Did God plan for man to fall to prove something to Satan and his angels?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
M

Mouse_Cheeks

Active member
#81
Apr 24, 2025
143
49
28
#81
Pilgrimshope said:
have you ever read this statement ?

“Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: but every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. ( lust is a product of knowing evil )

Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin:

and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.”
‭‭James‬ ‭1:13-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭18:4‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭30:19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

He mostly just tells man the truth about life and death salvation and damnation and then invites us to believe but some people don’t even want to hear it others want to hear it all

God has foreknowledge of the end and outcome so he plans ahead even beforhand I agree with that but what I’m saying is foreknowledge is not the same as being the source of causation . He just foresees what is to come later and so plans ahead to navigate man’s faults until Christ came forth to redeem us from adams choice that caused this conflict of good and evil that means we have to choose now being conflicted

Adam caused the struggle within us

“I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

but I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭7:21-23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

because there’s the knowledge of good and evil in us now.

man isnt supposed to have the knowledge of gods bit the knowledge of God Meaning just listening to what he teaches us being with us like in Eden or like in the gospel or like ….when his spirit comes to dwell within a believer and they begin to look into and listen after his words and the spirit begins to wake up in them

often he is observing us and what we’re doing trying and testing us ….like this

“The LORD is in his holy temple, The LORD's throne is in heaven: His eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men.”
‭‭Psalm‬ ‭11:4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“The LORD looked down from heaven upon the children of men, To see if there were any that did understand, And seek God.”
‭‭Psalm‬ ‭14:2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“The LORD looketh from heaven; he beholdeth all the sons of men. From the place of his habitation

he looketh upon all the inhabitants of the earth.

He fashioneth their hearts all alike; He considereth all their works.”
‭‭Psalm‬ ‭33:13-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.”
‭‭Ecclesiastes‬ ‭12:13-14‬ ‭KJV‬‬


seems as if God is holding man accountable….none of this makes sense if Gods the one tempting man and willing man to sin and do what we do good or evil Beforehand .

one final example of this dynamic in scripture

“And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.

And the LORD came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of men builded. And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.

Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech. So the LORD scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭11:4-8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

God has foreknowledge he sees the end and knows his Will is going to triumph but one has to acknolwedge there’s definately an element of mankind’s doings really affecting the flow of things in earth until Jesus returns that is …..

all I’m really saying is God isn’t the one behind tempting mankind so we will sin and die. And hasn’t ever been.
Click to expand...
Mine was a yes or no question.
 
K

Kroogz

Well-known member
#82
Dec 5, 2023
1,743
824
113
#82
brightfame52 said:
I know what Im talking about, you are belittling God as to say His Eternal Decrees
Click to expand...
You are shaming God with this statement.He does not have "decrees." He has A decree.

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.......PERIOD.

Belittling God would be one who says," God is too small to deal with creatures(His creation) who have FREEWILL."
 
B

brightfame52

Well-known member
#83
Nov 21, 2020
6,996
666
113
#83
Kroogz said:
You are shaming God with this statement.He does not have "decrees." He has A decree.

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.......PERIOD.

Belittling God would be one who says," God is too small to deal with creatures(His creation) who have FREEWILL."
Click to expand...
Saying His creatures have Freewill belittles God, for no ones will is Free from God !
 
Genez

Genez

Junior Member
#85
Oct 12, 2017
4,550
783
113
#85
Mouse_Cheeks said:
What is sin?
How do we sin?
Click to expand...
God created Adam without sin.

Before he ate of the Tree of Knowledge of good and evil anything Adam did was sinless.

After Adam fell mankind took on a defective nature so that our bodies would be all falling short of the way Adam behaved before he fell.

Since we can not see how Adam was behaving before he fell we need to take God on his Word that we do not behave as God would
have created us to be.

Specific sins are mentioned in the Bible.

How do we sin?

Take my course... "How to Sin 101."
Only $50.00, and you get three credits.
 
Genez

Genez

Junior Member
#86
Oct 12, 2017
4,550
783
113
#86
brightfame52 said:
Saying His creatures have Freewill belittles God, for no ones will is Free from God !
Click to expand...
Theodore Beza suddenly jumped in your head.
From that moment on, you became blind and dead.


(you are free not to believe that)
 
Genez

Genez

Junior Member
#87
Oct 12, 2017
4,550
783
113
#87
brightfame52 said:
I hope you learned something about the True and Living God besides the god you have formulated from your own mind, maybe he needs to learn something to as he learned from adam
Click to expand...
You're so humble.​
You're so kind.​
​
Without an ounce of self righteousness. ​
And, totally out of "His" mind. ​
​



1 Corinthians 2:16
 
B

brightfame52

Well-known member
#92
Nov 21, 2020
6,996
666
113
#92
Genez said:
Theodore Beza suddenly jumped in your head.
From that moment on, you became blind and dead.


(you are free not to believe that)
Click to expand...
Whenever freewill from God is suggested, we know who instigates such God hating notions, read Gen 3
 
B

brightfame52

Well-known member
#93
Nov 21, 2020
6,996
666
113
#93
Genez said:
You're so humble.​
You're so kind.​
​
Without an ounce of self righteousness. ​
And, totally out of "His" mind. ​
​



1 Corinthians 2:16
Click to expand...
So what your god learn from man today ? What did he learn what men will do in the future ?
 
P

PaulThomson

Well-known member
#94
Oct 29, 2023
4,660
631
113
#94
Mouse_Cheeks said:
If we're created separated from God due to our sinful human nature, how can we bridge that nature all by ourselves and choose Jesus?

Mouse_Cheeks said:
That was a question, not an opinion.

There's a difference. :D
Click to expand...
Ohh. Okay. you don't believe we're created separated from God due to a sinful nature, and you were posing a question to challenge those who do. I misunderstood, then. Sorry about that. We agree then.
 
Genez

Genez

Junior Member
#99
Oct 12, 2017
4,550
783
113
#99
brightfame52 said:
I look at the News regularly, whats your point
Click to expand...
You tell me to read something in a general sense.
Nothing specific pointed to.

So?

I show you how it is a lazy way to give an answer that requires no work on my part as well.
 
Genez

Genez

Junior Member
#100
Oct 12, 2017
4,550
783
113
#100
brightfame52 said:
What did your god learn today from man ?
Click to expand...

It is not God who learns. It is the angels who learn.

And, your example of attitude, the angels can see how the fallen angels act like you have been acting.....

That is who learns!

That is how God uses people who need to be humble to serve as a teaching tool.

Fallen mankind is a classroom for angels to study, and for fallen angels to watch and see why they have been condemned
and can not be allowed back into the kingdom.

God does not waste anything.


.......
 
You must log in or register to reply here.