Did Jesus ever tell us that we no longer need to keep the law of Moses?

[Eli12]

Jesus obeyed up to the end:

Heb 5:7 In the days of his flesh [Christ] offered up supplications and also petitions to the One who was able to save him out of death, with strong outcries and tears, and he was favorably heard for his godly fear. 8 Although he was a Son, he learned obedience from the things he suffered; 9 and after he had been made perfect he became responsible for everlasting salvation to all those obeying him

Can you imagine if Christ had thought he was saved even if he disobeyed? We must follow him.

There was a point when Paul thought that he was done:

2 Tim 4:6 For I am already being poured out like a drink offering, and the due time for my releasing is imminent. 7 I have fought the fine fight, I have run the course to the finish, I have observed the faith. 8 From this time on there is reserved for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, will give me as a reward in that day, yet not only to me, but also to all those who have loved his manifestation.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Nobody is calling John a liar; you are missunderstanding his words. We have eternal life if we follow Jesus up to the end, and that is it. If we stop following Jesus, we don't have eternal life. Maybe you should consider what it is to follow Jesus. Look at his life and you will see what is required of his followers; no one is better than him, so what happen to him is in front of us to see the model he put.

1 John 5:13
These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

John dtates clearly our means of faith is the knowledge we have eternal life

It is out hope. God can not lie as paul said, god promised it before time began.

So yes, you are calling John a lair

 

[Eli12]

Nobody has eternal life since we all are getting sick and dying. It is obvious that John is talking about a promise for the future. We have the promise and it is trustable, so in that sense is secure. We are no secured, though, no matter how secure is the promise. We must fight and resist and survive the temptation and so and so and so.

1 Cor 9:27 but I pummel my body and lead it as a slave, that, after I have preached to others, I myself should not become disapproved somehow.

We must read all in the Scriptures, not just one side. Jesus had to endure temptations and reach the end of his life.

Heb 12:4 (LEB) You have not yet resisted to the point of shedding your blood as you struggle against sin.
5 And have you completely forgotten the exhortation which instructs you as sons?“My son, do not make light of the Lord’s discipline,or give up when you are corrected by him.
6 For the Lord disciplines the one whom he loves,and punishes every son whom he accepts.”
7 Endure it for discipline. God is dealing with you as sons. For what son is there whom a father does not discipline?
8 But if you are without discipline, in which all legitimate sons have become participants, then you are illegitimate and not sons.
9 Furthermore, we have had ?our earthly fathers? who disciplined us, and we respected them. Will we not much rather subject ourselves to the Father of spirits and live?
10 For they disciplined us for a few days according to what seemed appropriate to them, but he does so for our benefit, in order that we can have a share in his holiness.
11 Now all discipline seems for the moment not to be joyful but painful, but later it yields the peaceful fruit of righteousness for those who are trained by it.

Have you realized that while I consider your quotes I can harmonize them with mine, but you only dodge mine without explanation? You are reading only a few parts without thinking about the other scriptures.

Rev 3:8 ‘I know your deeds—look! I have set before you an opened door, which no one can shut—that you have a little power, and you kept my word and did not prove false to my name.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Nobody has eternal life since we all are getting sick and dying. It is obvious that John is talking about a promise for the future. We have the promise and it is trustable, so in that sense is secure. We are no secured, though, no matter how secure is the promise. We must fight and resist and survive the temptation and so and so and so.

1 Cor 9:27 but I pummel my body and lead it as a slave, that, after I have preached to others, I myself should not become disapproved somehow.

We must read all in the Scriptures, not just one side. Jesus had to endure temptations and reach the end of his life.

Heb 12:4 (LEB) You have not yet resisted to the point of shedding your blood as you struggle against sin.
5 And have you completely forgotten the exhortation which instructs you as sons?“My son, do not make light of the Lord’s discipline,or give up when you are corrected by him.
6 For the Lord disciplines the one whom he loves,and punishes every son whom he accepts.”
7 Endure it for discipline. God is dealing with you as sons. For what son is there whom a father does not discipline?
8 But if you are without discipline, in which all legitimate sons have become participants, then you are illegitimate and not sons.
9 Furthermore, we have had ?our earthly fathers? who disciplined us, and we respected them. Will we not much rather subject ourselves to the Father of spirits and live?
10 For they disciplined us for a few days according to what seemed appropriate to them, but he does so for our benefit, in order that we can have a share in his holiness.
11 Now all discipline seems for the moment not to be joyful but painful, but later it yields the peaceful fruit of righteousness for those who are trained by it.

Have you realized that while I consider your quotes I can harmonize them with mine, but you only dodge mine without explanation? You are reading only a few parts without thinking about the other scriptures.

Rev 3:8 ‘I know your deeds—look! I have set before you an opened door, which no one can shut—that you have a little power, and you kept my word and did not prove false to my name.

Eternal life is spiritual not physical.

Your still calling john and jesus liars.

Jesus said those who entrust him are born again spiritually, this spiritual life will never die,ie we will live forever

 

[Eli12]

I am not calling Jesus or John liars. That makes you a liar.

 

[DeighAnn]

Can you imagine if Christ had thought he was saved even if he disobeyed? We must follow him.

Yes, what if??? excellent point

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Eternal life is spiritual not physical.
Your still calling john and jesus liars.
Jesus said those who entrust him are born again spiritually, this spiritual life will never die,ie we will live forever

Eternal life is very much a physical thing, which is why we will have new bodies and God
will dwell with man. I suspect we will be quite surprised at how similar and different it will be.

Imagine a believer saying John and Jesus are wrong. In the hierarchy of authority this would
be a grevious position to take. Now in truth we could be making this mistake, but in our hearts
I am sure we would know, because the Holy Spirit would tell us. I have at times felt the rebuke
of the Lord and humbled myself.

So the position is those who are born again, are eternally safe in Him.
The parable of the merciful King, forgiving a debt illustrates something profound.
Relationships and respect at this honouring of another and working together, as independent individuals
but with responsibility for our work. God says He is like this. He looks at a situation, and gives mercy and
cleansing.

Now we think of these things like we would know, it is something stupendous. But when a plate is dirty,
how profound is it when it is cleaned. It is still a plate, and serves its function, it is now just clean.
We are no different, we are still people living our lives except we have been cleansed and purified.

And as we follow Him, so our love and bond with Him grows in our hearts and we find we can walk in the
Kingdom, deeper and stronger with each day. But Paul said something also. If we sow to the sinful nature
we polute this precious gift of life, destroy the purification and cleansing and will die.

The failure is in recognising the absence of sin by its cleansing is eternal life, a state of communion and
walking with Jesus. Like any journey, destroy the security and basis of it, the journey ends. While on the
road we are 100% safe and secure, kept by the heavenly host, guarded and encouraged to walk further on.

So the lie here is the idea we are locked in to God through a mystical eternal spirit that we have become,
rather we are saints walking Jesus's way on the road of the Kingdom. But then for these people the Kingdom
is this other side, which the flesh keeps us from, but that we have now become.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

I am not calling Jesus or John liars. That makes you a liar.

EG in his world is making a valid point.
He is an eternal spirit which can never die or be judged or be sent to the lake of fire, and his flesh
or sinful body, which binds him to sinful behaviour of which he is not responsible.

The problem is in this theology as are we. Except we must be evil deceivers sent to deceive the lost
from coming into the Kingdom. But if we believe in Christ, coming to faith many years ago, then it all
falls down. Because the kingdom is divided against itself.

So the promises are for those who abide in Jesus, who stay on the path, who stand against the deception
of the world and hold to Jesus and the way. But expand this to anyone who has been on the path at
any point, they are upgraded and safe. But the upgrade is faulty, most wander off and nothing has taken
hold. Oppps. A complete one off perfect upgrade, must be like microsofts upgrades, full of blue screen of
death errors. lol.

 

[SimpleGardner]

Word of encouragement;

Many on here say that we cannot obey Gods commandments!

For that to be true, God would have to be a liar;

Deu 30:11 NIV Now what I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you or beyond your reach.

And the verses below would have to be false;

Gen 26:5 NIV because Abraham obeyed me and kept my requirements, my commands, my decrees and my laws."

Luk 1:5-6 NIV In the time of Herod king of Judea there was a priest named Zechariah, who belonged to the priestly division of Abijah; his wife Elizabeth was also a descendant of Aaron. (6) Both of them were upright in the sight of God, observing all the Lord's commandments and regulations blamelessly.

Not only do they say "cannot", but they imply "should not".

"Cheap Grace" as it is often referred to is a corruption of the Grace of God that drives men to extol the virtues of the Pharisees in order to then declare "If they being more righteous than all" were condemned then certainly obedience holds nothing for us, only grace!

Then they discourage "works". by implying once again that "grace alone" is the answer!

Simply read James and Revelations esp chapters 2 & 3 to find the fallacy of these arguments.

Obedience, Works like helping poor brothers in need, widows in their times of need, the fatherless, the prisoners, those who need clothes, food, water, shelter! These are literally gateways on our paths to our final destination. If anyone walks around those gateways, they are like the foolish virgins whose lives as virgins/Christians was one of quenching the Holy Spirit (oil), by clinging to "Cheap Grace", a corrupt doctrine that shuns all the above, hence insufficient oil when it is needed, when the Bridegroom comes!

Pray for me wise virgins, as I work out my salvation with fear and trembling, that I hear and follow all of the Holy Spirits leading, that I might become more like Jesus every day!

SG

 

[FollowHisSteps]

I have to apologise for being so harsh.
But perfect upgrade theology as a one off event is not Gods teaching.
Seeds, growth, new birth, a new creation, growing from immaturity into a perfect follower, with learning,
lessons, discipline, self control, perseverance.

These are all attributes of working faith, life and development, started by a work of the Holy Spirit,
sustained and fed by our communion in Him.

But let us be plain. There is no compromise for us with this upgrade theology and on all levels
it opposes the word of the Lord and the work of the Holy Spirit.

31 The kingdom of heaven is like a mustard seed, which a man took and planted in his field.
32 Though it is the smallest of all your seeds, yet when it grows, it is the largest of garden plants and becomes a tree, so that the birds of the air come and perch in its branches
Matt 13

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Word of encouragement;

Many on here say that we cannot obey Gods commandments!

For that to be true, God would have to be a liar;

Deu 30:11 NIV Now what I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you or beyond your reach.

And the verses below would have to be false;

Gen 26:5 NIV because Abraham obeyed me and kept my requirements, my commands, my decrees and my laws."

Luk 1:5-6 NIV In the time of Herod king of Judea there was a priest named Zechariah, who belonged to the priestly division of Abijah; his wife Elizabeth was also a descendant of Aaron. (6) Both of them were upright in the sight of God, observing all the Lord's commandments and regulations blamelessly.

Not only do they say "cannot", but they imply "should not".

"Cheap Grace" as it is often referred to is a corruption of the Grace of God that drives men to extol the virtues of the Pharisees in order to then declare "If they being more righteous than all" were condemned then certainly obedience holds nothing for us, only grace!

Then they discourage "works". by implying once again that "grace alone" is the answer!

Simply read James and Revelations esp chapters 2 & 3 to find the fallacy of these arguments.

Obedience, Works like helping poor brothers in need, widows in their times of need, the fatherless, the prisoners, those who need clothes, food, water, shelter! These are literally gateways on our paths to our final destination. If anyone walks around those gateways, they are like the foolish virgins whose lives as virgins/Christians was one of quenching the Holy Spirit (oil), by clinging to "Cheap Grace", a corrupt doctrine that shuns all the above, hence insufficient oil when it is needed, when the Bridegroom comes!

Pray for me wise virgins, as I work out my salvation with fear and trembling, that I hear and follow all of the Holy Spirits leading, that I might become more like Jesus every day!

SG

I just want to set the record straight. Because these liars are getting out of hand.

No one here says we can not obey gods commands.

It is hugely different to say i can not be perfect (sinless) in perfect onedience to the law. Thus admit we are cursed by the law

And say we can not live a life where are are people who love god and thus obey him.

These people do not like us because they want to put us under law so they make these brash statements of how we hate gods law and do not think we need to, can or even want to be obedient children.

the issue here is HOW we are obedient children.

is it by our own power by obeying the law..

or is it by the power of God by taking HIS LOVE given to us in excess, and sharing that love with others. And seeking after the things of the spirit. And allowing God to produce the fruits of the spirit within us, by giving us the faith to do those things. (By his action of proving himself trustworthy)

I must be honest, I do not know how these lawyers can live with themselves. claiming to be preachers of the law. Yet with every lieing post they make about those who disagree with them. breaking that very same law (thou shalt not bare false witness)

 

[eternally-gratefull]

EG in his world is making a valid point.
He is an eternal spirit which can never die or be judged or be sent to the lake of fire, and his flesh
or sinful body, which binds him to sinful behaviour of which he is not responsible.

See here you go again peter. You just can not leave well enough alone

YOUR A LIAR! EG DOES NOT BELIEVE THIS NONSENSE!

For how many years now have you been telling everyone what EG believe and you STILL can not get it right? You should be an expert now!!

But no Your blindness and hatred has you so you will never understand, because you can not let go of your pride.

Back on ignore for you for the time being, (I can;t take your nonsense and people did not like us bickering before) But I am keeping my eye on you.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I am not calling Jesus or John liars. That makes you a liar.

Yes you are

Jesus said if we eat the bread which endures for eternal life, we will never die, never hunger never thirst, HAVE eternal life. And given his assure=ance he will raise us on the last day. He also said we can ask, and he will give us rivers of living water flowing to eternal life. Finally he said he was sent, so that whoever believe in him wil never die (spiritually) but has eternal life.

Funny how john wrote these things, He also wrote the passage in 1 john which said we can KNOW WE HAVE IT. (How can we know we have it if as you claim we can NEVER KNOW. Nor do we HAVE it?) of course, we can;t

So yes. You are calling Jesus and john liars.

I pray you see what they are saying, read john 3 - 6 you will see what Jesus said.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

I just want to set the record straight. Because these liars are getting out of hand.
No one here says we can not obey gods commands.
It is hugely different to say i can not be perfect (sinless) in perfect onedience to the law. Thus admit we are cursed by the law
And say we can not live a life where are are people who love god and thus obey him.
These people do not like us because they want to put us under law so they make these brash statements of how we hate gods law and do not think we need to, can or even want to be obedient children.
the issue here is HOW we are obedient children.
is it by our own power by obeying the law..
or is it by the power of God by taking HIS LOVE given to us in excess, and sharing that love with others. And seeking after the things of the spirit. And allowing God to produce the fruits of the spirit within us, by giving us the faith to do those things. (By his action of proving himself trustworthy)
I must be honest, I do not know how these lawyers can live with themselves. claiming to be preachers of the law. Yet with every lieing post they make about those who disagree with them. breaking that very same law (thou shalt not bare false witness)

Have you a perfect upgrade in place, a mature, pure, holy, ping clean spirit that is eternal and can never dim
no matter what you do or say? Ting.

I would love to see the upgrade gospel, you could sell it on every street corner.
But where is the proof? Not in scripture. Not in peoples lives.

This is gnosticism, the gospel of destruction of the body and saving of the spirit.
Jesus preached this

30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.
Matt 5

If a physical sin is due only to the sinful nature linked to our bodies, then it cannot lead
to the whole body being thrown into hell. In one sense hell would be the resurrected body
being destroyed, but this is not distinguished from the soul/spirit of an individual.
You could not have your body in hell and your spirit in heaven, lol.

This maybe flippant, but then these guys are so flippant about such serious issues, a little
of their own medicine.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Gnosticism teaches knowledge is what is important. It also teaches you can sin all you want in this body.

We teach neither.

Can anyone here show were myself or others teach it is OK to sin? Or that we think knowledge is important. But reaction or following through with that knowledge Does nto mean a thing?

These liars are getting old.. Same old stuff. Powerless gospel which is unable to save, while attacking those who trust in GOD.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

See here you go again peter. You just can not leave well enough alone
YOUR A LIAR! EG DOES NOT BELIEVE THIS NONSENSE!
For how many years now have you been telling everyone what EG believe and you STILL can not get it right? You should be an expert now!!
But no Your blindness and hatred has you so you will never understand, because you can not let go of your pride.
Back on ignore for you for the time being, (I can;t take your nonsense and people did not like us bickering before) But I am keeping my eye on you.

Got to say, apart from saying one does not believe something, what is it one believes?

I remember this kind of argument. Here is the massive building which is the point being made.
What you have got wrong is this door, here, is a little to the left, so you are a big fat liar.

And look at the response, I will run away and hide. That is the real truth.
What a joke. And what a sad disaster, so weak and not able to respond while claiming to know
Jesus the living God.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Gnosticism teaches knowledge is what is important. It also teaches you can sin all you want in this body.
We teach neither.
Can anyone here show were myself or others teach it is OK to sin? Or that we think knowledge is important. But reaction or following through with that knowledge Does nto mean a thing?
These liars are getting old.. Same old stuff. Powerless gospel which is unable to save, while attacking those who trust in GOD.

If one does not have working faith, fruit or reality all one has is knowledge.
Upgrade theology, a perfect spirit given is the core belief, upon which everything else hangs.

Roll up, roll up, get your upgrade package here. Read this A4 sheet of beliefs, sign up and you
are guaranteed a place in the heavenly courts, no argument or take backs.

Ignore these cynical doom mongers, they twist and highlight warnings which are just loss of
reward to the upgraded class, they are just haters and liars, sent to deceive you.

Only problem is this is Jesus and His teaching and He is the author and finisher of our faith.
He is the ultimate authority and definer and creator of reality itself. God bless you, and may
the love of the Lord Jesus Christ soften your heart to His reality and truth, Amen

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Got to say, apart from saying one does not believe something, what is it one believes?

I remember this kind of argument. Here is the massive building which is the point being made.
What you have got wrong is this door, here, is a little to the left, so you are a big fat liar.

And look at the response, I will run away and hide. That is the real truth.
What a joke. And what a sad disaster, so weak and not able to respond while claiming to know
Jesus the living God.

The joke is you are not God. You do not get to tell people what they believe, People have the right to tell YOU what they believe and as a child of God. You are to recieve that in humility.

Ie. If a person tells you the sky is blue, you do not have the right to keep tellng everying they believe the sky is green, then when the person tells you he never said that, You continue to bask and say he says the sky is green.

Thats the 4TH thing you have in common with peterjens, you going to keep lying and saying your not him? Or come out and repent of your sin?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

see how they do. They say we do not have working faith or fruit. The can not get out of their own way.

WE not only LOVE roducing fruit. We prreach how to do it (allow God to attach us to the vine, then allow him to lift us up an prune us..

They will keep lying to support their own faulty belief, its their issue, not ours..

 

[FollowHisSteps]

The real problem with these guys is no resolution of sin, but easily overlooked,
is the upgrade perfect mature spirit they now have.

I mean with this, nothing else matters. Go fishing, diving surfing in Australia, indonesia,
own islands in the sun, relax and take it easy anywhere you like, there is nothing to do
or share, it is all settled and no problems coming down the road.

You cannot do anything about the flesh, it is the burden you have to carry until God
just removes it. Be righteous if you want, you can never achieve it, it is just a hypocritical
farce, pushed by legalists and the deceived, who we will fight tooth and nail to expose their
lies and deception that keeps people doomed to hell.

Jesus calls us to walk the path of righteousness and love, to challenge us at every level
and to find communion and fellowship in Him, alive and praising every day of our lives.
We are called to service and called to see needs and meet them, wherever we find them.
These self indulgent self justifiers deserve their fate, blind and lost they will never find
a way out, which is sad but also something they choose to follow.