Destruction

[Grace777x70]

It's interesting to me that in that verse in the op, God says he will destroy them. What does that mean really. Kinda sounds like they get the boot to me if all they come to heavens door with is hay, wood and straw.

I understand where one would think that but we need to look at all other scriptures that talk about the security of the believer. The word "destroy" in the OP means "corrupt".....not in the total annihilation sense and you are banned from heaven forever. Works-based salvationists would take that as God not allowing you in heaven. This is "reading" into the scripture. ( not saying you are doing that here..)

I'm taking that God will destroy = to mean that He will allow corruption to happen to some of these people who have false teachings that are in fact defiling the temple of God which is His body. He would withdraw protection and either chastise them or for in some cases - them dying physically here in this earth.

It is an obscure passage and needs to be interpreted in light of all the other clear scriptures.

Getting to heaven is not based on us - it is based on what Christ has done for us and we have His righteousness - not by doing deeds of righteousness. This is the whole gospel message.

 

[Sirk]

I understand where one would think that but we need to look at all other scriptures that talk about the security of the believer. The word "destroy" in the OP means "corrupt".....not in the total annihilation sense and you are banned from heaven forever. Works-based salvationists would take that as God not allowing you in heaven. This is "reading" into the scripture. ( not saying you are doing that here..)

I'm taking that God will destroy = to mean that He will allow corruption to happen to some of these people who have false teachings that are in fact defiling the temple of God which is His body. He would withdraw protection and either chastise them or for in some cases - them dying physically here in this earth.

It is an obscure passage and needs to be interpreted in light of all the other clear scriptures.

Getting to heaven is not based on us - it is based on what Christ has done for us and we have His righteousness - not by doing deeds of righteousness. This is the whole gospel message.

I get that and thank you for knowing me well enough to know that I am not advocating for works based salvation. There is also this verse pertaining to the servant:

LUKE 12:42-48
“Who then is the faithful and wise manager, whom the master puts in charge of his servants to give them their food allowance at the proper time? (43) It will be good for that servant whom the master finds doing so when he returns. (44) I tell you the truth, he will put him in charge of all his possessions. (45) But suppose the servant says to himself, ‘My master is taking a long time in coming,’ and he then begins to beat the menservants and maidservants and to eat and drink and get drunk. (46) The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the unbelievers.”
(47) “That servant who knows his master’s will and does not get ready or does not do what his master wants will be beaten with many blows. (48) But the one who does not know and does things deserving punishment will be beaten with few blows. From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked.”

 

[Grace777x70]

If any of you thought when I spoke of destroying the temple of God in a physical sense, like thru smoking or whatever I am sorry for the confusion. What I was referring too and speaking of is teachers and pastors. That verse in 1 Corinthians is specifically talking to pastors and teachers. Paul is addressing false teaching and that any pastor or teacher who leads someone astray will be destroyed when they stand before the Almighty. Pretty scary stuff if you hold yourself up as one in my estimation.

I agree with what you said here...except for the part "will be destroyed when they stand before the Almighty"...the true Christian in Christ will not be destroyed when they stand before the Almighty.

They can have corruption happen to them on this earth because of the deeds done in their body ( which would include false teaching ). As Paul talks about in Romans 8

This shows our state while in this earth because of Christ being in us in our new man created in righteousness and holiness which cannot be corrupted nor sin ( 1 John 3:9, 1 John 5:18 )

Romans 8:10 (NASB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.

This scripture is talking about the quality of life we will have while we are on this earth.

Romans 8:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

I understand where one would think that but we need to look at all other scriptures that talk about the security of the believer. The word "destroy" in the OP means "corrupt".....not in the total annihilation sense and you are banned from heaven forever. Works-based salvationists would take that as God not allowing you in heaven. This is "reading" into the scripture. ( not saying you are doing that here..)

The word destroy in the OP is the same word used in 2 Peter 2 to describe the fate of those who will be consigned to outer darkness. That doesn't sound like heaven.

 

[Grace777x70]

I get that and thank you for knowing me well enough to know that I am not advocating for works based salvation. There is also this verse pertaining to the servant:

LUKE 12:42-48
“Who then is the faithful and wise manager, whom the master puts in charge of his servants to give them their food allowance at the proper time? (43) It will be good for that servant whom the master finds doing so when he returns. (44) I tell you the truth, he will put him in charge of all his possessions. (45) But suppose the servant says to himself, ‘My master is taking a long time in coming,’ and he then begins to beat the menservants and maidservants and to eat and drink and get drunk. (46) The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the unbelievers.”
(47) “That servant who knows his master’s will and does not get ready or does not do what his master wants will be beaten with many blows. (48) But the one who does not know and does things deserving punishment will be beaten with few blows. From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked.”

I know where you stand and that you don't believe in works-based salvation..

There is too much to type so I'm leaving this link that describes Luke 12 based on grace and not works-based thinking.

I like to use this site because he tackles obscure scriptures that seem to contradict the abundance of clear scriptures that tell us we are secure in Christ and that salvation for going to be with the Lord is based on Him and not us.

I like the comments at the bottom of the article as people asked questions about this "parable".


The Parable of the Beaten Servants (Luke 12:35-48)


There are only two ways you can respond to Jesus; positively, in faith, or negatively, with unbelief. Consequently, it makes sense to speak, as Jesus did, of people dividing themselves into two groups: sheep and goats, wheat and weeds, good fish and bad fish.
But on a few occasions Jesus spoke of three or even four groups. Think of the parable of the sower where there were four types of soil (Matt. 13). Or the parable of the master who came home to three types of servant in Luke 12. Here they are:

1. The faithful and wise servant (v.42) who makes his master happy and is put in charge of all his property
2. The abusive servant (v.45) who beats others, gets drunk, and is cut into pieces and beaten with many blows
3. The ignorant servant (v.48) who does something but it’s the wrong thing and receives a few blows

Since many Christians identify themselves as servants of the Master, this parable is troubling. What is Jesus saying? That he’s going to beat some of us? That he’s going to cut some of us into pieces?!

The rest of the teaching is here below at this link.

https://escapetoreality.org/2014/07/09/the-parable-of-the-beaten-servants-luke-1235-48/

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

1 Corinthians 6:13-20 "Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.[SUP]14 [/SUP]And God hath both raised up the Lord, and will also raise up us by his own power.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

[SUP]20 [/SUP]For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's."

Is there spiritual adultery and fornication?


James 4:4
Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

1 John 2:16
For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

 

[Utah]

Special snowflakes don't last long in hell.

YOU be careful.

What's the basis of your post?

 

[Grace777x70]

2 Peter 2:14 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children;

This does not describe the believer that is in Christ for a few reasons.

1) Believers in Christ have a new heart and these have a heart trained in greed. ( I will post later about the new heart that God gave us when we believed in Christ )

2) Children of God are not accursed as 2 Peter 2:14 talks about.

1 John 3:2 (NASB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] Beloved, now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we will be. We know that when He appears, we will be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is.

We are in Christ and one with Christ and He is the Beloved.

Colossians 1:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,
We are sealed with the Holy Spirit when we heard the message of Christ and then sealed with the Holy Spirit.

Ephesians 1:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

2 Peter 2:14 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children;

This does not describe the believer that is in Christ for a few reasons.

Riiiiiiiiiiiight...

And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, [as] they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots [they are] and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you; ... These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever. 2 Peter 2:13, 17

These are the ones feasting together without reverence, hidden reefs at your love feasts, caring for themselves, waterless clouds carried away by winds, late autumn trees without fruit, twice dead, uprooted, wild waves of the sea foaming up their own shameful deeds, wandering stars, for whom the deep gloom of darkness has been reserved for eternity. Jude 1:12-13​

 

[ember]

Special snowflakes don't last long in hell.

YOU be careful.

my little noggin was overpowered by the vast choice of pre-made special snowflakes memes

now I gotta go look out the window and calm down

 

[Grace777x70]

Is there spiritual adultery and fornication?


.

Yes..there sure is spiritual adultery and it is shown in Romans 7:1-4.

Romans 7:1-4 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Or do you not know, brethren (for I am speaking to those who know the law), that the law has jurisdiction over a person as long as he lives?

[SUP]2 [/SUP] For the married woman is bound by law to her husband while he is living; but if her husband dies, she is released from the law concerning the husband.

[SUP]3 [/SUP] So then, if while her husband is living she is joined to another man, she shall be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from the law, so that she is not an adulteress though she is joined to another man.
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, sothat you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God.
Trying to live by the righteous deeds that "we do" ( which is the whole basis of the law ) instead of living from the righteousness and life of Christ that is inside of us and who we have been joined to as one. - this is spiritual adultery.

Here is a short 11 minute video talking about it..it'll bless you in Christ.

[video=youtube;6bhZlQNCV7o]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bhZlQNCV7o[/video]

 

[Persuaded]

Paul often refered to himself as a servant or slave to Christ.
All who are children of God i.e. those who are by grace saved, are to see themselves as Paul saw himself.
This is especeally true of those who fill the office of pastor/bishop/elder/teacher.
To serve one of our Lord's local churches is not only the greatest honor, but also an awesome responsibility and should never be taken lightly.
The moment a pastor/bishop/elder/teacher looses sight of that fact, he has failed his Savior and the local church.
Woe unto the man that no longer sees himself as a SERVANT of Christ and His local church.
He had best be on his face before God asking forgiveness.

 

[crossnote]

It's interesting to me that in that verse in the op, God says he will destroy them. What does that mean really. Kinda sounds like they get the boot to me if all they come to heavens door with is hay, wood and straw.

1 Corinthians 3:12-15 KJVS
[12] Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; [13] Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. [14] If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. [15] If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

 

[Gr8grace]

1 CORINTHIANS 3:16
Don’t you know that you yourselves are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit lives in you? (17) If anyone destroys God’s temple, God will destroy him; for God’s temple is sacred and you are that temple.

God's word plainly states that He will destroy anyone who destroys His temple. His temple is the believer. Be careful you aren't destroying a temple of God.

I think we can make a very simple point here.

All believers are indwelt with the Holy Spirit. We are Gods temple........anyone teaching we can lose salvation is in essence, destroying Gods temple.

And the loss of salvation crowd is going to use "destroy" as loss of salvation EVERY single time.

What Paul is talking about is if these teachers are harming the Corinthians in anyway......spiritually,emotionally,mentally or physically these teachers will face Gods punitive action. Because Paul just finished saying this...........

13each man’s work will become evident; for the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the quality of each man’s work. 14If any man’s work which he has built on it remains, he will receive a reward. 15If any man’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

 

[Grace777x70]

Believers that are in Christ do not have "hearts trained in greed ". We are a new creation in Christ.

The believers new heart in Christ created in righteousness and holiness: First it was prophesied in the Old Testament.

Ezekiel 36:26 (NASB)
[SUP]26 [/SUP] "Moreover, I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; and I will remove the heart of stone ( old man ) from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. ( new man in Christ )


Romans 2:29 (NASB)
[SUP]29 [/SUP] But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, butfrom God.

By grace we have been given a new heart that is obedient.

Romans 6:17 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] But thanks be to God that though you were slaves of sin, you became obedient from the heart to that form of teaching to which you were committed,

God cleaned house and moved in. God will not dwell in unrighteousness. God through the Holy Spirit is in our inner man now.

Ephesians 3:16-17 (NASB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] that He would grant you, according to the riches of His glory, to be strengthened with power through His Spirit in the inner man,
[SUP]17 [/SUP] so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; and that you, being rooted and grounded in love,

God sealed us and gave us the Holy Spirit in our new hearts.

2 Corinthians 1:22 (NASB)
[SUP]22[/SUP] who also sealed us and gave us the Spirit in our hearts as a pledge.

We have the Spirit of God's Son in our hearts now.Galatians 4:6 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] Because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, "Abba! Father!"

God has cleansed our hearts by faith.Acts 15:8-9 (NASB)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] "And God, who knows the heart, testified to them giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He also did to us;
[SUP]9 [/SUP] and He made no distinction between us and them, cleansing their hearts by faith.

We love from our hearts now as it is pure.1 Timothy 1:5 (NASB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] But the goal of our instruction is love from a pure heartand a good conscience and a sincere faith.

2 Timothy 2:22 (NASB)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] Now flee from youthful lusts and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace, with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart. (this is a believer in Christ..hang around them )

1 Peter 3:4 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] but let it be thehidden person of the heart, with the imperishable quality of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is precious in the sight of God.

There are more but this should work to show that the believer has a new heart in Christ and does not have a heart trained in greed like an unbeliever.

We still have the flesh to deal with in our bodies and if we are admonished to not to yield to that...but all that is a different subject.

 

[Sirk]

I think we can make a very simple point here.

All believers are indwelt with the Holy Spirit. We are Gods temple........anyone teaching we can lose salvation is in essence, destroying Gods temple.

And the loss of salvation crowd is going to use "destroy" as loss of salvation EVERY single time.

What Paul is talking about is if these teachers are harming the Corinthians in anyway......spiritually,emotionally,mentally or physically these teachers will face Gods punitive action. Because Paul just finished saying this...........

13each man’s work will become evident; for the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the quality of each man’s work. 14If any man’s work which he has built on it remains, he will receive a reward. 15If any man’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

thanks for bringing that up. I think all to often we refer to "destroying the temple" in only the physical sense and on oneself. It is not recognized that we can destroy another spiritually and mentally. And that the latter two are the worst kind of destruction inflicted on "the temple".

 

[Grace777x70]

I think we can make a very simple point here.

All believers are indwelt with the Holy Spirit. We are Gods temple........anyone teaching we can lose salvation is in essence, destroying Gods temple.

And the loss of salvation crowd is going to use "destroy" as loss of salvation EVERY single time.

What Paul is talking about is if these teachers are harming the Corinthians in anyway......spiritually,emotionally,mentally or physically these teachers will face Gods punitive action. Because Paul just finished saying this...........

13each man’s work will become evident; for the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the quality of each man’s work. 14If any man’s work which he has built on it remains, he will receive a reward. 15If any man’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

Sorry..couldn't give you a rep..have to spread it around first...

I really liked this statement and it is so true.!

And the loss of salvation crowd is going to use "destroy" as loss of salvation EVERY single time.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Yes..there sure is spiritual adultery and it is shown in Romans 7:1-4.

Romans 7:1-4 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Or do you not know, brethren (for I am speaking to those who know the law), that the law has jurisdiction over a person as long as he lives?

[SUP]2 [/SUP] For the married woman is bound by law to her husband while he is living; but if her husband dies, she is released from the law concerning the husband.

[SUP]3 [/SUP] So then, if while her husband is living she is joined to another man, she shall be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from the law, so that she is not an adulteress though she is joined to another man.
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, sothat you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God.
Trying to live by the righteous deeds that "we do" ( which is the whole basis of the law ) instead of living from the righteousness and life of Christ that is inside of us and who we have been joined to as one. - this is spiritual adultery.

Here is a short 11 minute video talking about it..it'll bless you in Christ.

[video=youtube;6bhZlQNCV7o]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bhZlQNCV7o[/video]

Though we be married to another we are still to be faithful to Christ (God's words) and we are to also bear good fruit unto God, notice in red......

[SUP]4 [/SUP] Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, so that you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God.

Again bearing good fruit is not something we do to be justified. We bear good fruit because we are already justified and made righteous by Christ who now works in us. NOT OUR OWN WORKS, BUT CHRIST WHO NOW WORKS IN US.

But if Christ truly works in you, then you will produce good works of righteousness. A good tree will bear good fruit.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

IAll believers are indwelt with the Holy Spirit. We are Gods temple........anyone teaching we can lose salvation is in essence, destroying Gods temple.

This in essence is salvation by nature.

Jews: "We are Abraham's seed. We can never be lost."

Christians: "We are born again of incorruptible seed. We can never be lost."

 

[Grace777x70]

thanks for bringing that up. I think all to often we refer to "destroying the temple" in only the physical sense and on oneself. It is not recognized that we can destroy another spiritually and mentally.

I agree....there is a sense of being defiled when people slander others and when they exhibit malice towards them. These people wouldn't dare steal but they would slander at the drop of a hat and all the while think they are the ones "doing the will of God".

It is all the works of the flesh and there are many varieties of flesh too. The "good" flesh thinks the "bad" flesh is not doing the will of God. But it's still all flesh and God does not recognize what we do in the flesh - just like He told Abraham "to take your son, your only son..."

God didn't recognize Abraham's son Ishmael that he produced by trying to do the will of God in his own-self effort.