Contrast of The Mega Church with the Bible Believing Church

[Depleted]

As I read through this discussion, one thing comes to mind. The multitude of believers that will be gathered around the throne of God worshiping him.

We worship in a small congregation, but we always have room for one more. It is a tremendous burden on my heart to see my brothers and sisters in Christ want to limit God's gatherings to a few. I pray that every worship gathering doubles the next time they meet.

You might want to curb that prayer. All I can think of is if we had a group that gathered here, our home is small. Three people besides us, could fit in our livingroom. Four, if someone doesn't mind sitting on the floor, but that spot on the floor blocks access to kitchen and bathroom. If it doubled every week. By the third week, I'd have to ask the neighbors if we could borrow their yards, and, ooo, btw, does anyone have a megaphone so the folks outside can hear what we're saying inside?

 

[Yet]

Bible believing 'church'? Hmmmm! The question remains. Is a 'church' a bible believing 'church' if that 'church' doesn't really believe the bible? I mean is that possible? I know some of you think im a cult because I believe Paul's instructuins for the operation of an assembly of believers.
Now, because I believe in Paul's instructions would that not make me a bible believing christian?

And if some of you don't believe Paul's instructions for the operation of an assembly of believers, would that not disqualify you to put on your marque 'A Bible Believing Church'?

So I submit that there are NO bible believing 'churches', mega, store front, or otherwise unless they believe and act upon Paul's instructions for the operation of an assembly of believers.

They may have the salvation message right on, but the organic, alive, active body fellowship they do NOT.

Thus, A NON-BIBLE BELIEVING CHURCH is what you should put on your marque. I mean honesty is still the best policy....isn't it?

 

[Depleted]

Is that the ONLY place I've "missed it" on that loooong post? wow I must be getting better?? ..

But yet again Lynn, as you have done more often than not with me on these threads on CC ... you misunderstand my writing. God's Word has not changed but the way God has been spreading the Gospel around the world has.

The church and the way we meet and where-why and how has changed. God's Word is the only thing that hasn't changed and He has kept it for us all these years as He promised. These days we are able to access it faster., with more in depth understanding of the history and ways of the times. We are able to be even more blessed by hearing many more men and women of God teaching and preaching than they were able to do years ago. Just like I thought I made clear on the previous post. You seem to consistently find problems with my words.

Is there anything else???

Since you asked, I usually try avoid reading your words because you're too busy preaching the grace-only message, and, in the process, have pretty much told everyone on this site that are disabled we are only disabled because we lack faith.

That wasn't the only spot you said that in your post. That was merely the conclusion of what you were saying before that.

 

[Depleted]

If they had 13 kids, they'd have to stay at home!

If they had 13 kids, they'd BE a church. lol

What happens if a 14th comes along?

 

[Depleted]

Bible believing 'church'? Hmmmm! The question remains. Is a 'church' a bible believing 'church' if that 'church' doesn't really believe the bible? I mean is that possible? I know some of you think im a cult because I believe Paul's instructuins for the operation of an assembly of believers.
Now, because I believe in Paul's instructions would that not make me a bible believing christian?

And if some of you don't believe Paul's instructions for the operation of an assembly of believers, would that not disqualify you to put on your marque 'A Bible Believing Church'?

So I submit that there are NO bible believing 'churches', mega, store front, or otherwise unless they believe and act upon Paul's instructions for the operation of an assembly of believers.

They may have the salvation message right on, but the organic, alive, active body fellowship they do NOT.

Thus, A NON-BIBLE BELIEVING CHURCH is what you should put on your marque. I mean honesty is still the best policy....isn't it?

If it makes you feel any better, I don't think you're a cult. Cults tend to have people in them, not just person.

 

[breno785au]

If they had 13 kids, they'd BE a church. lol

What happens if a 14th comes along?

I have to ask the Lord wisdom on that one because my mind just exploded.

 

[B1Davanda]

If it makes you feel any better, I don't think you're a cult. Cults tend to have people in them, not just person.

I have to ask the Lord wisdom on that one because my mind just exploded.

I went to a Non-Bible-believing church for years.

They called it public school.

Here's some Non-Worship Songs...

[video=youtube;y4syLS3-fdA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4syLS3-fdA&feature=youtube_gdata_player[/video]

 

[MsSuzanna]

Oh, no, no, no! Not that at all. Suzanna and I have an agreement. If she thinks I'm being well... me -- the person that gets mouthy and arrogant on here -- she can call me on it. I asked her for that help. She thought I was being that, but at that moment I really wasn't. (I'm still no lady, so it gets hard to tell who is here -- Dr. Jekyll or Ms. Hyde. lol)

Since I also can't wear a bra, the dress requires a slip, making it too hot in the summer,

This was simply TMI. Who needs to know that kind of info anyways? Just WOW

(I'm still no lady

I have to agree with you Lynn.

 

[NarrowRoadDisciple]

Curious about something MsSuzanna. The bible gives an outline for the church, how it is to be run, requirements for the eldership, etc.

If I recall correctly, a pastor who is called by God has the responsibility to know the spiritual state of his flock. He must know and hear from the Holy Spirit how each sheep in the earthly flock is doing and help to address things going on with them. At what point do we consider a church to be a mega church? Would it therefore be considered a mega church when a pastor or elders cannot tend to the spiritual needs of the sheep? I say this because it's interesting that while Jesus preached to the multitudes, He discipled 12. The early church met from house to house breaking bread daily. These numbers for an intimate local church gathering were probably not in the thousands. Then again, if the infrastructure was put into place with pastors and associate pastors to reach every person and keep in touch, then this may be possible!

 

[Magenta]

Those who accepted his (Peter's) message were baptized, and about
three thousand were added to their number that day. Acts 2:41

Sounds like the first century church was mega!

 

[MsSuzanna]

Those who accepted his (Peter's) message were baptized, and about
three thousand were added to their number that day. Acts 2:41

Sounds like the first century church was mega!

Mega in a totally different way
They didnt have to put a show on. Preaching the gospel of Christ was enough.

 

[MsSuzanna]

Curious about something MsSuzanna. The bible gives an outline for the church, how it is to be run, requirements for the eldership, etc.

If I recall correctly, a pastor who is called by God has the responsibility to know the spiritual state of his flock. He must know and hear from the Holy Spirit how each sheep in the earthly flock is doing and help to address things going on with them. At what point do we consider a church to be a mega church? Would it therefore be considered a mega church when a pastor or elders cannot tend to the spiritual needs of the sheep? I say this because it's interesting that while Jesus preached to the multitudes, He discipled 12. The early church met from house to house breaking bread daily. These numbers for an intimate local church gathering were probably not in the thousands. Then again, if the infrastructure was put into place with pastors and associate pastors to reach every person and keep in touch, then this may be possible!

There are many "markers" that define the mega church of today. The OP was imo pretty informative.

 

[posthuman]

Mega in a totally different way
They didnt have to put a show on. Preaching the gospel of Christ was enough.

you don't consider miraculous signs and wonders "putting on a show" ?
raising the dead? healing the sick? casting out demons? restoring lepers & paralytics? speaking in tongues? voices from heaven?

but colored lights on the other hand . . ?

 

[MsSuzanna]

you don't consider miraculous signs and wonders "putting on a show" ?
raising the dead? healing the sick? casting out demons? restoring lepers & paralytics? speaking in tongues? voices from heaven?

but colored lights on the other hand . . ?

I consider the work of the Father all one need.

 

[posthuman]

Those who accepted his (Peter's) message were baptized, and about
three thousand were added to their number that day. Acts 2:41

Sounds like the first century church was mega!

that's what i thought too. but Suzanna was incredulous yesterday . .

Comparing pentecost to mega church ?
Its never same to assume . I was once in the crowd of the mega church. I do know from whence I speak.
Its never safe to assume. I wont be responding to you anymore. It is pointless.

but she cut me off when i said that
maybe she's softened some now!

Jesus too had thousands of people following Him around. He preached to crowds of 10 or 15,000 ((since the feeding of the 5,000 only counted the men in the crowd)), and was thronged with humanity so much that he couldn't even eat sometimes because the house was so packed. people were literally tearing holes in the roof to get to Him.

Jesus put on a show. He often healed everyone who was brought to Him. He did many miraculous signs.
He was a charismatic speaker - even those sent to assassinate or arrest Him didn't do it because 'He spoke like no other man has ever spoken before."
when He called Saul, He even put on a dazzling light and sound show.

these things are not inherently evil things, IMHO.

 

[Magenta]

Mega in a totally different way
They didnt have to put a show on. Preaching the gospel of Christ was enough.

Matthew 10:8
"Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse the lepers, cast out demons. Freely you received, freely give."

Matthew 10:1
Jesus summoned His twelve disciples and gave them authority over unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal every kind of disease and every kind of sickness.

Mark 3:15
and to have authority to cast out the demons.

Mark 16:17
"These signs will accompany those who have believed: in My name they will cast out demons, they will speak with new tongues;"

Mark 6:13
And they were casting out many demons and were anointing with oil many sick people and healing them.

Acts 8:7
For in the case of many who had unclean spirits, they were coming out of them shouting with a loud voice; and many who had been paralyzed and lame were healed.

Acts 16:18
She continued doing this for many days. But Paul was greatly annoyed, and turned and said to the spirit, "I command you in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her!" And it came out at that very moment.

Acts 19:12
so that handkerchiefs or aprons were even carried from his body to the sick, and the diseases left them and the evil spirits went out.

Matthew 7:22
"Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?'

 

[posthuman]

I consider the work of the Father all one need.

have you considered that maybe the Father is working in some of these churches that He is apparently blessing?
that maybe some of them are actually Bible-believing -- just not following man's traditions?

 

[posthuman]

If I recall correctly, a pastor who is called by God has the responsibility to know the spiritual state of his flock. He must know and hear from the Holy Spirit how each sheep in the earthly flock is doing and help to address things going on with them. At what point do we consider a church to be a mega church? Would it therefore be considered a mega church when a pastor or elders cannot tend to the spiritual needs of the sheep? I say this because it's interesting that while Jesus preached to the multitudes, He discipled 12. The early church met from house to house breaking bread daily. These numbers for an intimate local church gathering were probably not in the thousands. Then again, if the infrastructure was put into place with pastors and associate pastors to reach every person and keep in touch, then this may be possible!

yes! logistical problems, big ones.

Moses too, was trying to govern all of Israel all by himself, without the benefit of a printing press or any kind of tech. hsi father-in-law saw this and was like gee-whiz, Mo -- you gotta delegate some authority.

So Moses listened to the voice of his father-in-law and did all that he had said.
(Exodus 18:24)
​

i went to the ultra-assembly locally here a couple times. not just once, because once isn't enough to make any kind of conclusion, i thought. i wanted to go to small-groups too, giving it a chance -- but my wife talked me out of it. our son wasn't responding to the format at all ((loud noises and crowds really bother him)), and he would probably wind up staying home all the time if we persisted there. at his age, we are done dragging him anywhere he is opposed to being. counter-productive.
but anyway -- this super-duper-synagogue had a system of small-groups set up. lots of 'elders' led smaller groups with prescribed plans of study, under the direction of pastors and associate pastors. they actively encouraged people to get into these more in-depth fellowships, but it was easy enough to just stay lost in the crowd showing up on sundays. all the times i went, no one ever recognized me. i had the impression you could attend for years without making any real connections, if you didn't make the effort yourself. it can be anonymous, but it doesn't have to be; there's a choice people make not to get more involved.

people make that same choice no matter what the size of a church. what's sunday night / wednesday night / bible study attendance like in your congregation compared to sunday morning?

from what i hear, national average is only about 20% of a congregation is in homegroups / small groups / bible study. 70 or 80% of membership rolls is sunday-morning only for the most part. that's hearsay though -- i would really like to see some actual statistical research on that subject.
you get the same trends in gargantua-churches, but it's magnified because of the scale. where a smaller church has 50 or 75 people in it that don't have a firm grounding in the gospel, a big congregation may have thousands of people who are 'spectators only' -- the sheer scale can give us a false impression that it's qualitatively 'different' from your congregation of 100 or so, but statistically it may have very much the same problems.

((how many of Jesus' followers were 'genuine' ?? 20% ?))

 

[MsSuzanna]

Matthew 10:8
"Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse the lepers, cast out demons. Freely you received, freely give."

Matthew 10:1
Jesus summoned His twelve disciples and gave them authority over unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal every kind of disease and every kind of sickness.

Mark 3:15
and to have authority to cast out the demons.

Mark 16:17
"These signs will accompany those who have believed: in My name they will cast out demons, they will speak with new tongues;"

Mark 6:13
And they were casting out many demons and were anointing with oil many sick people and healing them.

Acts 8:7
For in the case of many who had unclean spirits, they were coming out of them shouting with a loud voice; and many who had been paralyzed and lame were healed.

Acts 16:18
She continued doing this for many days. But Paul was greatly annoyed, and turned and said to the spirit, "I command you in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her!" And it came out at that very moment.

Acts 19:12
so that handkerchiefs or aprons were even carried from his body to the sick, and the diseases left them and the evil spirits went out.

Matthew 7:22
"Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?'

And this is relevant how?

 

[MsSuzanna]

have you considered that maybe the Father is working in some of these churches that He is apparently blessing?
that maybe some of them are actually Bible-believing -- just not following man's traditions?

I have considered that in this day and age the preaching of the whole gospel is not heard but most want their ears tickled and that is why MOST churches that are large have the fruit exemplified in the OP.