Bill Nye Debates Ken Ham - HD

[PennEd]

I don't understand your reply. You ask if it would be difficult to argue that God made an old looking earth. I say that an old looking earth contains a lot of death and sin. This seems very odd, for God to create a world that looks very sinful, when it is actually not. You say you're talking about:














But I'm responding to:



To me, it seemed like a genuine question. I may have misunderstood and you weren't asking a genuine question.

At the risk of offending, (not my intention), I can only explain it to you, unfortunately I can't comprehend it for you.

 

[danschance]

If something can harm or expose itself to you in "reality" that implies that it has a real body, vocal abilities and more. This would then be a measurable event by even something as basic as a cell phone camera. Since more and more technology is getting into the hands of people everyday its not long before someone films one right? I mean a real good clear obvious recorded event. Where does this demon get his food? Does it sleep? Did it speak english? Did it have an 8th grade education from a US public school?

I am not trying to be "smart" but these are all points that directly effect reality. For a "ghost" to be able to push something, speak or show it self it would require a real body and real parts, namely a brain.

This is some of the things we experienced.
1) A strong unwavering sense of being watched from a specific location.
a) At night I was able to sense being watched from a specif point in my room.
b) One of my daughters came to me and told me she felt being watched everytime she removed her clothing. I questioned her and told her not to mention this to anyone.
c) I waited till the whole family was together and simply asked if anyone had felt being watched. My son said yes and identified the same exact location within a foot of where I felt it.

2) We saw apparitions
a) My son also described seeing our dog Kona, a rotwieler, who we had put down months ago.
b) My son also described being touched by a dark ghost on his arm which caused a numbing sensation.
c) I saw a dark shape , what I assumed to be my oldest son walk into my bedroom and walk into the master bathroom. I was on the computer at the time and realized he made no sound as he walked. I immediatly went to the master bathroom and no one was there.

3) Other things we experienced.
a) My wife laid down in my daughter's bed who had recently moved out. My wife then described a strong sense of my daughter being in the room with her.
b) I experienced strange dreams of a dark smoky man shape.
c) I heard a goat like voice say the name "Baphomet, Baphomet, Baphomet".

I experienced more but at this point no longer feel it wise to go on. You can make whatever deductions about this but I know what all happened. I was there. I can't prove any of it besides my family saying the same things or similar things.

 

[danschance]

I believe you. And btw, you don't have to answer anyone who doesn't believe. It's a waste of time and pretty ignorant of them to say something isn't real when they clearly haven't FELT or experienced it for themselves. I've been attacked by a demon, and felt God multiple times. But I'm probably just crazy or making it up. *rollig eyes* God Bless, and you don't have to prove anything to anyone. You know the Truth.

You may be right. No one can change a closed mind except God.

 

[danschance]

I didn't appreciate Nye intensely staring at Ham when Ham was responding to questions whereas Ham stepped back from his podium to give Nye 'space' when it was Nye's turn to respond. It nerved me but my wife told me to chill.

Yes you could see Nye glaring at him. Nye seemed to have some hatred for his opponent. Others caught that as well.

 

[danschance]

Millions of people deal with mental illness, I know a few people that suffer from it and you can be extremely intelligent and down to earth and still have problems. It's best to seek treatment for such issues.

Well, if this is in reference to my earlier claim then you are making a huge leap in the murky unknown. You are obviously not educated in mental health. It is against the law and is unethical for a psychologist to diagnose mental illness with out seeing the client, yet you are making such claim. There is no mental illness especially of a psychotic nature in my family.

It is just further proof you are a troll.

 

[Tr]

I'm not the one seeing "ghosts"...

 

[Angela53510]

Here is an good blog on the debate.

Talking Past One Another – The Ham/Nye Debate

 

[megaman125]

I didnt say God didn't create the earth or life. But i dont think the earth is only 6-10 thousand years old either.

Oh, sorry. I just see you on this forum bashing creationism all the time, so you didn't come off as a person that believed God created.

 

[Tr]

One thing this forum is missing is an area near your avatar displaying your beliefs. Everyone varies so much it's ridiculous. You have young earth creationists older creationist and everything in between it just doesn't seem right everybody has to go around defending their way of belief or explaining it at every turn.

I have seen a ton of everyone's posts and I can't keep track. Angela what are you again?

 

[Missachu]

I grew up with Bill and I've always been "the science girl" but I am extremely disappointed that a man that plays with chemicals and has a front seat to all the small irrelevant miracles in nature doesn't believe in a God!

 

[Angela53510]

One thing this forum is missing is an area near your avatar displaying your beliefs. Everyone varies so much it's ridiculous. You have young earth creationists older creationist and everything in between it just doesn't seem right everybody has to go around defending their way of belief or explaining it at every turn.

I have seen a ton of everyone's posts and I can't keep track. Angela what are you again?

I am semi young earth. Not 6000 years. In the Hebrew genealogies, father, sometimes meant grandfather, and sometimes generations were missed. You can't just add up all the years in the genealogies and come to an answer like Bishop Ussher did, which was 4004 BC.

So I would say, up to 10,000 years ago. But I do not believe in God creating the jumps in evolution, theistic evolution, because I do not believe the fossil record supports jumps, but rather kinds producing after kinds.

And just in case anyone wonders, my undergrad degree is in physical geography from a secular university. I had some creation profs even there, and we had some good talks, and I learned a lot. Science may seem dominated by evolutionists, but God is at work even in secular institutions, teaching kids some alternate forms of origins, like creation.

 

[38miles]

Yes you could see Nye glaring at him. Nye seemed to have some hatred for his opponent. Others caught that as well.

Absolutely. I couldn't help but wonder if Nye was angry about Ham's "science" or if there is some disdain from Christianity in general. He definitely looked like he was personally offended, including making a number of snide remarks that were also condescending. Saying things like "Ham's followers" and "Ham's model"--he was spear-heading the accusation of false teaching.

In my drive into work this morning I was in prayer and reflecting…"What would happen if you got a hold of Bill Nye?" I asked. Matt 19:26…bring it on!

 

[Tr]

Thanks Angela for getting back to me. The other day I was looking in our families old set of encyclopedia britannica set and found it said the age of the earth was over 4billion years. I looked it up because someone had said to me that the number was always changing but it sure wasn't far off from today's number. I doubt it will change much in my lifetime either.

These facts are pretty substantiated and accurate. Like bill said science is predictable especially in multi billion dollar business. As a farmer we buy GMO seed, that seed was developed in a lab by Monsanto and they use evolution everyday. They can splice a fish gene into a strawberry to make it frost resistant.

The gas in your car comes from at least at one point. A giant oil rig off the coast of Texas or somewhere, BP and other oil companies spend millions possibly billions of dollars on technology equipment and research where to find this they know the age of where they are going to drill why they are drilling there and what to expect because of the age of the earth and they know what they're going to find based on scientific proof. They know how long it takes to make oil. The next time you gas up your car think abou that gas being millions of years old because it's the truth.

 

[Angela53510]

Tr, I'm just wondering who created GMO's? Were they the product of evolution, or prior intelligence inputing data?

It's really hard to get into GMO's. I think they are the worst thing happening in the world right now. I am sorry to hear you have been sucked in by agribusiness into using them on your farm.

I actually just did a partial post on this on another thread. The food we are eating is garbage, and I will not eat anything GMO. Fortunately, I am able to grow my own veggies, and I buy GMO free fruit in the next province and can and freeze them. I have eliminated soy, corn, sugar beets and a bunch more foods because of the threat of GMO's.

I am sick enough as it is, without ingesting insect genes in my corn, or fish in my strawberries, or some kind of gene in my fish. Talk about a genetic nightmare!

If you do believe in evolution, then how can you believe that man can tamper with genes that took "millions" of years for us to adjust to and for our bodies to learn to digest?

As a creationist, I think tampering with God's creation in this crass manner, and damaging the very building blocks of plants and animals is a travesty against God.

Once we can get GMO's labeled here in Canada and the US, I think you are going to find the demand dropping off very sharply for these products.

Sorry, no Frankenfood for this organic woman!

As far as gas and oil, I live in Alberta, sort of a little Texas. I see the Christmas trees and pumps going as I ride my bike around the farm land near me in summer. I was raised on understanding oil and gas, and I do not agree with the conclusions about how oil and gas were formed. Just because you understand geological formations, and where to find oil and gas, doesn't mean it was created millions of years ago!

 

[Tr]

Well a GMO is just something that has added genes, even the organic corn you eat is not a simple grass it has been made sweet, made with higher yield and changed in many ways just through breeding instead of artificial genetic modification. Not much difference really... Just because a strawberry has a fish gene does not mean its unsafe. I'm more against things like antibiotics in meat and ethylene gas ripened tomatoes etc

as to the gas and oil it most certainly is millions of years old! Proof is in your gas tank! You know the evidence you just done believe it that's fine but it's also dangerous. Dangerous in that if your child was to get into that field and thought everything he was learning was BS he wouldn't get a job and people wouldn't have gas.

GMO feeds the world, without it we would have a hard time.

 

[crossnote]

Just think in less than 100 years we will all know which side is right...except if the evolutionists are correct then we will know nothing.

 

[Tr]

Just think in less than 100 years we will all know which side is right...except if the evolutionists are correct then we will know nothing.

Again you are a Debbie downer, technology is the only future for mankind, without it billions of people wouldn't be here today.

 

[megaman125]

Well a GMO is just something that has added genes, even the organic corn you eat is not a simple grass it has been made sweet, made with higher yield and changed in many ways just through breeding instead of artificial genetic modification. Not much difference really... Just because a strawberry has a fish gene does not mean its unsafe. I'm more against things like antibiotics in meat and ethylene gas ripened tomatoes etc

as to the gas and oil it most certainly is millions of years old! Proof is in your gas tank! You know the evidence you just done believe it that's fine but it's also dangerous. Dangerous in that if your child was to get into that field and thought everything he was learning was BS he wouldn't get a job and people wouldn't have gas.

GMO feeds the world, without it we would have a hard time.

You have not presented any evidence that gas is millions of years old. The only thing you presented is, "We know gas is millions of years old because that's what we believe. As proof gas is millions of years old, look at the gas tank in your car. Gasoline in your car is proof the gas is millions of years old."

There is no logic or reasoning behind your claims of gas and oil being millions of years old. The only "proof" you've presented is assuming that it's millions of years old. Assuming the conclusion to prove the conclusion is nothing more than a logical fallacy.

 

[crossnote]

Again you are a Debbie downer, technology is the only future for mankind, without it billions of people wouldn't be here today.

Downer? I said we will know which side is right.

 

[IntoTheVoid]

Since you asked, I will tell you but it is against my better judgement.

I became harrased by a demon. During this time my house became haunted and my family also experienced the same or similar things that I had. At this point you are probably thinking I am crazy or delusional. I am neither. My education and work experience in engineering has caused my to think very logically. Once I came to the conclusion that demons are real I knew only God could help me and I went to a catholic priest for help. I have been a Christian for the past five years and the demon and haunted phenomena have all stopped.

Since I have become a Christian God has become incredibly real to me. My evidence is anecdotal but anecdotal evidence is not necessarily false.

To be honest it would take somehing of that magnitude for me to start believing too.