Can the nonelect ever be born-again? (2 Kings 22:27) With the elect thou wilt be elect: and with the perverse thou wilt be perverted.

[John146]

Eve had to be with Adam in order to seduce him into rebelling against God. That is obvious but you placed Satan at the scene when the Bible doesn't. The text says Eve seduced him and not Satan and Eve. Satan is not as stupid as might think He is, why would He blow His cover and lose Adam. He wanted to have both under His dominion and control.

So please stop adding your word to Gods Word, to support your false narrative. Let God speak for Himself, He doesn't need your help

Even did not "seduce" Adam. He knew very well what he was doing. The text does not say nor indicate that Adam was seduced. He chose to eat of the fruit knowing full well of the consequences. Why? He was being a type of Christ. Adam sinned to be with his bride. Christ would become sin to be with his bride.

 

[John146]

And I don't see in that sentence where the kind of time elapsed between her eating the fruit and Adam eating for him not to be there the entire time. It plainly states Eve picked the fruit, ate, gave to Adam/the husband who is with her, he ate.

My thought would be, if Adam was right beside Eve, he would have stopped the deception. The serpent knew what he was doing in deceiving the woman.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

My thought would be, if Adam was right beside Eve, he would have stopped the deception. The serpent knew what he was doing in deceiving the woman.

Possibly. But my thought is if Adam was going to sin then he could have been there the whole time and let it happen. I think he had been thinking of eating that fruit since God commanded him not to. We both know that it was going to happen no matter what so the Plan of needing Jesus' Death would be needed. The Plan for us to be saved by Christ was a decision made before God began creation. So Adam had to sin eventually for Ephesians 1:4 even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world to be into play.

 

[Mem]

I'd like to think that Adam was virtuous, and laid down his life for his bride but, God wouldn't have missed that motivation in his heart. "No greater love... than one that lays down his life for his brother....". However, Jesus 'took sin upon Himself' while remaining sinless. And since Adam 'was not deceived' which, apparently according to some argument, 'the sin' relative to Eve, although I view her sin coming from a cause of deception rather than the effect... If Adam did sin but was not deceived, was his sin in taking death upon himself? As this would suggest that God commanded Adam, "Do not die."

Was Adam's sin suicide?

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

God gave Adam a lot of responsibility. He worked the Garden, he named all living things, he was head over the marriage, he had dominion over everything.

Reminds you of the story of Satan. God made Him most beautiful, he had great responsibility, he was given a throne close to God, the other angels gave him honor, he walked through the fiery stones, he had power and prestige.

 

[Stan_the_Man]

It just depends on which interpretation you chose to run with. There are too many conflicting interpretations to list here

Rejecting scripture - It's what calvinists do

I reject your private opinion, that you go by the Bible.

What calvinists reject is meaningless because they are wrong all day long

Adam was with her in the garden, but not standing right next to her, hearing the conversation with the serpent.

That's speculation.

God's Word says he was right there with her so he knew what happened and he knew eatiung the fruit with her was wrong and decided to do it anyway.

 

[Stan_the_Man]

My thought would be, if Adam was right beside Eve, he would have stopped the deception. The serpent knew what he was doing in deceiving the woman.

Even if he wasn't, Adam KNEW that eating of the tree was wrong and he did it anyway.

 

[CS1]

He did not. In his own writings he celebrated putting out the hit on Michael Servetus

Those that repent are sorry for what they did and regret doing it.

Calvin celebrated having people murdered because he thought it was pleasing to the Lord.

It was pleasing to his lord, the devil whom he served.

oh, I'm not familiar with that.

 

[CS1]

But there would be no blood of Jesus, without first having the elect to shed His blood for. You had the order back to front

I disagree

The word of God says in REV 13:8 and 1pet 1:18-20 Jesus was planned before.


"All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world."


1 Peter 1:18-20 For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life handed down to you from your forefathers, 19 but with the precious blood of Christ, a lamb without blemish or defect. 20 He was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake.

 

[John146]

Even if he wasn't, Adam KNEW that eating of the tree was wrong and he did it anyway.

Yes, but his choosing to eat the fruit was in type, like Christ. Adam knew that Eve was going to be put out of the garden. It is not good for man to be alone. Adam and Eve were one flesh. Adam had a decision to make...eat the fruit and sin to be with his wife or be alone. Christ had a decision to make...become sin for us to be with his wife or be without his bride, because all have sinned.

 

[Stan_the_Man]

Yes, but his choosing to eat the fruit was in type, like Christ. Adam knew that Eve was going to be put out of the garden. It is not good for man to be alone. Adam and Eve were one flesh. Adam had a decision to make...eat the fruit and sin to be with his wife or be alone. Christ had a decision to make...become sin for us to be with his wife or be without his bride, because all have sinned.

In other words Adam was thinking of himself and was being selfish when he decided to go ahead and sin against God.

To Adam Eve was more important that God and came before God which is the sin of idolatry

Adam choose to sin!

 

[John146]

In other words Adam was thinking of himself and was being selfish when he decided to go ahead and sin against God.

To Adam Eve was more important that God and came before God which is the sin of idolatry

Adam choose to sin!

Just the opposite...Adam was thinking about being with his bride. Christ was not being selfish to die on the cross to be with his bride, was he? Adam gave up his sinlessness to be with Eve. He gave up his home to be with Eve. He gave up his dominion to be with Eve. Adam would live in a dark, fallen world out of his love for his bride. Don't you see the picture? This is not selfish, but love.

 

[Stan_the_Man]

Adam was thinking about being with his bride

Correct. Adam loved Eve more than he did the Lord which is the sin of idolatry

You don't think there is something wrong with loving something more than the Lord?

Can't see anything wrong with that???

 

[John146]

Correct. Adam loved Eve more than he did the Lord which is the sin of idolatry

You don't think there is something wrong with loving something more than the Lord?

Can't see anything wrong with that???

It's gone right over your head. Nevermind...

 

[Stan_the_Man]

It's gone right over your head. Nevermind...

Yeah, I don't celebrate idolatry

 

[Inquisitor]

It's a fact; the non-elect will never be born-again.

How can you recognize a Christian?

 

[Inquisitor]

All those who are born again were once non-elect. So, of course.

11¶Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
12That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
13But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

That's exactly the narration of the letter to the Romans. Why the Jews were grafted out and why the Gentiles were grafted in.

People attempt to personalize the letter to the Romans. Saying that God is talking about individual election.

That is incorrect.

 

[Inquisitor]

It's a fact; the non-elect will never be born-again.

How would a Calvinist know that they are one of the elect?

 

[John146]

Yeah, I don't celebrate idolatry

Was Jesus becoming sins for us idolatry? Jesus dying to be with his bride?

 

[Stan_the_Man]

How would a Calvinist know that they are one of the elect?

Ha ha, exactly!

They like to go around barking at others about how they are "elect" and others are not.

Calvinism reaches that some people just think they are elect but in the end they are not.

So calvinism and islam have this in common - they never know if they are saved or not until they die.

Was Jesus becoming sins for us idolatry? Jesus dying to be with his bride?

Dude, you are confused.