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Dreams and the end times (I'm about to look supid(er))
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Siberian_Khatru
Guest
For a dream to be prophetic for God's people, that one must be first called by God as one of His prophets, because it would be about giving a new revelation.
Sorry, I don't see any new prophets that God has specifically called and told to speak His Words to us today, even though there are many false prophets in the world today that claim He sent them. He already gave us His Word through His prophets that He chose, and it's recorded in His Holy Writ, and that is what we should study to know what He said is to come. It's all there, and even more, if those interested would only learn to discipline themselves in It.
O
oldthennew
Guest
11PETER 3:11-12-14-17-18.
Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be
in all Holy conversation and godliness,
Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God....
Wherefore, beloved, seeing that you look for such things, be diligent that you may be found of Him
in peace, without spot and blameless.
You therefore, beloved, seeing you know these things before, beware lest you also being led away
with the error of the wicked, fall from you own steadfastness.
But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
To Him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be
in all Holy conversation and godliness,
Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God....
Wherefore, beloved, seeing that you look for such things, be diligent that you may be found of Him
in peace, without spot and blameless.
You therefore, beloved, seeing you know these things before, beware lest you also being led away
with the error of the wicked, fall from you own steadfastness.
But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
To Him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
God may speak a warning to a specific group by The Holy Spirit, but not at the level that He sent His OT prophets which He spoke directly to in Person. If someone today comes claiming they talk to God in Person, then I'd advise you to watch out!
Dreams are in the same category, they are personal to the person who has the dream, it is meant for them, but not necessarily the whole of Christ's Church.
Furthermore, anything given by The Holy Spirit will NEVER counter God's Holy Writ, thus not a 'new' revelation at all, but a teaching to clarify what has already been written.
We have to remember that there is enmity between the flesh and the spirit. So evidently gathering from cc that enmity must be real serious. I was reading Mark 3 last night and when Christ went into the synagogue they immediately tried to find a way to accuse Him before He even healed the withered hand. That was only three chapters into the book.
I agree with many here in this forum who have pointed out that while JF may be having some kind of personal dream from God, I disagree that it applies to the many.
For one thing, JF is caught up in the very non-biblical Hebrew Roots Movement, as she has confessed in quite a few of her recent posts. She believes in salvation plus works. She also has a history of loud and wild complaints about the church, and life in general.
I do not see her as a mature Christian and in fact, at this time, I am worried about her salvation at all, when she believes she has to have the Sabbath on Saturday, celebrate the Passover, etc, etc.
I believe she is disqualified from any prophetic utterances, to the point where she may in fact be a false prophet, crying doom and gloom where none needs to be cried! I do not think we should be discussing personal dreams from someone who is far from the Biblical path God has chosen for his people. I would question whether JF has even read the Bible through completely. I just finished reading the major and minor prophets, and for every true prophecy or dream given by the prophets, there are 100's if not 1000's of prophecies given by false prophets, who are currying favour with the kings, or just trying to be admired and followed.
It is sad this thread has gone on so long. I do believe that God gave SOME dreams in the OT, most of which were warnings to Israel to repent or be carried away. As both Israel and Judah were carried away, those dreams, visions and prophecies were correct. As for the NT, the prophecies do in fact confirm Jesus is the Messiah, and they help bring salvation to people such as Cornelius and Paul, for that matter. There are exactly 9 visions in the NT, including the entire book of Revelation. That is not very many, considering the work God was doing.
Now, if JF had come on here with some dream or vision about God calling people to holiness, like the OT prophets, or to go and witness, like many of the dreams in the NT, I might be on board. Instead, she posts these flaky dreams, and draws conclusions that are simply not rational Biblical. And some people support her, because they support anyone who says they have had a dream or vision, without discerning both the person and the dream.
Look at what happened to Paul when he tried to go into Bithyna, in Asia Minor.
"And a vision appeared to Paul in the night: a man of Macedonia was standing there, urging him and saying, “Come over to Macedonia and help us.” 10 And when Paul had seen the vision, immediately we sought to go on into Macedonia, concluding that God had called us to preach the gospel.: Acts 16:9-10
So God's plan was different than Paul's. Paul went over to Europe, to Philippi in Macedonia, and people were saved, a church was started, and a Bible book was written to this church, which is a part of our Bible.
Now that is a prophecy for all times, that I can stand behind!
K
KennethC
Guest
DP; said:
Prophecy does not just mean it is a new revelation not taught in the Word of God.
A prophet can however be given insight to share to unlock the events of the bible.
Revelation for instance is a prophetic book, a prophecy in other words.
With what was given to John helps unlock parts of Isaiah, and Daniel for the end times.
To think God has stopped giving these insights when scripture says no such indication would be placing things in the Word that is not there.
So are you also saying the Holy Spirit does not talk to you ???
Also not all OT prophet's talked to God personally, Gabriel was sent to them such as Daniel.
No man has seen God...John 1:18
I read her post without bias and I believe her to be right. You should know that Angela has a good reputation in this community and having said that has probably been walking with the Lord longer than you have been alive..So, she is much older than you, grow up and pay her some respect.
These are interesting dreams. I think the meaning is obvious, but I will hearken to your request in the OP and respond to it tomorrow.
H
Hoffco
Guest
I find most of my dreams to be very frightening and disturbing. This is because I have suffered rejection all of my Christian life, from the world, but most from the church leaders, My so called friends. And my immediate family has rejected me because of my doctrinal battles. One out of 199 of my dreams are good, pleasant. These dreams are not from God but from my flustrated sub-conscience, my disturbed mind, not trusting God 's leading in life. I rejoice in God's leading ,over all, but don't like the bad things God makes me suffer, for His glory. I can'y see them as for His glory, because ,I am fighthong for His glory, why doesn't God accept my HELP for his glory.?? So, I see He,God, has a plan for evil, as well as a plan for God.good, I want His good, but He ,God, often works for His own detriment. This is who God is, He rules in the good and in the evil, to His glory. God shows His wrath and His mercy. all to His glory.
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Hoffco
Guest
I feel JT need to read the New Testament and for get the Old T. for a while. The New takes mastery over the Old,immature trues, The old has much meaning in the light of the new T. interpretation. To much of Hebrew theology is bad stuff.
Alright you wanted this...
You guys are being rude and un-christ-like. Plain and simple. There is no need for this:
~Sorry, I don't believe your dreams are relevant. They are hyper dispensational, and I have no way of verifying they are from God, or just something you ate, or a vivid imagination!
Please remember this is the BIBLE discussion forum. To me, this should not be in this forum
How do you think this made me feel? I didn't have to make myself look like an idiot but I did because I believe there is a real issue with the church and I wanted to get some feedback on my dreams that had been nagging at me for a long time. I'm not saying you owe me anything but could you honestly see Jesus reacting like this?
To quote Ebenezer Scrooge (as it is "that" time of the year):
Your dreams may simply be the result of "an undigested bit of beef, a blot of mustard, a crumb of cheese, a fragment of underdone potato..."
That didn't make me feel too good either. It took a mocking tone as opposed to hey, lets walk together so I can understand you and you can understand me.
So I'm going to stop here but I have more because I have been having computer problems. There will be another one like this. Also, remember, this is a truth brick.
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Hoffco
Guest
Sorry, JF, you are too young to know much of the Bible yet, soo, tone it down and start learning from me and your other elders 72yr, and 54 yrs a Christian,
Truth Brick continued.
~The way is already known. Give them a Bible and tell them to read it.
And you really shouldn't put the notion that she is some sort of "prophetess" into her head. You have absolutely no way of confirming that
HELLO?? I am reading this! I may be young compared to you but this only puts more responsiblity on all of you to behave better than me and set an example. Please don't insult my intelligence like this.
~"Some" people need to stop telling people they are prophets because if the person doesn't have full balance and are willing to listen to you, you'll send them off the deep end. That's really not necessary
I felt crazy reading this one. Why not instead of telling me what I am or am not why not ask questions and get the whole picture before telling me if I am or not a prophet. Also i don't recall anyone telling me I am a prophet or even myself saying I am a prophet.
~Your comment proves it is not.
Ever hear of an evangelist?
Paul said to desire the prophetic realm
Stop acting like you know what you are talking about
This is RUDE! I mean come on! We are a group of CHRISTIANS and we are tearing eachother down like this??? WHAT WOULD JESUS THINK?
Look I don't care who believes/agrees with me just don't be rude. God has put the phrase "Seek to understand" on my heart for some time and it is hard to do that with people telling me what to believe and what not to believe. Saying they KNOW they are right and that I am 100% wrong.
~The way is already known. Give them a Bible and tell them to read it.
And you really shouldn't put the notion that she is some sort of "prophetess" into her head. You have absolutely no way of confirming that
HELLO?? I am reading this! I may be young compared to you but this only puts more responsiblity on all of you to behave better than me and set an example. Please don't insult my intelligence like this.
~"Some" people need to stop telling people they are prophets because if the person doesn't have full balance and are willing to listen to you, you'll send them off the deep end. That's really not necessary
I felt crazy reading this one. Why not instead of telling me what I am or am not why not ask questions and get the whole picture before telling me if I am or not a prophet. Also i don't recall anyone telling me I am a prophet or even myself saying I am a prophet.
~Your comment proves it is not.
Ever hear of an evangelist?
Paul said to desire the prophetic realm
Stop acting like you know what you are talking about
This is RUDE! I mean come on! We are a group of CHRISTIANS and we are tearing eachother down like this??? WHAT WOULD JESUS THINK?
Look I don't care who believes/agrees with me just don't be rude. God has put the phrase "Seek to understand" on my heart for some time and it is hard to do that with people telling me what to believe and what not to believe. Saying they KNOW they are right and that I am 100% wrong.