Early scripture

[Truth_Seeker546]

Need some help with some research I'm doing - maybe someone with knowledge of Christian history with regards to scripture can point me the right direction.

I'm interested in how the early Christians during the time of the apostles and generation after them viewed scripture- I imagine this is before the Bible to its current form of consisting of 4 gospels - I read somewhere there were around 60-70 gospels. Including those from Peter, Barnabas, Mary, Judas etc. Does anyone know how many there were and how many are still accessible?

 

[notuptome]

Early Christians learned of and knew Jesus through the old testament scriptures.

I suggest you study the accepted texts of the bible before you go off and chase those texts that are of gnostic origin.

Study the Gospel of John and the epistle to the Romans. If you want to know of God and the Savior Christ you will find a solid foundation in these two well established texts.

The rest is just junk that will not meet the real need of your soul.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Noose]

60-70 gospels is nothing but speculation and the idea that the bible as it is today coming years after the events is also another speculation.
A casual reading of the bible reveals that it is 'time conscious' book; every event happened at the very specific minute/second that it was intended from the beginning by God.
You'll notice Jesus using phrases like "..my hour has not come or my hour has come..", even His birth was at specific intended minute that divided time/age.
Jesus would also use phrases like "..whosoever readeth.." clearly showing that there was specific intention to put it down in writing in the beginning.

There's a combination of these two things (time consciousness & intention to document) which proves that the bible was miraculously documented as intended by God from the beginning and not later but immediately as was revealed/inspired.

Rev 1: 1The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, 2who testifies to everything he saw—that is, the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. 3Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it, because the time is near.

Rev 14:13Then I heard a voice from heaven say, “Write this: Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on.”“Yes,” says the Spirit, “they will rest from their labor, for their deeds will follow them.”

From Rev 1, we know that the book was to be written, but when?
Rev 14 is time specific because the angel said that people who die in the Lord from that moment on- clearly showing that the application of the blood of the lamb to the end times people started that specific moment that the angel was speaking.
There's no way that book was written 70 years later when the angel was time conscious at that moment of revelation. The disciples and apostles had 3.5 years to work with and by the end of these 3.5 years, all scripture was ready (even though each book separate) as it is today.
I can confidently say that by 38 AD, all scripture were done.

 

[trofimus]

Need some help with some research I'm doing - maybe someone with knowledge of Christian history with regards to scripture can point me the right direction.

I'm interested in how the early Christians during the time of the apostles and generation after them viewed scripture- I imagine this is before the Bible to its current form of consisting of 4 gospels - I read somewhere there were around 60-70 gospels. Including those from Peter, Barnabas, Mary, Judas etc. Does anyone know how many there were and how many are still accessible?

Not every gospel writing of that time was from apostles and from Church.

Majority of them were fakes or gnostic inventions.

So, its probably better/safer to read early christian writings like by apostolic fathers (Hermas, Didache, Barnabas, Ignatios, Polykarp etc) then to try to dig for sectarian writings just because they are named "gospel of xxx".

 

[Depleted]

Need some help with some research I'm doing - maybe someone with knowledge of Christian history with regards to scripture can point me the right direction.

I'm interested in how the early Christians during the time of the apostles and generation after them viewed scripture- I imagine this is before the Bible to its current form of consisting of 4 gospels - I read somewhere there were around 60-70 gospels. Including those from Peter, Barnabas, Mary, Judas etc. Does anyone know how many there were and how many are still accessible?

F.F. Bruce's The Books and the Parchments: How we got our English Bible does full history of how the Bible came to be. Good book, but be aware, some of it gets bogged down with semantics and linguistics. (I happen to like semantics and linguistics, but even I found some of it drier than bones.) So, just skip the dry parts.

Spoiler alert: It really was a miracle of biblical proportions on how we ended up with the real Bible.

 

[Depleted]

60-70 gospels is nothing but speculation and the idea that the bible as it is today coming years after the events is also another speculation.
A casual reading of the bible reveals that it is 'time conscious' book; every event happened at the very specific minute/second that it was intended from the beginning by God.
You'll notice Jesus using phrases like "..my hour has not come or my hour has come..", even His birth was at specific intended minute that divided time/age.
Jesus would also use phrases like "..whosoever readeth.." clearly showing that there was specific intention to put it down in writing in the beginning.

There's a combination of these two things (time consciousness & intention to document) which proves that the bible was miraculously documented as intended by God from the beginning and not later but immediately as was revealed/inspired.

Rev 1: 1The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, 2who testifies to everything he saw—that is, the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. 3Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it, because the time is near.

Rev 14:13Then I heard a voice from heaven say, “Write this: Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on.”“Yes,” says the Spirit, “they will rest from their labor, for their deeds will follow them.”

From Rev 1, we know that the book was to be written, but when?
Rev 14 is time specific because the angel said that people who die in the Lord from that moment on- clearly showing that the application of the blood of the lamb to the end times people started that specific moment that the angel was speaking.
There's no way that book was written 70 years later when the angel was time conscious at that moment of revelation. The disciples and apostles had 3.5 years to work with and by the end of these 3.5 years, all scripture was ready (even though each book separate) as it is today.
I can confidently say that by 38 AD, all scripture were done.

Actually, those extra "gospels" started showing up within years of the real gospels and real epistles. And they caught on like wild fire too, except for one little thing. If you were a Christian, Rome was trying to kill you, so everyone went underground. And, if you were caught with anything that could be construed as Christian, (like carrying the gospels or epsitles with you), then they'd confiscate them too, and burn them as well as you.

So, the ones underground knew this, but had to decide which writings were worth dying over and which weren't. And they hid the writings accordingly. The ones that were good reading, but not worth dying over, were hidden in a relatively easy place to find. The ones worth dying over, (sacred), were hidden further in the back and in can
t-find-it spots. So, if they did get caught, the soldiers would search for the writing, and once they found the writings, they often stopped searching, which saved the sacred writing better.

And when Constantine came into power, and Christians no longer had to hide, the sacred stuff came out of hiding. And so did the less sacred stuff, including those suspect-gospels. That's when they had a group of scholars meet together (Nicene Council), and decide what was sacred and which wasn't. Despite all the Christians hiding for centuries, so little communication between groups, they all divided the piles the same way. The only not-quite-sure book there was was Book of James, but they decided it made the grade to be in the Bible. (Not everyone, but most.)

It really was a miracle how the Lord kept the writing for that many decades of hiding.

 

[Nehemiah6]

I'm interested in how the early Christians during the time of the apostles and generation after them viewed scripture

Scripture was viewed as the Word of God -- to be read, studied, and obeyed.

I read somewhere there were around 60-70 gospels. Including those from Peter, Barnabas, Mary, Judas etc. Does anyone know how many there were and how many are still accessible?

There were a lot of fake gospels floating around. Avoid them like the plague. They were written by Gnostics and are heretical.

 

[Truth_Seeker546]

So whats so fake about the gospel of Peter, barnabas, Mary? What were the mechanisms to select orthodoxy ones to non orthodox ones?

 

[tanakh]

So whats so fake about the gospel of Peter, barnabas, Mary? What were the mechanisms to select orthodoxy ones to non orthodox ones?

The main 'mechanism' as you put it was the guidance of the Holy spirit. Jesus told his Disciples that the Holy Spirit would lead them into all truth. If you look at it from a human viewpoint there was a common consensus among the churches as to which ones were true and which were false. If you were offered a badly made counterfeit note you would reject it. The same goes with the Gospels. If you compare one of these to those in the New Testament the difference becomes obvious.

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

The main 'mechanism' as you put it was the guidance of the Holy spirit. Jesus told his Disciples that the Holy Spirit would lead them into all truth. If you look at it from a human viewpoint there was a common consensus among the churches as to which ones were true and which were false. If you were offered a badly made counterfeit note you would reject it. The same goes with the Gospels. If you compare one of these to those in the New Testament the difference becomes obvious.

I agree, I had a book when I was young with a collection of Gnostic Gospels. Writings like "The Gospel of Mary". It was all over the place and some of it so obviously forgery. I didn't even consider it worth keeping for reference. And that's rare for me as I love books. You hit the nail on the head, when you get very familiar with the genuine, you recognise a forgery easily.

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

So whats so fake about the gospel of Peter, barnabas, Mary? What were the mechanisms to select orthodoxy ones to non orthodox ones?

One thing you can look for is that The New Testament is witnessed to by The Old Testament Books and vice-versa. They are an integrated whole. Those Gnostic writings don't have the stamp of authenticity in that way, you'll find them frequently contradicting The Law, Prophets and Apostles.

 

[Truth_Seeker546]

Well I see what some of you are saying -, but it doesn't make sense to me. If you already have the current bible as a standard to judge others than of course others will seem weird. What if Constantine had selected a different set of gospels in stead of the current 4? Also how are you comparing gospels to the old testament? The old testament doesnt even have the Concept of the trinity hence why you don't find the idea in Judaism. By that logic all the current gospels have been tampered with. I see what some of you are saying about the Holy spirit but that argument is made by every religion, not really objective is it?

 

[Johnny_B]

The writings of Paul were considered Scripture during the times they were being written. II Peter 3:15-16 “And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, 16as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures.”

 

[Noose]

Well I see what some of you are saying -, but it doesn't make sense to me. If you already have the current bible as a standard to judge others than of course others will seem weird. What if Constantine had selected a different set of gospels in stead of the current 4? Also how are you comparing gospels to the old testament? The old testament doesnt even have the Concept of the trinity hence why you don't find the idea in Judaism. By that logic all the current gospels have been tampered with. I see what some of you are saying about the Holy spirit but that argument is made by every religion, not really objective is it?

There's no such thing as current 4 gospels; the gospel is a testament of the works done by Jesus in fulfillment of what was already prophesied in the old testament. Even without the NT, the prophesy in OT was about God taking flesh to be a human, being born of a virgin/ dying for our sins on a cross and resurrecting in total victory over death and sin for our sake- And this is the whole gospel.

The father/Son/Holy spirit were spoken of by:

Isa 9:6 For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father,Prince of Peace.

Son= Son
Eternal father= Father
Wonderful counselor= Holy spirit

Do you have any other thing?