Did Jesus Have The Human Sinful Nature?
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Ok then being tempted is not sin; and Jesus was not a willful participant to the temptation, then HE did not sin. And to view Jesus as HE could have sinned as I see in scripture reduces HIS supremacy as God . Because we would not say that about God .On that we agree.
yes you did and I am not the only one who sees that. Jesus did not have a sinful nature period. Jesus did not sin nor could He period. The Bible does not say Jesus has or had and sinful nature as you suggest it does by word manipulation . pulling a watered down translation to support your false narrative does not work and I am not the only one who sees that.
NO being led by the Spirit in context to the temptation still does not prove HE could have sinned.
"If Jesus could not have sinned, then he was not tempted."
This is not Biblical application , that is opinionated but not Biblical . It is human reasoning but not supported by the Word of God.
Anybody, including you, can click on the links to those verses and see they are in their full context without changes except for the phrases where I added boldness to them. You have become irrational to accuse me of such a thing and it is because you have lost in this discussion. You have nothing to bring here except your simple denial of the Biblical facts.
and I stand by that Jesu did not willfully obey the temptation . in another words Jesus did not participate in the temptation doing that would be sin. as you agreed Being tempted is not sin. So your point is not well founded.
God was not fully human. Therefore he could not sin because the flesh was not weak. He was God incarnate.
Notice anything about Matthew 4 and Jesus in the wilderness?
The bread temptation Satan afforded. Read Deuteronomy 8:3
Matthew 4:4
But he answered and said, it is written
The passage referred to, and cited, is in ( Deuteronomy 8:3 ) the manner of citing it is what was common and usual with the Jews; and is often to be met with in the Talmudic writings; who, when they produce any passage of scripture, say (bytkd) , "as it is written". The meaning of this scripture is; not that as the body lives by bread, so the soul lives by the word of God, and doctrines of the Gospel; though this is a certain truth: or that man lives by obedience to the commands of God, as was promised to the Israelites in the wilderness, and in the land of Canaan; but that God, in satisfying man's hunger, and in supporting and preserving his life, is not tied to bread only, but can make use of other means, and order whatever he pleases to answer these ends; as, by raining manna from heaven, which is mentioned in the passage cited; and therefore there was no occasion to change the nature of things, to turn stones into bread; since that was not so absolutely necessary to the sustenance of life, as that it could not be maintained without it. Our Lord hereby expresses his strong faith and confidence in God, that he was able to support him, and would do it, though in a wilderness, and destitute of supply; whereby he overcame this temptation of Satan. Christ, in this, and some following citations, bears a testimony to, and establishes the authority of the sacred writings; and though he was full of the Holy Ghost, makes them the rule of his conduct; which ought to be observed against those, who, under a pretence of the Spirit, deny the scriptures to be the only rule of faith and practice and at the same time points out to us the safest and best method of opposing Satan's temptations; namely, by applying to, and making use of the word of God.
Well I disagree with that application on this grounds to see Jesus as having the opportunity to disobey the Father after willfully stepping out of Glory to become a man for us, then using HIS freedom and liberty to SIN just as Adam did is if you agree or not reducing His Supremacy. Jesus is Lord the Supreme Authority who cannot nor would succumbed to the temptations of the devil. That is why HE can because none else could say that or do that but GOD.
The difference between you and me on this is that you only have your philosophy but I have Scripture:
Therefore, it was necessary for him to be made in every respect like us, his brothers and sisters, so that he could be our merciful and faithful High Priest before God. Then he could offer a sacrifice that would take away the sins of the people. Since he himself has gone through suffering and testing, he is able to help us when we are being tested.
Hebrews 2:17-18 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/heb.2.17-18.NLT
OK.. But you guys have to resolve this somehow:
James 1:
13) Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
Heb 4:
15) For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
In his humanity, Jesus was tempted. If there was no chance for failure, then he was not actually tempted.
James 1:
13) Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
Heb 4:
15) For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
In his humanity, Jesus was tempted. If there was no chance for failure, then he was not actually tempted.
Not even close.
This is He who came by water and blood—Jesus Christ; not only by water, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit who bears witness, because the Spirit is truth.
1 John 5:6
Came by by water described natural child birth.
Came by Water and blood described supernatural virgin child birth.
“Came” refers to; came into the world.
Let’s go to John 3, where John records Jesus using this phrase.
5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:5-6
Born of Water = Natural child birth -
That which is born of the flesh
Born of the Spirit = Spiritual Birth.
that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
JPT
Ok Philosophy ? hmmm definition : the study of the fundamental nature of knowledge, reality, and existence, especially when considered as an academic discipline.
well it is funny you lay the claim of philosophy on me yet you were shown your error of Hebrews 2:17-18 in the NLT . Im posted for you the context from chapter 1 of that very same book and I used the NLT. you built a false narrative from only TWO verses in one chapter . And have the audacity to tell me about the study of the fundamental nature of knowledge , reality, and existence when considering academic disciplines?
You clearly forgot Hebrews chapter 1 which is the introduction to chapter two contextually . SO your understand of Hebrews 2:17-18 is incomplete .