Are you RIGHTEOUS?
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I NEVER said now that we have chosen Jesus, let's just do nothing for His Kingdom. Typical straw man argument. Doing something for His Kingdom (good works) is what believers are saved FOR and NOT BY (Ephesians 2:8-10). You seem to have this backwards.
Genuine believers love Jesus and will keep His commandments. Keeping His commandments is not forced or legalistic for genuine believers. 1 John 4:7 - Beloved, let us love one another, for love is of God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God. 8 He who does not love does not know God, for God is love.
1 John 2:3 - By this we know that we have come to know Him (demonstrative evidence), if we keep His commandments. 1 John 5:3 - For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. BTY the Greek word for "keep" is "tereo" which means to keep, to guard, to watch over, preserve. It doesn't mean sinless, perfect obedience to all of Christ's commandments 100% of the time. We are not sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, absolutely perfect, 100% of the time.
Genuine believers do keep His commandments, which is the demonstrative evidence that they truly know Him. 1 John 2:4 - The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. That sounds rather serious. There are many deceived people who will be in for the shock of their lives at the judgment (Matthew 7:22-23).
Hi Fran, one of the reasons I began this thread is to discuss with other believers where we believe our righteousness comes from. There is a knee jerk reaction from many believers when discussing Jesus and His grace and the free gift. We humans can't comprehend grace and so we have made up all kinds of names to go along with grace so as to "manage" it and make sure in our humaness we don't allow grace to manage us. But that is exactly what we are called to do when we look to Jesus. Grace is to teach us how to deny ungodliness and worldly lusts....how to live soberly, righteously and Godly in this present age. This verse has been shared many times here but it needs to be seriously considered by all of us.
The knee jerk reaction is to say like you did here that advocates like me of this amazing grace are saying we never want to DO anything., THINK anything or grow up to BE anything. That it is our desire to take Jesus for all we can and sit around like bratty lazy dysfunctional kids watching tv and eating chips all day never growing up and getting a job or desiring to leave the stage of childhood. That like those dysfunctional young adults., we want to use and abuse our parent with no mutual affection.
When in fact that is not what is being said. The truth of the matter is we have already been made the righteousness of God IN Christ when we first believed and the Holy Spirit came in at the moment of salvation. We were then "sealed in" And that is a good thing., not a bad thing. We were born again into the family and have that seed in us of or Father. And sort of like a healthy young adult who has a parent who loves them unconditionally we have a security in that love and a deep desire to go out and be all we can be and contribute and be a giving and contributing member of society. That kind of young adult seeks to do those things and even is excited and finds a wonderment in growing up.
Their first car., their first job their relationships all stem from a healthy love relationship with their parents who support and encourage them every step of the way. But Jesus is so much more than that to us believers. But many have yet to realize this because of their fear of stepping out in the freedom from the law and into the gift of right standing Jesus gave freely since He Himself paid for all our sins and even our ability to see the truth. He gave us His Holy Spirit to teach and guide us into all truth. We have all that we need to grow up in Him. And we do it by faith and not by works. We do it in the obedience of faith. Faith that trusts Jesus ability to first make us righteous in Him and 2nd to walk in that right standing we were given by the exact same grace that He gave at the time we got saved.
Unmerited favor and love causes us to be spiritually healthy. It's the unconditional love of God that constrains us and motivates us in this life. We have the Holy Spirit pointing to Jesus at all times and Jesus righteousness given to us. Not our own righteousness. I hope you will read some of the posts previously written by many here and discuss the meaning of grace and truth that Jesus brought us. What His gift means for us today and why we are righteous IN Christ and 100% accepted in the beloved.
P.S. The reason I write so much is I'm a fast typist and I looooove to share this stuff. It's my joy because it has changed my life as a Christian woman. I do go on and I'm sorry for that. The JOY of the Lord is our strength.
LOL
How much you wanna bet you don't type faster than me??
I like you and are a person I feel I'll be able to speak to.
Lata... No time now.
I already explained it to you in post #79. It's not about earning God's forgiveness through works of forgiveness.
Typical straw man argument sprinkled with irony.
Unlike you, I harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching the proper conclusion on doctrine. BTY those who believe they live a sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, absolute perfect life 100% of the time (exactly as Jesus lived) are suffering from a terminal case of self righteousness (1 John 1:8-10).
This is exactly my feeling when I already answered the question and the one who disagrees never read the post but is disagreeing with something I never said. No one who believes in the security of the believer has ever said here that we desire to sin and will continue in sin so that the grace of God should abound in our lives. shhhheeesssshhhh Grace and truth never lead to sin but the opposite. It's the carnal man who refuses to look at the grace of God in light of truth. Grace and truth go together. God's grace is not like man's grace. Men change their minds and allow circumstances to change the truth into a lie.
I'm not much of a betting woman but there's a strong possibility that I type faster than you lol. Actually., when I type here at times it's even therapeutic because I type myself happy just like when I journal. Putting the truths learned into words has always been helpful to me. It's just an added blessing to be able to share them in a forum where they may be read and shared with others and then others comment and share what they have learned too. A win/win situation.
what or how did history change, to get 2017, did opinion change at the same time. some quote scripture from the bible, yet miss that the usa was not discovered till around 1610 ad. that would be after the bible going to print.
21 I do not nullify the grace of God, for if righteousness were through the law, then Christ died for no purpose Galatians 2
how do you get righteous , through law. would be the bigger question, needing answered.etc
21 I do not nullify the grace of God, for if righteousness were through the law, then Christ died for no purpose Galatians 2
how do you get righteous , through law. would be the bigger question, needing answered.etc
Your post is a little confusing to me. Can you explain a bit more for my understanding? Thank you royalscot.
This is exactly my feeling about those who continually wish to believe they cannot
walk righteously, so denying the victory of the cross.
How can one know the love of Christ, that God will do anything and everything to
enable us to walk as He did, and then go to extremes to condemn, rebuke, chastise
the very people who are saying, walk in the Spirit for here is the victory, healing and
victory.
How can you actually discern the different people?
Read the sermon on the mount. Does it bring joy to your soul or condemnation?
If joy you know you are walking in the Spirit, if condemnation, you still have sin
issues you need to deal with.
What are the gifts of the Spirit?
Joy, patience, endurance, faithfulness, perseverance, self control.
Now with all this over time it will start to make sense as you apply the principles to
your heart, life will flow, if you let Jesus's words abide with you, day and night.
God says this
If you abide in me, and my words abide in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you.
John 15:7
Abiding, listening, learning, following, learning this is the way.
How is it that people are blind, deaf and dumb?
But then if the root is rotten what hope for the fruit.
The sky is blue.
My goodness - the garbage that is being said. Who in the world says that those in Christ do not or cannot walk in righteousness.
This is why the sky is blue.
Believers in Christ say the complete opposite of this nonsense. There is something drastically wrong in Denmark as the saying goes.
The gifts of the Spirit are these:
1 Corinthians 12:4-11 (KJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.
[SUP]6 [/SUP] And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
[SUP]7 [/SUP] But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
[SUP]9 [/SUP] To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
[SUP]10 [/SUP] To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
[SUP]11 [/SUP] But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
This is why the sky is blue.
Believers in Christ say the complete opposite of this nonsense. There is something drastically wrong in Denmark as the saying goes.
The gifts of the Spirit are these:
1 Corinthians 12:4-11 (KJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.
[SUP]6 [/SUP] And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
[SUP]7 [/SUP] But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
[SUP]9 [/SUP] To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
[SUP]10 [/SUP] To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
[SUP]11 [/SUP] But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
Let us make a clear distinction in language.
Walking righteously, in love and holiness, is walking with resolved, forgiven confessed and repented sin,
without defilement. This is walking in the Spirit, as a cleansed, pure holy saint before the Lord.
Now troubles may come, and you may sin, in a moment of weakness, which are resolved through
repentance and confession before the Lord. This is called keeping short accounts.
Now some will say even in sin, unrepentant sin, God views you as righteous because of
Christs righteousness. Now this is the covering theology, which is righteous sinful walking.
Linked to this idea, is that sin does not need to be worked through or confessed and resolved
independently. Sin in their mind is an amorphous lump of behaviour with punishment linked
to it that has just been removed. But this ignores someone who has a problem with sexual
desires, is not different from someone with self worth issues that lead to greed and power lust,
or someone who has gluttony, and cannot keep from feeding themselves and indulging in every
self indulgent pleasure.
So I do not know who truly holds to which position which they hold to, but rather want
to encourage people to believe they can know true victory and walking in it, after confessing
all their known sins and working them through.
Now slanderers and false teachers will claim no one believes this or that, but in fact almost
every variety you can imagine has some followers, even flat earthers.
Now anti-legalists like all ex-converts see the obsession in everything, and so think the world
is totally polarised around it. Please treat them with kid gloves, it is not their fault they are
still obsessed, but negatively as it probably took 40+ years of their life which they now
disown. I would be a bit upset if I had wasted so much time, but maybe it suggests my judgement
was totally off, so unless I have a radical change, it could just be another version of the same
thing, duh, ironic lol
You will always tell them by their animosity about righteous walking and their desire to continually
claim they alone know sin is forgiven and forgotten even as you commit it.
What is totally deceptive is the language sounds christian, but is just dismissive of the basics
of obedience to Christ and victory through the cross in daily life, because they never find true
cleansing and purity in their hearts. They will claim they are pure, while in the flesh still sinners.
So it is all junk, just depends on which half they are talking about. lol
Walking righteously, in love and holiness, is walking with resolved, forgiven confessed and repented sin,
without defilement. This is walking in the Spirit, as a cleansed, pure holy saint before the Lord.
Now troubles may come, and you may sin, in a moment of weakness, which are resolved through
repentance and confession before the Lord. This is called keeping short accounts.
Now some will say even in sin, unrepentant sin, God views you as righteous because of
Christs righteousness. Now this is the covering theology, which is righteous sinful walking.
Linked to this idea, is that sin does not need to be worked through or confessed and resolved
independently. Sin in their mind is an amorphous lump of behaviour with punishment linked
to it that has just been removed. But this ignores someone who has a problem with sexual
desires, is not different from someone with self worth issues that lead to greed and power lust,
or someone who has gluttony, and cannot keep from feeding themselves and indulging in every
self indulgent pleasure.
So I do not know who truly holds to which position which they hold to, but rather want
to encourage people to believe they can know true victory and walking in it, after confessing
all their known sins and working them through.
Now slanderers and false teachers will claim no one believes this or that, but in fact almost
every variety you can imagine has some followers, even flat earthers.
Now anti-legalists like all ex-converts see the obsession in everything, and so think the world
is totally polarised around it. Please treat them with kid gloves, it is not their fault they are
still obsessed, but negatively as it probably took 40+ years of their life which they now
disown. I would be a bit upset if I had wasted so much time, but maybe it suggests my judgement
was totally off, so unless I have a radical change, it could just be another version of the same
thing, duh, ironic lol
You will always tell them by their animosity about righteous walking and their desire to continually
claim they alone know sin is forgiven and forgotten even as you commit it.
What is totally deceptive is the language sounds christian, but is just dismissive of the basics
of obedience to Christ and victory through the cross in daily life, because they never find true
cleansing and purity in their hearts. They will claim they are pure, while in the flesh still sinners.
So it is all junk, just depends on which half they are talking about. lol
![4199675334_66c3e3d61d_z[1].jpg](https://christianchat.com/data/attachments/71/71889-50990c0bf5bb02aa3cd66f1f7828e6a9.jpg?hash=UJkMC_W7Aq "4199675334_66c3e3d61d_z[1].jpg")
And laugh
But then being self important and so wise is always open to mockery, because it suffers from
arrogance, superiority and condescension.
You know when this has taken place when the emotional message is stronger than the factual
one.
But what actually counts is the factual one, which in this case is walking in love and righteousness,
which some deny Christ can bring us into with their doctrine of total inability.
Three Arguments Against Total Depravity
But then being self important and so wise is always open to mockery, because it suffers from
arrogance, superiority and condescension.
You know when this has taken place when the emotional message is stronger than the factual
one.
But what actually counts is the factual one, which in this case is walking in love and righteousness,
which some deny Christ can bring us into with their doctrine of total inability.
Three Arguments Against Total Depravity
And laugh
But then being self important and so wise is always open to mockery, because it suffers from
arrogance, superiority and condescension.
You know when this has taken place when the emotional message is stronger than the factual
one.
But what actually counts is the factual one, which in this case is walking in love and righteousness,
which some deny Christ can bring us into with their doctrine of total inability.
Three Arguments Against Total Depravity
Peter, please start your own thread and then post all the pics you want over and over about the topic of your choice.
I am sorry. It was not me who started the head holding pictures and the sky is blue
ideas.
I learnt a good way to deal with miss-behaving children is to respond in kind to show
it is pointless using these techniques, because that is all they are, they prove nothing.