldn't you agree?

Similarly, just because SOME Muslims believe in violence does not mean that their religion teaches it, any more than just because SOME Christians believe that homosexuality is okay means that Christianity teaches it.

Saying that people from a given religion behave a certain way, and saying that their religion TEACHES that, are different things. For heaven's sake, we base our entire Gospel on the fact that we DON"T behave the way we ought. If we did, there would be no need for Christ. If our behavior were in line with our teaching, the entire theology would be a contradiction.

 

[kayem77]

I was born and raised in Mexico. The semi-official religion in Mexico is Catholicism, as well as in South America, you can see the difference too between South America and, let's say, the US, a country that was founded by protestant Christians. (I wanna spare all the argument about the US foundation, I know it was never proclaimed an official Christian nation, but it was founded on Christian principles, directly or indirectly) .

The opression against women in South America is far very different from the opression in Islamic countries. Women are not forced to wear veils, and women can work and go to college, they are not stoned by the government,etc. However, and I blame this partly on Catholicism , the gospel was never spread the same as it was in the States. And for what I've seen, when the gospel is not spread accordingly, the hearts of the people of a nation remain unchanged. In Mexico and South America, people don't have the same morals. Drugs, violence, and a clear indifference to real religion (love and truth) are prevalent in those countries. As you say about muslims, there are also Catholics who are not part of this pattern, but the truth is that generally speaking, in Catholic countries, violence and/or poverty are a common thing to see.

I have read the Quran too, I haven't studied it thoroughly to be honest, nor do I have a degree on Quran studies or something, but I've seen that it doesn't have a New Covenant. The Quran is a book full of laws (and history), while the Bible has an OT and a NT. This is important, because the Quran never says ''ok this was the law, now I will provide a way for you to live better" as Jesus did.

In answer to your example, and not wanting to be rude, I think your example doesn't apply just because it is not a real situation. In the real world, you can easily see what Christianity teaches when it comes to basic doctrines. You just need to look around. And why is it ? Because the Bible is available to us, and we can read it, and we can see that killing is wrong, adultery is wrong, poligamy is wrong, etc. I can see your point and there are cases where we shouldn't believe things are true because it's the popular idea or behavior, but isn't it interesting that noone interprets the Bible as to say things like ''kill the unbelievers'' as an example?

And I know someone will bring the Crusades to discussion, but I wanna remind everybody that in the times of the Crusades, the Bible was not available to people, and the Church(or the Pope) was the only one who could read it .

 

[JimJimmers]

I'm still not comfortable saying that the fundamentalist, extreme, violent, hateful things you see in these countries is "representative" of Islam. Even if you could show that a "majority" of Islams agreed in the theology of "death to the infidel" and "women are cattle" and all the other stereotypes we hear about, I know there are Muslims who read the Quran daily, who have devoted their life to Allah, and who decry the violence against non-Muslims.

Well, of course it could be representative of Islam without being representative of all Muslims. I pray for and love those brave souls I see decrying the killing of Christians.

"And whoever gives one of these little ones even a cup of cold water because he is a disciple, truly, I say to you, he will by no means lose his reward.”

 

[IWTD]

Again, it would depend on the situation. I would absolutely keep at least one copy to use as evidence to prosecute the offender. If one copy was already secured, and/or if and when the offender was convicted, I see no problem discarding the evidence, because it will have served its purpose and can absolutely be discarded.


If you can't see a value in education, then I cannot help you.

I think that the Germans have already one copy of mein kampf secured...and there is absolutely no reason to spread his book - (but as you said you would absolutely keep it).Obviously you are the one who can't see a value in education...but I can help you.Please read more than one book(reading slightly different translations of one particular book doesn't really count)

 

[Keystone]

The Crusades were formed to fight the muslims. Muslim were taking over cities, town and villages forcing the survivors to their beliefs.

In 1095 an assembly of churchmen called by Pope Urban II met at Clermont, France. Messengers from the Byzantine Emperor Alexius Comnenus had urged the pope to send help against the armies of Muslim Turks. On November 27 the pope addressed the assembly and asked the warriors of Europe to liberate the Holy Land from the Muslims. The response of the assembly was overwhelmingly favorable. Thus was launched the first and most successful of at least eight crusades against the Muslim caliphates of the Near East.


There are good people, there are good muslims but there is nothing good from the nation of islam and what they really preach. (Matthew 7:11 If you, then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him!)
Anyone who defends the quran, the muslim faith are basicaly saying satanist are good people too and the satanic bible has a lot of to offer. We should embrace satanism and learn more about what they stand for and then join it with Christianity.
Standup and defend your faith without compromise. Those defending the quran and islam are defending satan.
Matthew 6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

 

[TheGrungeDiva]

In answer to your example, and not wanting to be rude...

Not at all. In fact, I find your tone refreshing and respectful, and though we disagree, I appreciate your comments, and the way you discuss my ideas rather than insulting me as a person. It is very nice to see that, and I thank you.

Plus, especially as English is not your native language, let me just say you have expressed yourself very well.

Because the Bible is available to us, and we can read it, and we can see that killing is wrong, adultery is wrong, poligamy is wrong, etc.

Except that some of the "heros" of the Bible had multiple wives, and God ordered the killing of women and infants in some cases, so I'd have to say if you just read the Bible without understanding, you're not likely to get that message.

but isn't it interesting that noone interprets the Bible as to say things like ''kill the unbelievers'' as an example?

It's not so long ago that Christians interpreted Scripture to read that we were required to kill pagans ("Suffer not a witch to live"). So I'd have to correct you here, to, and say that while today, very few people (if any) thinks the Bible says it's okay to kill unbelievers, that idea was prevalent and even in the majority within the memory of people alive today.

Also, you can look around here in the U.S. or in South America and meet plenty of Christians to know that extreme beliefs (extreme on either side) are not the norm. But that's because a majority of the population here is Christian. Muslims who live in Muslim countries or other non-Christian countries do not have the opportunity to "look around" and see what Christians are like. A lot of Muslims hate Christians because they've been taught incorrect information about us, just as we've been taught incorrect information about them. And though I disagree with some things IWDT has said, he makes a valid point: no one in the US has an excuse not to know at least a little about Islam. But in Muslim countries, censorship is standard, so at least they have an excuse for their ignorance about us.

But I do appreciate your point, about the differences between how women are treated in Central and South America vs. the Middle East. You're right -- women don't have equal rights in Mexico or points south, but it's not nearly as bad as Afghanistan.

Thank you again for your words and your wisdom. God bless.

 

[TheGrungeDiva]

I think that the Germans have already one copy of mein kampf secured...and there is absolutely no reason to spread his book -

Unless you actually want to learn from history.

"Those who do not learn from history are destined to repeat it."

(but as you said you would absolutely keep it).

Not only would I, I DO have a copy of that book, in its original German. It is chilling and fascinating reading. Of course I disagree with every word it says, but that does not mean it isn't fascinating to read.

Obviously you are the one who can't see a value in education...

?
No, there is nothing "obvious" about that. I am the one who encourages learning. You are the one who discourages it.

I say education is a good thing, and one should never miss an opportunity to learn something.

You seem to be saying that there are some things that just should not be taught and should not be learned, even as wrong. Like, I should not teach my son about hitting, even to teach him that hitting is wrong. I should just pretend that it doesn't exist, and hope that he goes through his whole life never seeing any violence, so that he doesn't ever have to make a moral decision.

Seriously? Do you really believe that, or are you just spouting off for the sake of disagreeing with me, because you want to be disagreeable?

Because seriously, if you object to the lessons we can learn from reading Meinen Kampf, then you absolutely HAVE to support banning the Bible. It's WAY worse.

Please read more than one book(reading slightly different translations of one particular book doesn't really count)

I've read 3 books today alone, and will probably get a 4th in tomorrow. How many books have you read this month so far?

And my final question: are you trying to be a troll or does it just come naturally?

 

[leonardronaldo]

I cared deeply what she said. Nice selective memory you have there. You seem to have forgotten that I was very concerned about her comments, and invited her to comment further, asking for clarification. I was also one of the first who recognized that she was from an Arab country.

So, the way you interpreted my concern for our Arab-Christian sister as "not caring," I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that you misunderstand, or completely make up your own ideas about what Muslims believe. You seem to spout off whatever you want and call that "proof."


The Lord did indeed give you logic and a mind. Why don't you USE those gifts that were given to you?


Yes, I am aware of that. I have read from a few translations. Like I said, I have not read the whole thing yet. I was not asking you for advice on how to get the Quran in a language I could understand, I was asking for your input on which translation or translations you, personally, had read, and what you thought of them. For example, do you like one better than another? Do you think the website you mention is a fair translation or is it perhaps a biased translation?

I was asking, because at first, you seemed to be someone who had some experience in this field. After reading a few more posts from you, however, I see that you have no more expertise than anyone else. Even though you taunt others about how they should learn about Islam, you clearly have not done so yourself, which makes you the biggest hypocrite of all.


Uh-huh. Because everything that's printed on the Web is 100% true and accurate.

Completely make up what muslims believe? hahaha, come on, i am not allah nor muhammad. Challenge me please to prove it. Which part of my claim that you think was my made up story?
I read and compare almost all of the translations that given in those 2 websites I mentioned. So?
Ah, so now, the Jordan Kingdom's official governmental website and Saudi Arabia's official governmental website is biased? Well yea, I think they may be Jews and Christians making up translations of the quran right? Come on, Madam. Please, try to look it up first, rather than questioning about the bias of it.

Well i never claimed to be an expert in Islam, though I have read many literatures and references of Quranic and Sunna. I need to speak and understand Arabic to be an expert in Islam, (which I don't) and read more literatures and references which are not translated by the Arabs to any other languages, then I may be an expert in Islam.
How do you know I haven't done my learning on Islam? God knows, but again you can ask me to proof any of my claims above. I will back them of course.
Everything on the web is 100% true and accurate, come on. you know it's not true. There are many contradicting news and literatures out there, how can all of them (100%) be true?

Peace

 

[leonardronaldo]

I like a lot of what you say. It is true: women are treated horribly in countries where Islam is the official religion. Then again, women are treated poorly in some countries that are not predominately Muslim (I'm thinking of South America and some African countries).

I'm still not comfortable saying that the fundamentalist, extreme, violent, hateful things you see in these countries is "representative" of Islam. Even if you could show that a "majority" of Islams agreed in the theology of "death to the infidel" and "women are cattle" and all the other stereotypes we hear about, I know there are Muslims who read the Quran daily, who have devoted their life to Allah, and who decry the violence against non-Muslims.

Here's an example:

Perhaps you've heard of a denomination called "Metropolitan Christian Church" or MCC. If you have not, go ahead and google it. Now, they are nowhere near a "majority" of Christians in this country. But for argument's sake, let's pretend in one place, oh, I don't know, let's just say in San Francisco, they were the majority.

Let's say someone totally new to Christianity was from San Francisco, and this particular denomination, this MCC, was the only Christian Church they knew. As far as they knew, all Christians were like that, believed what they believed, and accepted those teachings. That would be a very wrong idea of what Christianity is, wouldn't you agree?

Similarly, just because SOME Muslims believe in violence does not mean that their religion teaches it, any more than just because SOME Christians believe that homosexuality is okay means that Christianity teaches it.

Saying that people from a given religion behave a certain way, and saying that their religion TEACHES that, are different things. For heaven's sake, we base our entire Gospel on the fact that we DON"T behave the way we ought. If we did, there would be no need for Christ. If our behavior were in line with our teaching, the entire theology would be a contradiction.

More than 50% muslims denounce terrorism, violence, etc.
That doesn't make Islam is against violence to the disbelievers.
Learn the nasikh al mansoukh (abrogation of the earlier verse) in the quran. Which type of verses revealed later in the quran? Unfortunately it was the violent and hateful verses.

 

[leonardronaldo]

I was born and raised in Mexico. The semi-official religion in Mexico is Catholicism, as well as in South America, you can see the difference too between South America and, let's say, the US, a country that was founded by protestant Christians. (I wanna spare all the argument about the US foundation, I know it was never proclaimed an official Christian nation, but it was founded on Christian principles, directly or indirectly) .

The opression against women in South America is far very different from the opression in Islamic countries. Women are not forced to wear veils, and women can work and go to college, they are not stoned by the government,etc. However, and I blame this partly on Catholicism , the gospel was never spread the same as it was in the States. And for what I've seen, when the gospel is not spread accordingly, the hearts of the people of a nation remain unchanged. In Mexico and South America, people don't have the same morals. Drugs, violence, and a clear indifference to real religion (love and truth) are prevalent in those countries. As you say about muslims, there are also Catholics who are not part of this pattern, but the truth is that generally speaking, in Catholic countries, violence and/or poverty are a common thing to see.

I have read the Quran too, I haven't studied it thoroughly to be honest, nor do I have a degree on Quran studies or something, but I've seen that it doesn't have a New Covenant. The Quran is a book full of laws (and history), while the Bible has an OT and a NT. This is important, because the Quran never says ''ok this was the law, now I will provide a way for you to live better" as Jesus did.

In answer to your example, and not wanting to be rude, I think your example doesn't apply just because it is not a real situation. In the real world, you can easily see what Christianity teaches when it comes to basic doctrines. You just need to look around. And why is it ? Because the Bible is available to us, and we can read it, and we can see that killing is wrong, adultery is wrong, poligamy is wrong, etc. I can see your point and there are cases where we shouldn't believe things are true because it's the popular idea or behavior, but isn't it interesting that noone interprets the Bible as to say things like ''kill the unbelievers'' as an example?

And I know someone will bring the Crusades to discussion, but I wanna remind everybody that in the times of the Crusades, the Bible was not available to people, and the Church(or the Pope) was the only one who could read it .

The new covenant in islam is the Jihad verses which was later revealed by allah to muhammad which abrogated any less aggressive verses in the quran.

 

[jimmydiggs]

I was born and raised in Mexico. The semi-official religion in Mexico is Catholicism, as well as in South America, you can see the difference too between South America and, let's say, the US, a country that was founded by protestant Christians. (I wanna spare all the argument about the US foundation, I know it was never proclaimed an official Christian nation, but it was founded on Christian principles, directly or indirectly) .

The opression against women in South America is far very different from the opression in Islamic countries. Women are not forced to wear veils, and women can work and go to college, they are not stoned by the government,etc. However, and I blame this partly on Catholicism , the gospel was never spread the same as it was in the States. And for what I've seen, when the gospel is not spread accordingly, the hearts of the people of a nation remain unchanged. In Mexico and South America, people don't have the same morals. Drugs, violence, and a clear indifference to real religion (love and truth) are prevalent in those countries. As you say about muslims, there are also Catholics who are not part of this pattern, but the truth is that generally speaking, in Catholic countries, violence and/or poverty are a common thing to see.

I have read the Quran too, I haven't studied it thoroughly to be honest, nor do I have a degree on Quran studies or something, but I've seen that it doesn't have a New Covenant. The Quran is a book full of laws (and history), while the Bible has an OT and a NT. This is important, because the Quran never says ''ok this was the law, now I will provide a way for you to live better" as Jesus did.

In answer to your example, and not wanting to be rude, I think your example doesn't apply just because it is not a real situation. In the real world, you can easily see what Christianity teaches when it comes to basic doctrines. You just need to look around. And why is it ? Because the Bible is available to us, and we can read it, and we can see that killing is wrong, adultery is wrong, poligamy is wrong, etc. I can see your point and there are cases where we shouldn't believe things are true because it's the popular idea or behavior, but isn't it interesting that noone interprets the Bible as to say things like ''kill the unbelievers'' as an example?

And I know someone will bring the Crusades to discussion, but I wanna remind everybody that in the times of the Crusades, the Bible was not available to people, and the Church(or the Pope) was the only one who could read it .

What appears to be your understanding of the relationship between the Covenants of God, is unfortunately rather erroneous.

Also, killing in and of itself isn't wrong. Murder (unjust killing) is wrong. If killing is wrong, you shouldn't be eating animals, plants, or anything of the sort. Let alone bring in the thousands of tiny microbes that die inside your body.

in Catholic countries, violence and/or poverty are a common thing to see.

Same with all the other countries that got raped by European powers, through devastating colonialism and the theft of natural resources, only to leave the people and the land in disrepair.

same as it was in the States

Wasn't really spread that well. Christians in previous centuries weren't any better off than we are, that's part of the whole grass being greener on the other side.

 

[kayem77]

Not at all. In fact, I find your tone refreshing and respectful, and though we disagree, I appreciate your comments, and the way you discuss my ideas rather than insulting me as a person. It is very nice to see that, and I thank you.

Plus, especially as English is not your native language, let me just say you have expressed yourself very well.

Thank you, I'm glad my English is understandable

Except that some of the "heros" of the Bible had multiple wives, and God ordered the killing of women and infants in some cases, so I'd have to say if you just read the Bible without understanding, you're not likely to get that message.

I will say this again but I think this is the key difference in Christianity and any other religion: The New Testament and the New Covenant.

The Old Testament is full of history and some books talk about laws, like Leviticus and Deutoronomy. Some practices were condoned, some were just part of the story and served its purpose and some were ''allowed''. Having multiple wives was allowed, and at that time having 2 or 3 wives wasn't seen as something bad and was possible better for a single woman to be married than being a prostitute...however Deutoronomy 17 does say that it was bad to ''multiply wives''. I'm sure you already know all those arguments though.
The Quran doesn't have a New Testament, when you read the laws, it never goes on to provide a way for people to be better.

It's not so long ago that Christians interpreted Scripture to read that we were required to kill pagans ("Suffer not a witch to live"). So I'd have to correct you here, to, and say that while today, very few people (if any) thinks the Bible says it's okay to kill unbelievers, that idea was prevalent and even in the majority within the memory of people alive today.

What kind of witch-hunts are you talking about? To be honest, I don't know what exactly you are talking about, since I haven't heard of people in this century thinking that killing anyone was biblical. I know that pagans were persecuted soon after Constantine made Christianity the official religion, but I'm not sure if that's what you're talking about. Maybe send a link if you want?

Also, you can look around here in the U.S. or in South America and meet plenty of Christians to know that extreme beliefs (extreme on either side) are not the norm. But that's because a majority of the population here is Christian. Muslims who live in Muslim countries or other non-Christian countries do not have the opportunity to "look around" and see what Christians are like. A lot of Muslims hate Christians because they've been taught incorrect information about us, just as we've been taught incorrect information about them. And though I disagree with some things IWDT has said, he makes a valid point: no one in the US has an excuse not to know at least a little about Islam. But in Muslim countries, censorship is standard, so at least they have an excuse for their ignorance about us.

There ARE Christians in muslim countries, and even if they don't know a lot about our faith, that doesn't make it an excuse to kill somebody.Btw I know that's not your point, but that's the difference I was talking about. I don't know a lot about so many crazy religions, but my Book doesn't tell me that I must hate those persons (I would hate the religion though). Even if they were uninformed...that doesn't make it right. A lot of Christians don't know about Islam, and yet you don't see them killing muslims. And Christian who live in Islamic countries also know that retaliating is not the answer.

But I do appreciate your point, about the differences between how women are treated in Central and South America vs. the Middle East. You're right -- women don't have equal rights in Mexico or points south, but it's not nearly as bad as Afghanistan.

Thank you again for your words and your wisdom. God bless.

Thank you for your time God bless you too!

 

[kayem77]

What appears to be your understanding of the relationship between the Covenants of God, is unfortunately rather erroneous.

??

Hebrews 8:13 By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.

Also, killing in and of itself isn't wrong. Murder (unjust killing) is wrong. If killing is wrong, you shouldn't be eating animals, plants, or anything of the sort. Let alone bring in the thousands of tiny microbes that die inside your body

.


I think it is obvious to say that killing animals isn't wrong...but if necessary, I will clarify I was talking about unjust killing .

Same with all the other countries that got raped by European powers, through devastating colonialism and the theft of natural resources, only to leave the people and the land in disrepair.

My point was to show that the gospel, preached and spread accordingly, usually makes a better nation. Communism affected Europe in the last century in a devastating way, I know there are many things that can bring a country to ruins. I was pointing to the fact that when God is not in the equation, things are usually worse.

Wasn't really spread that well. Christians in previous centuries weren't any better off than we are, that's part of the whole grass being greener on the other side.

At least they had the right to read the Bible last century....in stark contrast to countries in Mexico and South America conquered by the Europeans.

What's your point may I ask? I have the feeling that you only want to show that I'm wrong without any real cause.

 

[Mediate]

False, the word God in Arabic is ILAH. even muslims say that in their Shahada, LA ILAH ha ILLALLAH. (There is no GOD but ALLAH).
So, again, don't swallow everything from anywhere, rather think is it the truth or even logical?

There is One God, but of course not Allah of the Quran.
If that's a compliment to you, then I recommend you to really study Islam yourself.
Because it's an insult to me lol

It's just their word for God.

LIke Jews call Him G-d, or YHWH, or indeed Elohim.

 

[leonardronaldo]

It's just their word for God.

LIke Jews call Him G-d, or YHWH, or indeed Elohim.

Yea, but it is Ilah, not Allah. Allah is specifically the name of the God in the quran, which originated from the pagan god in arabia, Al-Lah (which was from the egyptian moon God, Lah).