Amillennial theology is in error - (no literal thousand year reign)

[zone]

Psalm 90
3You turn man back into dust And say, "Return, O children of men." 4For a thousand years in Your sight Are like yesterday when it passes by, Or as a watch in the night. 5You have swept them away like a flood, they fall asleep; In the morning they are like grass which sprouts anew.


For a thousand years in Your sight Are like:

- Or as a watch in the night

Watches of night: The Jews, like the Greeks and Romans, divided the night into military watches instead of hours, each watch representing the period for which sentinels or pickets remained on duty. The proper Jewish reckoning recognized only three such watches, entitled the first or "beginning of the watches," (Lamentations 2:19) the middle watch, (Judges 7:19) and the morning watch. (Exodus 14:24; 1 Samuel 11:11) These would last respectively from sunset to 10 P.M.; from 10 P.M. to 2 A.M.; and from 2 A.M. to sunrise. After the establishment of the Roman supremacy, the number of watches was increased to four, which were described either according to their numerical order, as in the case of the "fourth watch," (Matthew 14:25) or by the terms "even," "midnight," "cock-crowing" and "morning." (Mark 13:35) These terminated respectively at 9 P.M., midnight, 3 A.M. and 6 A.M.

- Smith’s Bible Dictionary

so a thousand years is like a couple of hours.

 

[zone]

Because it is prophesy.

If we symbolize time in prophesy, we can make it mean anything. And prophesy becomes useless in what it was intended to do. Which is to prove God is the one true God. No one else can prophesy time and events happening in that time, And it literally come true.

If God did not mean 1000 years. But only one day. then why even say it. Not to mention. What god is a God who rules the earth for one day? It makes no sense.

EG....i'm not saying a thousand years IS ONE DAY....i'm saying the proof text (2 Peter) used to prove the "future so-called millennium" is literally a thousand year interim kingdom on earth after Judgment Day....forces ppl who use it to consider that the "millennium" might only be one day long

right?

as for it being prophecy....it is, but apocalyptic genre.

you know revelation is filled with symbolic imagery.
why do ppl love to obsess about that book so much?

if yer gonna take it literally, as in every picture used is LITERALLY referring to something LITERALLY....you gotta have satan being a big red dragon with a gigantic tail.

is he?

and there's a throne in heaven with a lamb with 7 eyes sitting on it.

c'mon.

if God gave the exact time frame COUNTDOWN 999, 998, 997......then The day of The Lord would be known to everyone.

but....The Day of The Lord was when He came at the Second time...so the end of the Millennium is......(?) another day of the Lord?
exactly 1,000 years after the Last day?

 

[zone]

Because it is prophesy.

If we symbolize time in prophesy, we can make it mean anything. And prophesy becomes useless in what it was intended to do. Which is to prove God is the one true God. No one else can prophesy time and events happening in that time, And it literally come true.

If God did not mean 1000 years. But only one day. then why even say it. Not to mention. What god is a God who rules the earth for one day? It makes no sense.

EG - i know you reject a future animal sacrifice system (after Jesus comes).
i know you reject any way of salvation but the New Testament Gospel.

so what is the Millennium for...what happens during it, and where can i read about it (keeping in mind you do seem say we are not going backwards - to Moses or some BETTER Mosiac system under Jesus)

 

[eternally-gratefull]

EG....i'm not saying a thousand years IS ONE DAY....i'm saying the proof text (2 Peter) used to prove the "future so-called millennium" is literally a thousand year interim kingdom on earth after Judgment Day....forces ppl who use it to consider that the "millennium" might only be one day long

right?

No. Because Peter is telling us not to be impatient, A 1000 days is like a day. He is not telling us to interpret prophesy this way.

John is telling us literal events which will take place in the future (which means it did not start with the death of Christ) but after many events happen.

as for it being prophecy....it is, but apocalyptic genre.

lol. Many OT prophesies were this way. It was prophesied that Judah would be overrun by Babylon and the city and temple would be destroyed. It literally happened. Prophesy is prophesy God says A will happen in B years. We can rest assured, these things will literally take place. If they do not. God can not prophesy, All we can do is say God guesses, and makes his prophesies come true by forcing the fulfiment to fit his plan.

you know revelation is filled with symbolic imagery.
why do ppl love to obsess about that book so much?

No. I KNOW revelation uses symbolic imagery to describe literal events. It is the NT version of daniel. who also used the same type of imagery.

Remember, The first beast represented babylon. Yet as we are told. More literally, the first beast represented Nebuchadnezzar. Revelation uses the same symbology to represent literal events and people.

i

f yer gonna take it literally, as in every picture used is LITERALLY referring to something LITERALLY....you gotta have satan being a big red dragon with a gigantic tail.

lol.. No, your trying to add things into it. And in doing so mocking it. In your own type of interpretation. Nebachednezzar was a head of a statue, who was made of Gold.

Dan 2:
[SUP]38 [/SUP]and wherever the children of men dwell, or the beasts of the field and the birds of the heaven, He has given them into your hand, and has made you ruler over them all—you are this head of gold.

is he?

No more than Nebachadnezzar was a literal head of Gold

if Gid gave the exact time frame COUNTDOWN 999, 998, 997......then The day of The Lord would be known to everyone.

but....The Day of The Lord was when He came at the Second time...so the end of the Millennium is......(?) another day of the Lord?
exactly 1,000 years after the Last day?

The day of the lord is not the end of the 1000 years. Thus your twist and explanation makes no sense.

Do you have any other bright ideas?

By the way, Do you know who the Bronze part of the statue in Nebachadnezzar's dream represented? Was he actually literally part of the statue?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

EG - i know you reject a future animal sacrifice system (after Jesus comes).
i know you reject any way of salvation but the New Testament Gospel.

so what is the Millennium for...what happens during it, and where can i read about it (keeping in mind you do seem say we are not going backwards - to Moses or some BETTER Mosiac system under Jesus)

What is the age of the church for? Did the OT even understand what it would be? did they think they even needed it?

Why would we question why God does things?

I have quite a few ideas. But they would just be my opinion. it would not mean they would be true.

 

[zone]

Daniel 2
And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever

....

Acts 4
23When they were released, they went to their friends and reported what the chief priests and the elders had said to them. 24And when they heard it, they lifted their voices together to God and said, “Sovereign Lord, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and everything in them, 25who through the mouth of our father David, your servant,c said by the Holy Spirit,

“‘Why did the Gentiles rage,
and the peoples plot in vain?
26 The kings of the earth set themselves,
and the rulers were gathered together,
against the Lord and against his Anointed’d—

27for truly in this city there were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, 28to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place. 29And now, Lord, look upon their threats and grant to your servantse to continue to speak your word with all boldness, 30while you stretch out your hand to heal, and signs and wonders are performed through the name of your holy servant Jesus.”

...

Acts 4
33And with great power the apostles were giving their testimony to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and great grace was upon them all.

...

Psalm 2
The Reign of the LORD’s Anointed
1 Why do the nations rage.
and the peoples plot in vain?
2 The kings of the earth set themselves,
and the rulers take counsel together,
against the LORD and against his Anointed, saying,
3 “Let us burst their bonds apart
and cast away their cords from us.”

4 He who sits in the heavens laughs;
the Lord holds them in derision.
5 Then he will speak to them in his wrath,
and terrify them in his fury, saying,
6 “As for me, I have set my King
on Zion, my holy hill.”

....

Acts 2
29“Brothers, I may say to you with confidence about the patriarch David that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day. 30 Being therefore a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him that he would set one of his descendants on his throne, 31 he foresaw and spoke about the resurrection of the Christ

...

John 12
When Jesus had said these things, he departed and hid himself from them. 37Though he had done so many signs before them, they still did not believe in him, 38so that the word spoken by the prophet Isaiah might be fulfilled:

“Lord, who has believed what he heard from us,
and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?”

39Therefore they could not believe. For again Isaiah said,

40 “He has blinded their eyes
and hardened their heart,
lest they see with their eyes,
and understand with their heart, and turn,
and I would heal them.”

41Isaiah said these things because he saw his glory and spoke of him. 42Nevertheless, many even of the authorities believed in him, but for fear of the Pharisees they did not confess it, so that they would not be put out of the synagogue; 43for they loved the glory that comes from man more than the glory that comes from God.

Jesus Came to Save the World
44And Jesus cried out and said, “Whoever believes in me, believes not in me but in him who sent me. 45And whoever sees me sees him who sent me. 46I have come into the world as light, so that whoever believes in me may not remain in darkness. 47If anyone hears my words and does not keep them, I do not judge him; for I did not come to judge the world but to save the world. 48The one who rejects me and does not receive my words has a judge; the word that I have spoken will judge him on the last day

 

[zone]

This view [DISPENSATIONALISM] teaches that after Jesus' second coming He will literally rule on the earth for a thousand-years.

In this view there is a difference between the promises of the Old Testament to the descendants of natural Israel and those who have already been born into the new covenant by faith.

Those in this theology believe that when the times of the grafting in of the Gentiles are fulfilled, God will once again deal with the descendants of natural Israel to fulfill the literal promises in scripture directed to them.

The new covenant actually was given to natural Israel without conditions but since they rejected their King they could not come into their kingdom. This gave time for the Gentiles to be grafted into the new covenant promise by God's grace.

1) there is a difference between the promises of the Old Testament to the descendants of natural Israel and those who have already been born into the new covenant by faith.

- what differences?

2) God will once again deal with the descendants of natural Israel to fulfill the literal promises in scripture directed to them.

- what literal promises?

3) The new covenant actually was given to natural Israel without conditions but since they rejected their King they could not come into their kingdom.

- but....now you're saying He DID give them the New Covenant.

- "they" rejected their King? who did? all of them? then who gave us the Apostolic doctrine we live by?

- does that mean He is not King?

- could not? or some would not?

4) This gave time for the Gentiles to be grafted into the new covenant promise by God's grace.

- time?

- what does TIME have to do with it?

i'd like to see the answer to this ridiculous notion.

......

Brad, how does what you are posting fit with what you believe? or have you adjusted that idea? (honest question):

you said this was NOT TRUE:

"The new covenant actually was given to natural Israel without conditions"

 

[zone]

PART 2 Which theology is correct?

I believe that dispensational theology is generally correct,

although I do not believe that all points in classic dispensational theology are correct.

For example: I do not believe only those since Pentecost are the bride of Christ.

I think all sons of Abraham that are saved by faith and trust in God are in the commonwealth of Israel and the olive tree and they are part of the body and bride of Christ.

I think Romans, Galatians, Hebrews and other books of the New Testament make it quite clear that those before Pentecost drank from the same spiritual rock - which is Christ. (1Co 10:4)

okay...this person does not appear to hold the same extreme views you have expressed in the recent past.
so i dont know if you can address my issues with his writing.


1) I think all sons of Abraham that are saved by faith and trust in God....

- all sons of Abraham...does that mean his natural sons - Ishmael too....God is a pretty general term here.
- does that mean people practicing Judaism who say they are Abrahams sons and believe in God also
- because they both reject Jesus. so they are not saved.

paul said:

Galatians 3
If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

1) I think all sons of Abraham that are saved by faith and trust in God are in the commonwealth of Israel and the olive tree and they are part of the body and bride of Christ.

k...this isnt what you believe....and it still leaves the door open for the Faithful Old Testament Wineskin Jews saved without New Wine hypothesis (Dual Covenant).

2) I think Romans, Galatians, Hebrews and other books of the New Testament make it quite clear that those before Pentecost drank from the same spiritual rock - which is Christ. (1Co 10:4)

- well then...i dont get the Israel church distinction. if the Jewish-Christians-Israelite NT authors said some of their ancestors were saints and belonged to (and stayed in - werent cut off) the commonwealth of Israel and the olive tree.....whats the issue here.

 

[zone]

No. Because Peter is telling us not to be impatient, A 1000 days is like a day. He is not telling us to interpret prophesy this way.

well we agree
so Peters passage does not create a one-day-equals-one-thousand-years principle.

John is telling us literal events which will take place in the future (which means it did not start with the death of Christ) but after many events happen.

right. he is.
but he is using symbolic language to do it.
throughout.

agree

he actually goes back to the birth of Christ (and through OT imagery even further back in some places)...ex: Ezekiel.

lol. Many OT prophesies were this way. It was prophesied that Judah would be overrun by Babylon and the city and temple would be destroyed. It literally happened.

yes...thats right.
does God use any symbolic language in those prophecies...well...ya.
we could post them and compare.

Prophesy is prophesy God says A will happen in B years. We can rest assured, these things will literally take place. If they do not. God can not prophesy, All we can do is say God guesses, and makes his prophesies come true by forcing the fulfiment to fit his plan.

but He doesnt always say the exact number of years.

even when he does we dont appear to believe Him.

Gabriel told Daniel 490 years....70 weeks.
but we dont believe Him.
we allegorized that to mean 2490 years and counting....cuz we needed a gap.
so when we assert He meant an unknown period of time and NOT 490 years....we are really saying He doesnt always mean what He says.

its nuts.

2 Chronicles 24
19Yet He sent prophets to them to bring them back to the LORD; though they testified against them, they would not listen. 20Then the Spirit of God came on Zechariah the son of Jehoiada the priest; and he stood above the people and said to them, "Thus God has said, 'Why do you transgress the commandments of the LORD and do not prosper? Because you have forsaken the LORD, He has also forsaken you.'" 21So they conspired against him and at the command of the king they stoned him to death in the court of the house of the LORD.

Luke 11
50so that the blood of all the prophets, shed since the foundation of the world, may be charged against this generation, 51from the blood of Abel to the blood of Zechariah, who was killed between the altar and the house of God; yes, I tell you, it shall be charged against this generation.' 52"Woe to you lawyers! For you have taken away the key of knowledge; you yourselves did not enter, and you hindered those who were entering."

and here we take one prophecy we know was fulfilled....and Jesus mentions it...and lays the charge (of the death and harm to ALL THE PROPHETS - Abel included apparently) at the feet of that very generation He was grappling with....and we allegorize it to mean a Mystical Apostate World Political Church thing in our day or yet future to us.

No. I KNOW revelation uses symbolic imagery to describe literal events. It is the NT version of daniel. who also used the same type of imagery.

well in one way...but Daniels prophecies are finished...his prophecies were literally fulfilled (not in his lifetime...but in the lifetime of Jesus through to the end of National Israel and the Old Covenant)

John picked up where Daniel left off.

Remember, The first beast represented babylon. Yet as we are told. More literally, the first beast represented Nebuchadnezzar. Revelation uses the same symbology to represent literal events and people.

right....well...the first king was that head of Gold...that kingdom.

Revelation picks up during Christ`s lifetime...the beasts of Daniel are alluded to but very little....with the exception of the Roman beast...which is the beast in place....on which the Harlot (Jerusalem) was seated.

she was Mystery Babylon the Great Harlot.

lol.. No, your trying to add things into it. And in doing so mocking it. In your own type of interpretation. Nebachednezzar was a head of a statue, who was made of Gold.

um....i know.

that was the kingdom Daniel was in captivity under.
the captives were freed from Babylon.

Dan 2:
[SUP]38 [/SUP]and wherever the children of men dwell, or the beasts of the field and the birds of the heaven, He has given them into your hand, and has made you ruler over them all—you are this head of gold.


No more than Nebachadnezzar was a literal head of Gold

okay....so we know symbolic imagery is used to represent real things.
now we just have to determine what those real things are and were.

the Iron beast that breaketh everything and trampled everybody was Imperial Rome...right.
which is when Jesus was born.

The day of the lord is not the end of the 1000 years. Thus your twist and explanation makes no sense.

well....how do the 1,000 years end then.

Do you have any other bright ideas?

maybe

By the way, Do you know who the Bronze part of the statue in Nebachadnezzar's dream represented? Was he actually literally part of the statue?

hehehe...no, not literally.
you mean brass....bronze: whatever.

that was Greece - namely Alexander the Great

wasnt it

he is said to be a goat with horns and stuff too...though he was a man.

so we know we have symbols to interpret....its not always easy but it can be done.

 

[Yahshua]

The day of the Lord is not supposed to be unknown to his people. But the problem is set times have been changed in fulfillment of Daniel 7:25. And I feel this is the reason why we are so out of sorts when it comes to God's prophetic timing. For instance, a new year isn't supposed to begin when the previous year ends (like it does with our current calendar).

----

God declared that the first of the year was when the 1st sliver of the new moon appeared AFTER the barley crop was ripe for harvesting...so if the people reached the end of the 12th month and the barley crop was not yet ripe, they used to tack on another month (a 13th month) to that existing year. In other words, new years were determined by God, not by man. We followed God's timing.

Also for special days like The Day of Trumpets (which was on the 1st day of the 7th month), the people would have to wait until they saw the 1st sliver of the new moon in the sky, which was always within a 48hr window after the previous month ended. So even new months were determined by God also, not by man; not when the previous month ended.

Heck, we currently have months Sept, Oct, Nov & Dec as the 9th, 10th, 11th, & 12th months even though their names actually prove they were originally the 7th, 8th, 9th, & 10th months. We've got some serious synchronization problems.

And if every clock and watch and calendar is in error how can we ever be on time for any of God's important appointments?

Amos 3:7

Surely the Sovereign LORD does nothing without revealing his plan to his servants the prophets.

1 Thessalonians 5:4

But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief.

 

[Yahshua]

well we agree
so Peters passage does not create a one-day-equals-one-thousand-years principle.
[...]

If it can be proven in scripture that this IS in fact a principle, would you reconsider your position on 1000-year reign?

 

[RuthHannah]

1) there is a difference between the promises of the Old Testament to the descendants of natural Israel and those who have already been born into the new covenant by faith.

- what differences?

2) God will once again deal with the descendants of natural Israel to fulfill the literal promises in scripture directed to them.

- what literal promises?

3) The new covenant actually was given to natural Israel without conditions but since they rejected their King they could not come into their kingdom.

- but....now you're saying He DID give them the New Covenant.

- "they" rejected their King? who did? all of them? then who gave us the Apostolic doctrine we live by?

- does that mean He is not King?

- could not? or some would not?

4) This gave time for the Gentiles to be grafted into the new covenant promise by God's grace.

- time?

- what does TIME have to do with it?

i'd like to see the answer to this ridiculous notion.

......

Brad, how does what you are posting fit with what you believe? or have you adjusted that idea? (honest question):

you said this was NOT TRUE:

"The new covenant actually was given to natural Israel without conditions"

How old is this earth ?

 

[zone]

The day of the Lord is not supposed to be unknown to his people. But the problem is set times have been changed in fulfillment of Daniel 7:25. And I feel this is the reason why we are so out of sorts when it comes to God's prophetic timing. For instance, a new year isn't supposed to begin when the previous year ends (like it does with our current calendar).

----

God declared that the first of the year was when the 1st sliver of the new moon appeared AFTER the barley crop was ripe for harvesting...so if the people reached the end of the 12th month and the barley crop was not yet ripe, they used to tack on another month (a 13th month) to that existing year. In other words, new years were determined by God, not by man. We followed God's timing.

Also for special days like The Day of Trumpets (which was on the 1st day of the 7th month), the people would have to wait until they saw the 1st sliver of the new moon in the sky, which was always within a 48hr window after the previous month ended. So even new months were determined by God also, not by man; not when the previous month ended.

Heck, we currently have months Sept, Oct, Nov & Dec as the 9th, 10th, 11th, & 12th months even though their names actually prove they were originally the 7th, 8th, 9th, & 10th months. We've got some serious synchronization problems.

And if every clock and watch and calendar is in error how can we ever be on time for any of God's important appointments?

Amos 3:7


1 Thessalonians 5:4

okay.....cool thx.
but i'm certain the Lord knows about that.
He told us

 

[zone]

If it can be proven in scripture that this IS in fact a principle, would you reconsider your position on 1000-year reign?

If it can be proven in scripture that this IS in fact a principle - i would want to see how you see it as actually used in the thousand years of Rev 20.

interested

quick question:

does this mean you hold to millennialism/futurism?
either way i'm listenin'....

 

[zone]

The day of the Lord is not supposed to be unknown to his people. But the problem is set times have been changed in fulfillment of Daniel 7:25.

'nother quick question - just so i can get a read on where you may be coming from.

when do you believe Daniel 7 was fulfilled?

 

[Yahshua]

If it can be proven in scripture that this IS in fact a principle - i would want to see how you see it as actually used in the thousand years of Rev 20.

interested

quick question:

does this mean you hold to millennialism/furturism?
either way i'm listenin'....

Hmmm....My "ism" isn't, I don't think lol (though I wouldn't know how preterism and futurism are completely defined).

I'm a "currentlyism"'???

And I believe Daniel 7:25 was fulfill the moment our modern Calendar was adopted.

...where would that place me in the 'isms'?

 

[zone]

Hmmm....My "ism" isn't, I don't think lol (though I wouldn't know how preterism and futurism are completely defined).

I'm a "currentlyism"'???

okay....n.m.
we'll just go ahead

And I believe Daniel 7:25 was fulfill the moment our modern Calendar was adopted.

and when was that?
who did it?

who thought to change laws and times (per Dan.)?

...where would that place me in the 'isms'?

don't know yet.

doesn't matter.

everybody says they ain't got no isms (but dey do).
mkay....going out for a lovely dinner this eve...so if our discussion is interrupted until tomorrow,
Lord willing, i'll be here.

same time, same Bat station.
z

 

[Yahshua]

okay....n.m.
we'll just go ahead



and when was that?
who did it?

who thought to change laws and times (per Dan.)?



don't know yet.

doesn't matter.

everybody says they ain't got no isms (but dey do).
mkay....going out for a lovely dinner this eve...so if our discussion is interrupted until tomorrow,
Lord willing, i'll be here.

same time, same Bat station.
z

Ok. [nana-nana-nana-nana..]

----

Principle: "To God, 1000 of man's years = 1 day"

Proof 1.

Genesis 2:16-17

16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, “You may surely eat of every tree of the garden, 17 but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.”

So we know Adam did in fact sin, AND did in fact die...but he died after living 930 years...so did Adam die in the day he ate of the forbidden fruit?

From man's perspective, no. But from God's perspective, indeed he did else God wouldn't have been truthful, right?

Many speak about a spiritual death, and I don't deny that, but Adam also in fact physically died "in the day" (i.e. within the 1000 years) of his life. If Adam lived 70 more years we wouldn't have this proof, but there it is.

Would you agree?

[This is only one witness, so I'd need to provide another to show this principle is true]

 

[zone]

Ok. [nana-nana-nana-nana..]

----

Principle: "To God, 1000 of man's years = 1 day"

Proof 1.

Genesis 2:16-17


So we know Adam did in fact sin, AND did in fact die...but he died after living 930 years...so did Adam die in the day he ate of the forbidden fruit?

From man's perspective, no. But from God's perspective, indeed he did else God wouldn't have been truthful, right?

Many speak about a spiritual death, and I don't deny that, but Adam also in fact physically died "in the day" (i.e. within the 1000 years) of his life. If Adam lived 70 more years we wouldn't have this proof, but there it is.

Would you agree?

[This is only one witness, so I'd need to provide another to show this principle is true]

sorry...i got distracted looking at supermen....um..i mean uh - looking for my favorite super Batman chara.....tsk...


...

yes the death of Adam is interesting, but certainly doesn't establish any principle.
there are so many places the Lord says: in that day; in the day; on that day; that day I; and so on....it should be easy to see if he meant a thousand years.

or, like the psalmists using a thousand this and thats.
k....more witnesses would be good.

particularly concerning the thousand years of Rev 20 - need to see that.
sooner or later.

 

[cfultz3]

what is the Millennium for...?

Hi Zone,

I was reading this question and would like to give what I thought while I was reading.......

What is the purpose of the Millennium?

And here is what I was thinking:

In the beginning, God "lord" over the world (orderly arrangement (governance)).

Then men were given that authority of rule.

Then Satan, who is the principality of the air, has been given his chance (when he was thrown out of Heaven).
.
.
.

My questionings are my personal conclusion and not aimed at finding fault:

If these three had/has authority, why wouldn't Christ be given that same opportunity to present His rule, if He is the One who shall return us to the lost Paradise (before the fall)?

If it is said that God will set His Kingdom here upon Earth, then will not the victorious King, who will have blood upon His rope from the Winepress, have to come and cleanse the Earth of the rebellion and that unholy thing before God will set His throne upon it?

If Christ presents Himself without giving an opportunity for the world to choose Him as their King, then wouldn't those subjects consider Him no better than a dictator who forced His rule against their WILL?

--Chris