Becoming a Man

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Willie-T

Banned
Feb 7, 2015
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Here is a bit more from John Eldridge in his book Wild At Heart: (It's OK... I'm ready for your reaction. Fire away.)
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Now you’re out there God knows where
You’re one of the walking wounded.
—JAN KRIST
“Walking Wounded”
by Jan Krist and Paul Murphy

To give a man back his heart is the hardest mission on earth.
—FROM THE MOVIE MICHAEL

Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight.
—BRUCE COCKBURN
“Lovers in a Dangerous Time”
(written in 1982 for Stealing Fire)​

A few years ago now my middle son, Blaine, made the big transition to first grade. That’s a huge step for any child—leaving the comfort and safety of Mom’s side, spending all day at school, being among the “big kids.” But Blaine’s a very outgoing and winsome boy, a born leader, and we knew he’d handle it swimmingly. Every night at the dinner table he regaled us with tales of the day’s adventures. It was fun to recall with him the joys of those early school days—a shiny new lunchbox, brand-new yellow No. 2 pencils, a box of Crayolas with a built-in sharpener, a new desk, and new friends. We heard all about his new teacher, gym class, what they played at recess, how he was emerging as a leader in all the games. But then one night he was silent. “What’s wrong, Tiger?” I asked. He wouldn’t say, wouldn’t even look up. “What happened?” He didn’t want to talk about it. Finally, the story came out—a bully. Some first-grade poser had pushed him down on the playground in front of all his friends. Tears were streaming down his cheeks as he told us the story.

“Blaine, look at me.” He raised his tearful eyes slowly, reluctantly. There was shame written all over his face. “I want you to listen very closely to what I am about to say. The next time that bully pushes you down, here is what I want you to do—are you listening, Blaine?” He nodded, his big wet eyes fixed on mine. “I want you to get up... and I want you to hit him... as hard as you possibly can.” A look of embarrassed delight came over Blaine’s face. Then he smiled.

Good Lord—why did I give him such advice? And why was he delighted with it? Why are some of you delighted with it, while others are appalled?

Yes, I know that Jesus told us to turn the other cheek. But we have really misused that verse. You cannot teach a boy to use his strength by stripping him of it. Jesus was able to retaliate, believe me. But he chose not to. And yet we suggest that a boy who is mocked, shamed before his fellows, stripped of all power and dignity should stay in that beaten place because Jesus wants him there? You will emasculate him for life. From that point on, all will be passive and fearful. He will grow up never knowing how to stand his ground, never knowing if he is a man indeed. Oh yes, he will be courteous, sweet even, deferential, minding all his manners. It may look moral, it may look like turning the other cheek, but it is merely weakness. You cannot turn a cheek you do not have. Our churches are full of such men.

At that moment, Blaine’s soul was hanging in the balance. Then the fire came back into his eyes and the shame disappeared. But for many, many men their souls still hang in the balance because no one, no one has ever invited them to be dangerous, to know their own strength, to discover that they have what it takes. “I feel there is this stormy ocean within me, and I keep trying to make those waters calm and placid,” confessed a young friend in his early twenties. “I would love to be dangerous,” he said, sighing. “You mean... it’s possible? I feel like I have to ask permission.” Why on earth would a young man have to ask permission to be a man? Because the assault continues long after the wound has been given. I don’t mean to create a wrong impression—a man is not wounded once, but many, many times in the course of his life. Nearly every blow ends up falling in the same place: against his strength. Life takes it away, one vertebra at a time, until in the end he has no spine at all.
 
Here is a bit more from John Eldridge in his book Wild At Heart: (It's OK... I'm ready for your reaction. Fire away.)
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The intentional process of emasculating man must stop, but essentially it can only stop when man refuses it to be effective. That's my reaction.
 
The intentional process of emasculating man must stop, but essentially it can only stop when man refuses it to be effective. That's my reaction.

Since this is usually ingrained into males from childhood, how would you see this being done?
 
Good question. I think the best way to undo bad programming is with healthy deprogramming. This means just what the book outlines, there must be confident role models taking active leadership in the lives of youngsters. Otherwise, it can only be accomplished by a man going through trial and error which hopefully leads to some awakening from within.
 
Good question. I think the best way to undo bad programming is with healthy deprogramming. This means just what the book outlines, there must be confident role models taking active leadership in the lives of youngsters. Otherwise, it can only be accomplished by a man going through trial and error which hopefully leads to some awakening from within.

Sounds hopefully effective to me.

(I take it you've read the book?)
 
Sounds hopefully effective to me.

(I take it you've read the book?)

I pulled it off my shelf, started it long ago but was side tracked. When I saw your post, I had an unction to pick it back up.
 
I pulled it off my shelf, started it long ago but was side tracked. When I saw your post, I had an unction to pick it back up.

That's what I'm doing too. This will be the third time I have read it, but the last time was almost five years ago.
 
To fight back or not this is a common issue among the body of Christ. Jesus aid to turn the other cheek but we also understand it isn't always an option. I think the matter comes down to why you are fighting, if it's only for yourself or to prove your strong or simply out of anger then i would say turn the other cheek but if you are fighting to protect to stand up for the ones who cannot then I say do as God leads you.

I cannot say for certain if it's right or wrong to fight but I can say that I think the motive and reason for it is a major factor, sometimes a true man is one who has the strength to fight but doesn't especially for himself. If I ever were to fight it could never be for or about myself, but if it's to protect and to stand for those who cannot then I would.

Being strong enough to fight or even being able to fight does not make a man, anyone can fight anyone can do the manly thing but what truly makes a man? What does it mean to be a man? Not by earthly means you know the alpha ape hair on your chest kind of thing but what makes a true man inside?

For me I have seen many manly men but cannot call them a true man
 
All true statements. Jesus also took a whip and had "fellowship" with the money changers taking advantage of the temple and people of God. The term "being a man" is not exclusive to taking up a fight when it's time to. But I know what you are saying and it's true, there are always two sides to the machismo gene, those men who over compensate are the ones who are insecure and feel the need to go over the top.
 
I wonder what every man here thinks a real man is? I mean honestly what makes a real man? what does it mean and take to be a true man and more importantly what would God say a real man is?

For that matter what is a true Christian? what does it mean and take to be a true Christian and who would God say a true Christian is not to mention are these two things one and the same?
 
To fight back or not this is a common issue among the body of Christ. Jesus aid to turn the other cheek but we also understand it isn't always an option. I think the matter comes down to why you are fighting, if it's only for yourself or to prove your strong or simply out of anger then i would say turn the other cheek but if you are fighting to protect to stand up for the ones who cannot then I say do as God leads you.

I cannot say for certain if it's right or wrong to fight but I can say that I think the motive and reason for it is a major factor, sometimes a true man is one who has the strength to fight but doesn't especially for himself. If I ever were to fight it could never be for or about myself, but if it's to protect and to stand for those who cannot then I would.

Being strong enough to fight or even being able to fight does not make a man, anyone can fight anyone can do the manly thing but what truly makes a man? What does it mean to be a man? Not by earthly means you know the alpha ape hair on your chest kind of thing but what makes a true man inside?

For me I have seen many manly men but cannot call them a true man

Many times I would ask the question of why they are turning the other cheek. More often than not, it may be fear that leads boys to do that these days. I used to teach judo, and I have always been of the opinion that you cannot, in all honesty with yourself, choose NOT to fight unless you also already are confident that you are actually able to fight.
 
Well, Jesus was a man and He was/is perfect. That would be our only ambition as a man. Yeah, I'm not so encouraged by that statement....Lol.
 
I wonder what every man here thinks a real man is? I mean honestly what makes a real man? what does it mean and take to be a true man and more importantly what would God say a real man is?

That's a question I'd really like answered too.
 
Interesting topic. Nothing I can add to it since I already know I am not a man and am perfectly content being seen as weak among other males, but I'll be curious to follow this discussion.
 
Interesting topic. Nothing I can add to it since I already know I am not a man and am perfectly content being seen as weak among other males, but I'll be curious to follow this discussion.

You are actually the most powerful man in your own esoteric and specific realm of existence.
 
I wonder what every man here thinks a real man is? I mean honestly what makes a real man? what does it mean and take to be a true man and more importantly what would God say a real man is?

For that matter what is a true Christian? what does it mean and take to be a true Christian and who would God say a true Christian is not to mention are these two things one and the same?

That's a question I'd really like answered too.

I think the answers to all that would be, a man is a male who is Spiritually connected with, listens to, and is dependent upon God.
 
I think the answers to all that would be, a man is a male who is Spiritually connected with, listens to, and is dependent upon God.

I think I'd agree with that.
It'd be difficult not to. But it is one of those concepts that is easier to say that it is to really grasp while letting go of
of the "programming" in our heads.
 
I think I'd agree with that.
It'd be difficult not to. But it is one of those concepts that is easier to say that it is to really grasp while letting go of
of the "programming" in our heads.

Bingo!

Programming. That's what it boils down to. Most all of us are programmed in one way or another, to different degrees, to believe certain things or to somehow desire things even if those beliefs and desires are not truly innate in us. Society decides what it means to be a "man", like it tells women what it means to be a "real woman". In this world you have 2 choices - either get on board with the programming and spend a lifetime chasing after a goal that keeps moving, or buck the system and be cast as an outsider because you upset the status quo.
 
I think I'd agree with that.
It'd be difficult not to. But it is one of those concepts that is easier to say that it is to really grasp while letting go of
of the "programming" in our heads.
It truly does keep getting a little easier, each time you realize you have actually done it.