Like I said...you need a refresher course on covenants. I knew better to engage with you. When you can't answer questions or sway someone to your way of thinking, you always resort to insults.
Grace and peace.
Can We Really Exercise Free Will?
- Thread starter LifelongLearner
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Grace and peace.
reneweddaybyday said:
I know what I'm talking about
Romans 9:9-12
9 For this is the word of promise, At this time will I come, and Sara shall have a son.
10 And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;
11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth; )
12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
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I know what I'm talking about
lol ... says the one who has to rip Romans 9:12 from Scripture because he desperately wants Scripture to say God hates people before they are born.
What is clear is that you believe God hates people before they are born
He does
if what you allege is true, then you and rogerg need to provide Scripture other than Romans 9 to support your assertion because Romans 9:12 does not support your claim.
Romans 9:9-12
9 For this is the word of promise, At this time will I come, and Sara shall have a son.
10 And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;
11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth; )
12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
.
in my dealings with rogerg and brightfame52 ... if a verse does not support their erroneous dogma, they just remove it altogether ... then if/when someone calls them out on their shenanigans, they rationalize away their error rather than repent.
shameful workmen ...
.
Jesus clearly states people are called to believe/receive over and over again.
You just make stuff up.
I never denied that Jesus or others didn't call people to believe. Can you show a post where I do so?
What do you suppose someone who is given a new heart and new spirit, and who receive the indwelling Spirit will do?
Yes, in my experience which is now many years of debating the "Reformed" view of soteriology ( ..the special created are regenerated by God prior to exercising faith)
are typically very much like this with the shenanigans and very bad interpretation of those verses they use to support their system.
Shameful indeed.
Yet, I have met a few over the years who did come to the honest handling of scripture, see the light so to speak, leave the system.
My point is belief/faith is first.
It is not a new heart/ability bequeathed by God prior to belief.
>>> only to the specially created for salvation mind you, let us not forget that part.
There is not one clear scripture in the Bible which teaches this.
Carry on we have been through this many times, I will pray for your release from this incorrect non-Biblical soteriology.
Just reading that portion of the discussion, yes I agree.
If I understand the other side of the discussion that is a very strange take.
Thats a fruit of the Spirit, Faith which one believes the Gospel Gal 5:22
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
2 Thess 2:13
13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
Belief here is the same greek word for faith the word noun pistis:
conviction of the truth of anything, belief; in the NT of a conviction or belief respecting man's relationship to God and divine things, generally with the included idea of trust and holy fervour born of faith and joined with it
@brightfame52 (I know I'm going to regret posting this because they will be blind to it, but hope springs eternal I guess)
Not that anything besides Rom 911 is needed because it clearly states God's point of view - and by your saying it doesn't, doesn't make it so, far from it, but does demonstrate your lack of knowledge of the Bible, and I have to say, extremely arrogant of you to believe you can unilaterally discard verses from the Bible that you don't like.
Anyway, read the below, apparently you either didn't read or didn't understand them. They are a restatement and confirmation that Romans 9:11 means exactly what it clearly, and plainly, states. I am not hopeful, however, that you will be able to correctly comprehend them even though they are right in front of you and as clear as they can be, but given that you and @HeIsHere do not correctly comprehend 9:11 & 9:13 that they all go together as God's single doctrine, you probably won't comprehend these either.
[Rom 9:20-24 KJV]
20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed [it], Why hast thou made me thus?
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 [What] if God, willing to shew [his] wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
When the bad tree they are produces good fruit even though Jesus said it was impossible, what need of God have they?
I've given you a verse. See also Acts 2:37. We see the activity of God described in Ezekiel 36:26-27 taking place. These verses are clear as many others are.
You still do not understand what transpired in man due to the fall and why it is necessary for God to act on behalf of an individual to bring them to faith. But as you said, we've been through this many times.
The level of dishonesty they bring to this topic precludes any real discussion. You may as well be talking to a dead person.
You don't save your brown bananas waiting for them to become yellow again?
Good to see you posting again.
Neither do you understand scripture.Nope we can never understand esoterica .....
It is still "through faith"
Saving faith is not a special present from God – that can only be seen if it is assumed and read into the text.
It comes as a response to the Spirit-empowered declaration of the gospel, and it is the chosen absence of that response which condemns the unbelieving sinner (Joh 3:18).
“I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes” (Rom 1:16).
It does not say gifted belief.
The faith which trusts in God for salvation is a human responsibility.... scripture tells us not all have faith, why, because they were not gifted it >>> WRONG, because they did not respond with simple, saving faith.
and that we may be delivered from unreasonable and wicked men; for not all have faith.
2 Thess. 3:2