Well, it's not something i encounter regularly. So when I hear about an animal talking I'm bound to be dubious about it lol
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Well, it's not something i encounter regularly. So when I hear about an animal talking I'm bound to be dubious about it lol
M
megaman125
Guest
OK. Parameters first.
1. Let's say there are 2000 species of Beetle. Did only 2 beetles go on the ark to represent everyone? Or did 2 from each species go on.
2. Local flood? Or worldwide?
1. Let's say there are 2000 species of Beetle. Did only 2 beetles go on the ark to represent everyone? Or did 2 from each species go on.
2. Local flood? Or worldwide?
M
megaman125
Guest
1. The Bible doesn't claim 2 of each species went on the ark. Heck, I would argue that not all of the species we have today existed 5000 years ago. I'm not sure how many kinds of bettle were around in Noah's time, but he took 2 of each kind.
2. Genesis 7:19-20 would indicate a global flood. Jesus also talks about the flood in Noah's time as global when Jesus is talking about the future global judgment God will bring upon the earth. Also, it doesn't make much sense to have waters that are higher than the mountains, but not have water on the other side of the mountains, like this silly picture shows.
Ok. How did the penguins and polar bears get from their natural habits to the ark.. And back again?
D
danschance
Guest
M
megaman125
Guest
No, I don't think I can. We can take the modern scientific definition of the word kind, but that doesn't mean that's how the author of Genesis was using it. We could look up the Hebrew for the word kind, and maybe get some insight, but if that doesn't work, I don't think there's a way we could really know what the author meant by the word kind unless we were there ourselves.
What we can do is talk about the dimensions of the ark and how much space there was for the animal. Given the dimmensions in the Bible, the experts have estimated there was space for 16,000 animals on the ark. I also read some excerpts from a book all about Noah's ark being plausable, which discusses every question you could think of. The had some numbers for how many animals they had, and specifically how many reptiles, how many birds, and how many mammals. I'll see if I can find that book again if you're interested.
Well, the animals got there because God sent them there. As for how they got back after the flood, I'm really not sure about the penguins and polar bears. In the book I was referencing above, it talked about the animals that got to north/south America and Astralia after the flood. To give a brief answer, the animals could have been taken there when people went there. The penguins and polar bears does seem like a more interesting question, and one I'd like to investigate more (and here I was thinking I had answered all of my Noah's ark questions already). While it's true those animals wouldn't last long in the climate of the middle east, I would hypothesize that immediately after the flood, the climate was no where near back to normal yet, giving the animals ample time to migrate themselves back to their normal habitats, but that's just a guess at this point. I wonder if that book I've been refernsing discusses that?
M
megaman125
Guest
Ah, I found that book I was talking about. It's called Noah's Ark: A Feasability Study by John Woodmorappe.
Only 16,000? How long ago was this supposed to happen again? I am very interested in what that book says. Even with Cambrian explosion rates of evolution, that doesn't give enough time to diversify if I am going by the literal biblical interpretation.
edit: opened the page a long time ago and didn't refresh, I will look up the book later.
Does it also factor in parasites? Diseases etc? The 16000 animals and the people on board must have been riddled with diseases and parasites just so they could be sustained too. Very unhealthy place to be lol
M
megaman125
Guest
The Bible is not restricted by however many millions of years man says evolution takes. Take a look at hybrid dogs, like a chow-shelty mix. All you have to do is get one chow and one shelty, and boom, microevolution right there in one generation. It doesn't take that long at all.
Well, there were far less diseases back then as opposed to everything we have today. Just take a look at some of the things that weren't really around 300 years ago or so, like cancer, AIDS, various new strains of flu affecting humans, SARS, etc.
Cleanliness is definetly a concern though, and I have seen models that give practical ways the ark was designed to take deal with things like animal feces.
What about Egypt? They have a written history that precedes, is co-existent with, and which continues uninterruptedly after the time of the Flood, yet somehow they were unaware of that catastrophic global event. The same is true for the Chinese and other cultures. How did a global Flood somehow ignore them, leaving their societies intact?
V
voiceoftheshires
Guest
Saying that, that's probably why there are MORE diseases now. Everyone is too clean now and everything is sterile etc. You can even buy one disinfectant where you don't even have to touch the dirty bottle! It sense your hand is there and dispenses the liquid! Outrageous.
No one can build up immunities to anything anymore. When I was a kid I'd be filthy. Squishing worms in the mud with my hands then running straight into the house for a sandwich!
M
megaman125
Guest
Every other ancient culture starts their year 0 as being the year after the flood. What's more interesting is relgions over in china had similar flood accounts, but I suppose that was just due to them having the internet and copying the stories from the middle east.
M
megaman125
Guest
Exactly. Plus we're actually using our technology to build up viruses and bacteria that have resistances to our medications.
Err, I never really played in the mud as a kid.
G
godistheway
Guest
god loves everyone. I think as long as you are a good person you will be in heaven. Muslim, Buddhist, agnostic, atheist, christian. it doesnt matter as long as you have good morals and want to help others grow as good people and help the world.
Do you know how much genetic diversity exists between different groups of salmon? You wouldn't be able to get that from to individuals no matter how different they were given the biblical time frame. Especially with the averaging out of phenotypes that tend to occur over generations regarding complex traits. If you want an example of what a bottleneck event like this would look like you should look at the dangers cheetahs have because there population became very small around the end of the last ice age (10,000 years ago). The amount of genetic diversity in populations of other animals are enormous and when you compare them to other population and subspecies it gets far more enormous.
Last edited:
D
danschance
Guest
I consider atheism more of an adolescent pipe dream but "make believe for adults" works fine too.