Bible Artwork Question

rev_GOH · Jul 12, 2022

All,

I was recently contacted by a summer school art student seeking guidance. His class was studying the 1800's artist William Blake and his artwork that illustrated books of the bible. The art student said his assignment included Blake's series of paintings entitled "The Great Red Dragon." (Wiki has a decent write up and images for each of the paintings via this link.; I've also pasted thumbnails of them below.) The student said that after seeing these paintings, researching the associated biblical references, and finding other incredible videos/animations of them, he now feels like his faith is being challenged.

He confessed that he was having trouble sleeping at night with these images etched into his mind. He told me that he had never envisioned such overwhelming powerful depictions of Satan and what Satan could do -- and was having a hard time reconciling this with his faith. I tried to explain the spiritual meaning behind them to him the best that I could so he could strengthen his worship.

I was wondering if others have been equally moved by seeing these and/or other images/videos/animations of them.

rev_GOH

Polar · Jul 12, 2022

Since you asked and as a one time Fine Arts student:

I don't think anyone needs to look at them and I don't think you needed to post them either. I don't think they are Holy Spirit inspired at all . Frankly, if I were a mod, I would delete them. But that could just be me. Or not.

Do we really need these dark and basically evil renderings as part of an art course? How are these paintings illustrating the Bible? Seems they are illustrating hell.

Thanks for asking.

rev_GOH · Jul 12, 2022

Hi,

It took me a while to track down each painting's references to the bible. All 4 come from the book of revelations.

#1: Rev 12:3-6
#2: Rev 12:3-4
#3: Rev 13:1-8
#4: Rev 13:11-17

FYI
rev_GOH

oyster67 · Jul 12, 2022

rev_GOH said:

????????????

Satan is real and walks to and frow. This should spur us on and sober us up to the point where we take life more seriously. If we don't serve the Lord, then we place ourselves under the service of Satan.

1 Peter 5:8

“Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:”

Gideon300 · Jul 12, 2022

rev_GOH said:

When the devil is finally exposed for what he is, he will be proven to be the ultimate loser, totally defeated by Lord Jesus and ignominiously tossed into the lake of fire. It's exactly what he deserves. We need not fear him at all. With the armour of God, we have complete protection. We have the living Word of God, the Sword of the Spirit that Satan cannot withstand. So equipped, Satan needs protection from us! Pictures can't hurt anyone. Resist the devil and he will flee.

Jocund · Jul 13, 2022

rev_GOH said:

The first painting was featured in the horror film Red Dragon where the mentally unstable antagonist felt that the painting was telling him to do evil things. The antagonist eventually eats the painting in an attempt to free himself from the urges that he felt were coming from the painting.

Clearly there are some film makers that found these paintings "moving" enough to create content on them.

These kind of cultural depictions usually tie in with the theme that despite salvation in Christ, to respect the power that evil has to inflict damage. Even those saved in Christ are shown in pain by the events of old earth:

"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Rev 21:4 KJV

The paintings can basically be looked at as a solemn reminder that the world still brings pain, even if we are eventually alleviated of that pain.

Runningman · Jul 13, 2022

Polar said:

These paintings are subjective. There’s nothing inherently dark or evil about them.

If they are accurate depictions of Biblical scenes and the Bible is written by inspiration of the Holy Spirit then wouldn’t that make these paintings Holy Spirit inspired too? You just said they aren’t Holy Spirit inspired. Your discernment seems a bit questionable at best.

Runningman · Jul 13, 2022

rev_GOH said:

Personally I don’t see anything wrong the paintings. I think art can effect people in different ways, though, so we should be sensitive to that if someone complains it’s effecting them negatively. Certainly concerning that he reports they seem to have shaken his faith.

It seems like it was only a matter of time that he would have looked at something and had his faith shaken if he is so sensitive. His faith seems to be quite fragile. So right now I think he needs encouragement and support to help him. You can cherry pick some of the positive and inspiring Bible verses and we can pray for him.

phil36 · Jul 13, 2022

Artwork is artwork. However, art is powerful..

I would say that the work of Blake or his works don't sound very Christian to me. He sounds very much like a troubled soul. Here is an excerpt about some of blakes thing in his unfinished work.

“This emphasis on free sexuality occurs in The Marriage of Heaven and Hell, Visions of the Daughters of Albion, and Blake's designs based on the Book of Enoch. Blake's beliefs emphasised the need for sexual openness in relationships and the lack of jealousy. In Vala, the idea of jealousy is a central theme and one of the bases for the story........

..... In particular, Blake's God/Man union is broken down into the bodily components of Urizen (head), Urthona (loins), Luvah (heart), and Tharmas (unity of the body) with paired Emanations being Ahania (wisdom, from the head), Enitharmon (what can't be attained in nature, from the loins), Vala (nature, from the heart), and Enion (earth mother, from the separation of unity).[9] As connected to Blake's understanding of the divine, the Zoas are the God the Father (Tharmas, sense), the Son of God (Luvah, love), the Holy Ghost (Urthona, imagination), and Satan who was originally of the divine substance (Urizen, reason) and their Emanations represent Sexual Urges (Enion), Nature (Vala), Inspiration (Enitharmon), and Pleasure (Ahania).

Quoted from Vala, or The Four Zoas - Wikipedia
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vala,_or_The_Four_Zoas..

So does the OP have an agenda or has he a real concern🤔.

There is nothing in blakes work that would or should make a Christian fear or doubt if we know that our lives are hidden in Christ, it is God who dwells in us - we are united to Christ and seated with Him in the heavenly places. Set your minds on the things above, that is Christ. For Satan has no gold or power over you. The young student In the OP needs to learn this.. Focus on Christ.. Set your mind on Christ on things from above.

Since, then, you have been raised with Christ, set your hearts on things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. 2 Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things. 3 For you died, and your life is now hidden with Christ in God. 4 When Christ, who is your life, appears, then you also will appear with him in glory. Col 3:1-4

For he raised us from the dead along with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms because we are united with Christ Jesus. Eph 2:6

Put on the armour of God EPH 6:10-18

and remember -

For the Lord your God is he who goes with you to fight for you against your enemies, to give you the victory.’. Deut 20:4.

I have said these things to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation. But take heart; I have overcome the world. John 16:33

Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of his might. EPH 6:10

A-Sword-Cometh · Jul 13, 2022

Magenta · Jul 13, 2022

"Ancient of Days"

"Michael Foretells the Crucifixion"

"Jacobs Ladder"

"Job"

Polar · Jul 13, 2022

rev_GOH said:

No one said the devil is not mentioned. You asked what we thought of the paintings. I think they are demonic.

Evmur · Jul 13, 2022

rev_GOH said:

All,

I was recently contacted by a summer school art student seeking guidance. His class was studying the 1800's artist William Blake and his artwork that illustrated books of the bible. The art student said his assignment included Blake's series of paintings entitled "The Great Red Dragon." (Wiki has a decent write up and images for each of the paintings via this link.; I've also pasted thumbnails of them below.) The student said that after seeing these paintings, researching the associated biblical references, and finding other incredible videos/animations of them, he now feels like his faith is being challenged.

He confessed that he was having trouble sleeping at night with these images etched into his mind. He told me that he had never envisioned such overwhelming powerful depictions of Satan and what Satan could do -- and was having a hard time reconciling this with his faith. I tried to explain the spiritual meaning behind them to him the best that I could so he could strengthen his worship.

I was wondering if others have been equally moved by seeing these and/or other images/videos/animations of them.

rev_GOH

William Blake was certainly a man of disturbed mind ... I would avoid. I would claim the blood of Christ to cover me.

Polar · Jul 13, 2022

A-Sword-Cometh said:

I actually find this one far less bothersome that those by Blake. It is simple and yet clearly depicts the defeat of the devil.

Anyway, I doubt the devil posed for any of the paintings.

Polar · Jul 13, 2022

Gideon300 said:

Tell that to a sensitive child or for that matter the art student. People can be very bothered by images like those in question. Fine for an adult or a mature Christian to dismiss them, but if you read the op, they can indeed damage a person. I have no problem just dismissing them, but I think they were inspired by what they represent.

No one has to agree with me, but that is how I see what is going on here. For that matter, I don't think any of us would just go 'oh that's just the devil' if we did actually or were able to actually see him as the evil incarnate that he is.

Polar · Jul 13, 2022

Evmur said:

If you ever watch a docu or read about how the devil was feared (much induced by Catholicism) you might understand how such paintings could come to be. Much of the fear was superstition; we have the witch hunts in Salem and all sorts of incantations, symbols painted on the interior of many centuries old churches to act as something to ward off evil and so on.

Many of these types of paintings play on these fears, rather than uplift the victory of Christ. We also have the very well known paintings of Hieronymus Bosch and his depictions of hell. Even so, I find those less disturbing than the ones in question.

Lucy-Pevensie · Jul 13, 2022

It's art, no need to see it as reality. You either like it or you don't. I never liked Picasso or Dali.
I'm surprised any student today would be frightened by them judging by the films, television & music of today's culture.

awelight · Jul 13, 2022

rev_GOH said:

I would say that I feel the same way about these as I do any art work about Biblical characters or things. I hate them all! Whether they are of some ones idea of Satan or a rendering of Jesus Christ or God. Whether they are in the church or in the Bible or on public display.

Exo_20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee a graven image, nor any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:

The_Watchers_2017 · Jul 13, 2022

rev_GOH said:

All,

I was recently contacted by a summer school art student seeking guidance. His class was studying the 1800's artist William Blake and his artwork that illustrated books of the bible. The art student said his assignment included Blake's series of paintings entitled "The Great Red Dragon." (Wiki has a decent write up and images for each of the paintings via this link.; I've also pasted thumbnails of them below.) The student said that after seeing these paintings, researching the associated biblical references, and finding other incredible videos/animations of them, he now feels like his faith is being challenged.

He confessed that he was having trouble sleeping at night with these images etched into his mind. He told me that he had never envisioned such overwhelming powerful depictions of Satan and what Satan could do -- and was having a hard time reconciling this with his faith. I tried to explain the spiritual meaning behind them to him the best that I could so he could strengthen his worship.

I was wondering if others have been equally moved by seeing these and/or other images/videos/animations of them.

rev_GOH

ahh yes, these are part of the 100 paintings Blake was commissioned to do in reference to the entire Bible (Genesis - Revelation). actually he did not do too bad of a job by using the descriptions we read within the Bible. i really doubt he would have done these on his own merit had he not been paid to do them. definitely interesting for sure.

montana123 · Jul 13, 2022

rev_GOH said:

Satan is referred to as a dragon in Revelation but Jesus is still greater than him and the saints have nothing to fear.

I not believe Satan actually looks like a dragon but is referred to as a dragon because of his terrible demeanor.

The Bible calls Satan a serpent so does he look like a dragon or a serpent and he is like a roaring lion walking to and fro through the earth looking for whom he can devour so does he look like a lion.

The Bible says Michael and his angels fought the dragon and his angels and the dragon and his angels lost so they cannot even defeat the good angels so they have no chance against God.

Satan is only a fallen angel and has no power against a saint of God and the Bible says resist the devil and he will flee from you.

People should not look at Satan as being anything great which he is not all that great in power but he can deceive which is his greatness.

And Satan cannot read minds either for he does not have the receiving ability to do that like a person cannot read radio and television and phone waves for they do not have the receiving ability to do that.

Any reference to Satan in the Bible describes his character and not how he looks which he looks like the good angels but he is evil which maybe he is darker in color compared to the good angels who would be a spirit of light.

I do not think he changed his shape when he rebelled but his name did change from Lucifer to Satan to identify his new character.

Bible Artwork Question

New member

Polar

Guest

New member

Senior Member

Well-known member

Banned

Banned

Banned

Senior Member

Banned

Senior Member

Polar

Guest

Well-known member

Polar

Guest

Polar

Guest

Polar

Guest

Senior Member

Well-known member

Banned

Well-known member