Election teaches that salvation comes from the Lord.

[reneweddaybyday]

Paul in context is speaking wisdom to mature Christians (2:6) about the things God has prepared for those who love Him (2:9) - the "deep things of God" that God's Spirit knows (2:10-13), etc. This is the context for 2:14. Then, by the time Paul gets to 3:1 he's saying he couldn't even teach these things to the young/infant Christians who could only drink milk - the basics of Scripture.

So, what Paul is talking about is wisdom only the mature in Christ could understand. Not even spiritually young Christians could understand it. Of course the unspiritual (the psuchikos man - the soulish man) could not understand it.

This does not say a man must be born again to receive the Gospel. It says neither the unbeliever nor the new Christian can understand the deep things of God that God has prepared for those who love Him. Paul could only teach this wisdom to the mature Christian, which he elsewhere refers to as the "spiritual Christian."

I have gone through these verses in 1 Corinthians 2 with rogerg in the past.

I'm down for discussing this section in 1 Corinthians 2 if you're interested.

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[Bob-Carabbio]

Election teaches that salvation comes from the Lord.

Actually The Bible teaches that. Eph 2:8,9 is one place.

"Election", like "Regeneration" is just another religious buzz word with hundreds of definitions depending on religious paradigm.

The Bible clearly states that if God doesn't DRAW YOU to Christ" - you ain't coming. In my case it was by hHoly SPirit CONVICTION OF SIN which led to surrender, and REPENTANCE, crying out in FAITH from the Holy Spirit to be saved. And then I was.

The ONE THING that Reformed / Calvinist theology actually gets absolutely RIGHT - is that it ALL STARTS WITH GOD. HE moves first.

 

[selahsays]

Actually The Bible teaches that. Eph 2:8,9 is one place.

"Election", like "Regeneration" is just another religious buzz word with hundreds of definitions depending on religious paradigm.

The Bible clearly states that if God doesn't DRAW YOU to Christ" - you ain't coming. In my case it was by hHoly SPirit CONVICTION OF SIN which led to surrender, and REPENTANCE, crying out in FAITH from the Holy Spirit to be saved. And then I was.

The ONE THING that Reformed / Calvinist theology actually gets absolutely RIGHT - is that it ALL STARTS WITH GOD. HE moves first.

Amen. God loved us first.
We love Him because He first loved us. - 1 John 4:19

 

[Moses_Young]

Yea, whether top to bottom or circum(vented?), it's still completely torn away. And as I think more about it, neither was the veil to the temple nor the foreskin is so easily torn. I vaguely remember reading of the veil being extraordinarily thick, giving me the impression that it doesn't 'flap in the wind.'

I'm relieved God commanded a sharp implement be used (for the metaphor), 'cause tearing it away paints a more disturbing image in my mind - similar to how tearing off a nail is more painful than trimming it off, but times 1000. I agree that both the temple veil and foreskin of the heart do represent tough barriers between us and God's rightful place that He fortunately has (removed) and does remove.

So, I did mean to be in the sense of complete removal, and so reattaching it would require a rather intentional operation, with the help of a needle and sutures and a determined (steady) hand, not that nuts and bolts and electric volt charges need to be applied, but...

Lol. Like you say, the "uncircumcising" of a heart would take a certain type of Frankenstein-type mentality to even consider, let alone attempt. I don't think God would allow it, although the actions and words of some claiming to be Christians from time to time have left me wondering if it could happen...

I'm pretty that, if my thoughts were an animal, they'd be wild horses.

I don't think there's anything wrong with having wild-horse type thoughts! Wild horses are so much freer than tamed ones, although probably more dangerous!

 

[wolfwint]

He’s already on his throne is the idea in the heavenly ( spiritual ) realms in the new Jerusalem and many saints are there with him

“ But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come? ….it is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

…And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:34-35, 44-45, 47, 49-50‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, and came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭27:52-53‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭23:43‬ ‭

“The LORD hath prepared his throne in the heavens; And his kingdom ruleth over all.”
‭‭Psalm‬ ‭103:19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.”
‭‭John‬ ‭18:36‬ ‭

“And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all. And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony. He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true. For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand. He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.”
‭‭John‬ ‭3:31-36‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also “

“So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭3:1-3‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“but the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.”
‭‭2 Peter‬ ‭3:7-8, 10-11, 13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

notice the apostles never speak of esrthly Jerusalem being restored or Jesus reigning in it for a thousand years it’s only seen in johns spiritual heavenly vision of apacolypse ? But the doctrine when they tell us what we’re waiting for is Jesus return when we’ll be changed if we’re still alive or raised up if we slept beforehand

See if Jesus is ruling on earth for a thousand years then why this ?

“For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”
‭‭1 Thessalonians‬ ‭4:16-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:51-52‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus is in the new Jerusalem the reality of Gods promised land and in the end he will gather his people for the eternal things and destroy this one we see like Peter is explaining in chapter 3 of his second epistle above but we have a promised land that will eventually become the new creation when this one ends it’s already a kingdom with people
Redeemed from earth in heaven thoer spirits alive and well with Jesus

“These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. …..But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭11:13, 16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“but ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, to the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, and to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭12:22-24‬ ‭KJV‬‬


I think ( just my belief ) Jesus kingdom is In Heaven and many are already with him reigning and rejoicing like revelation 12 shows us even while earth is being ran down by Satan and his beast and it’s inhabitants oppressed heaven is celebrated rating the kingdom after they had died on earth but they are rejoicing in heavens kingdom.

i think the ot prophecies we’re to be fulfilled in Jesus generation and the nt will be at his second coming the “ thousand year “ riegn I think is in heavens kingdom

But how they can be fullfilled? Jesus was not sitting in the Tempel to rule. Israel had never a time of peace, after they came back from the exile.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

But how they can be fullfilled? Jesus was not sitting in the Tempel to rule. Israel had never a time of peace, after they came back from the exile.

“If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭3:1-2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You’re looking to the wrong place for a temple he is in His temple

“Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. But he spake of the temple of his body.”
‭‭John‬ ‭2:19, 21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“The LORD is in his holy temple, The LORD's throne is in heaven: His eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men.”
‭‭Psalm‬ ‭11:4‬ ‭

“But the LORD is in his holy temple: let all the earth keep silence before him.”
‭‭Habakkuk‬ ‭2:20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens; a minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭8:1-2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building; neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭9:11-12‬ ‭

People don’t realize but The earthly temple was never Gods tabernacle but a pattern shown to Moses of the real heavenly things

“who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭8:5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The true things are not in this world they are those things Jesus told us about regarding his everlasting kingdom not of this world but of the world to come

there’s not going to be a man made temple where God dwells ever he left them and entered heaven in the ot when they worshipped the calf thier tabernacle was just a copy of the real things the temples they built were just patterns of the things Jesus would build in the future

 

[Burn1986]

I just made some popcorn for this thread. Guys are verbally killing each they out there. It’s like a machine gun shooting “spiritual truth” bullets.