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Crazylove
Guest
U hav a lot of ground to cover! I saw someone else from Estonia on here. Let your light shine in th dark country your in. Plant some Jesus in their hearts, get th Word in there ears. You might want to see if u can team up w/ some friends or even th person on here and do some major street preaching!
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Thorsson
Guest
The crusaders who killed conquered Estonia with brute force, violence, slaughtering the natives and so on did so much moral damage to Christianity in the minds of the Estonians 800 years ago that those wounds have not healed. Christianity was brought here throght conquest, the Estonians did not surrender before there were no longer men who could carry a sword.
I support Martin Luther's idea that Christiantiy shouldn't be spread through war and what happened was a big mistake.
I'm the only slightly religious Estonian I know of. For most Americans, I would appear as an atheist with my views.
Also, street preaching and disturbing other people on the streets (that's what it goes under) would be an offence here, as it is in most European countries.
My Grandkids lived in England, Netherlands, Belgium and Singapore for nine years. At times they couldn't find a church that didn't seem dead to them, especially in the large cathedrals. Singapore was the best.
In America, from what I am experiencing, you really can't tell a Christian from an agnostic once they are away from the church in most cases. Part of church philosophy that cuts across most denominations is for the tolerance government preaches. Almost all say to not read any law in the bible, that would mean that you don't worship in spirit and truth, yet there is usually as much immorality within the church as outside the church.
Also, government is taking the place of family as God gave family to us as far as where you go for security. Every year, there is a new law that results in taking God out of our lives more and more.
Perhaps I can see this clearer than most, I was born in 1925, so I can compare how life was lived over a wider span of time.
Estonia might be leading the pack, but the last days scene seems stronger every day, everywhere.
In America, from what I am experiencing, you really can't tell a Christian from an agnostic once they are away from the church in most cases. Part of church philosophy that cuts across most denominations is for the tolerance government preaches. Almost all say to not read any law in the bible, that would mean that you don't worship in spirit and truth, yet there is usually as much immorality within the church as outside the church.
Also, government is taking the place of family as God gave family to us as far as where you go for security. Every year, there is a new law that results in taking God out of our lives more and more.
Perhaps I can see this clearer than most, I was born in 1925, so I can compare how life was lived over a wider span of time.
Estonia might be leading the pack, but the last days scene seems stronger every day, everywhere.
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Ecclesiastik
Guest
Street preaching is an offense pretty much anywhere (including in the "religious" America). I'm living in Italy right now and there are some American missionaries here who say that you shouldn't street preach here because it won't work for Italians cause they don't like it. NOBODY likes it. They didn't like it in the times of the Old Testament or the New Testament and they sure don't like it now. Yet, it is both a biblical and a good method.
I'm saddened that your views would be considered atheistic by Americans. I hope you are able to grow from the posts here and I'm here for ya if you ever want to talk.
I'm saddened that your views would be considered atheistic by Americans. I hope you are able to grow from the posts here and I'm here for ya if you ever want to talk.
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Thorsson
Guest
The earth is 4.54 billion years old and life appeared on its surface within its first billion years. That's an undeniable fact. Contrary to Americans I know that the earth is older than 6000 years.
But I'm a Christian, I believe that Jesus was the son of God, sent here to turn us into one true religion, that being Christianity.
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Ecclesiastik
Guest
Actually that's not an undeniable fact. Science's "undeniable facts" change every year. Scientists and explorers that were formerly lauded and praised in their day are now scorned and laughed at. It is the nature of science to update itself for its many errors. It is not the nature of the Bible to do so. Think on this.
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Thorsson
Guest
Actually that's not an undeniable fact. Science's "undeniable facts" change every year. Scientists and explorers that were formerly lauded and praised in their day are now scorned and laughed at. It is the nature of science to update itself for its many errors. It is not the nature of the Bible to do so. Think on this.
Since radiometric dating was taken into use, we know the precise age of almost everything on our planet (also the planet itself).
From Wikipedia:
"The age of the Earth is 4.54 ± 0.05 billion years (4.54 × 10[SUP]9[/SUP] years ± 1%).[SUP][1][/SUP][SUP][2][/SUP][SUP][3][/SUP] This age is based on evidence from radiometric age dating of meteorite material and is consistent with the ages of the oldest-known terrestrial and lunar samples. Following the scientific revolution and the development of radiometric age dating, measurements of lead in uranium-rich minerals showed that some were in excess of a billion years old.[SUP][4][/SUP]
The oldest such minerals analyzed to date – small crystals of zircon from the Jack Hills of Western Australia – are at least 4.404 billion years old.[SUP][5][/SUP][SUP][6][/SUP][SUP][7][/SUP] Comparing the mass and luminosity of the Sun to those of other stars, it appears that the solar system cannot be much older than those rocks. Calcium-aluminium-rich inclusions – the oldest known solid constituents within meteorites that are formed within the solar system – are 4.567 billion years old,[SUP][8][/SUP][SUP][9][/SUP] giving an age for the solar system and an upper limit for the age of Earth."
Age of the Earth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
That is seriously ROFL worthy.
And... you're 20 years old... so it goes without saying you know everything about everything.
: )
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Thorsson
Guest
Argue the facts, not my age.
I have a very good educational basis. There's a reason why Estonian upper secondary school students score among the world's highest, yearly, in the PISA test. Currently I'm in university.
I'm not blindly faithful, I can also accept facts. If you ignore the contents of my post and only talk about me, then I'm going to ignore you.
Radiometric Dating:
1. It is impossible, utterly impossible, to know the original state of any sample, in it's distant past.
The most anyone can do is guess, or present historical hocus pocus based on circular reasoning.
Nobody can go back billions of years into the past and see the original state of any sample.
If you don't know the original state, you have no way to measure how much radioactive material has dissipated.
2. It is impossible to know whether or not any outside forces have acted upon the sample over time.
3. It is impossible to know if the decay rate has always remained constant.
It only takes one of these to shoot down radiometric dating, and we have at least 3 things which can never be proven.
1. It is impossible, utterly impossible, to know the original state of any sample, in it's distant past.
The most anyone can do is guess, or present historical hocus pocus based on circular reasoning.
Nobody can go back billions of years into the past and see the original state of any sample.
If you don't know the original state, you have no way to measure how much radioactive material has dissipated.
2. It is impossible to know whether or not any outside forces have acted upon the sample over time.
3. It is impossible to know if the decay rate has always remained constant.
It only takes one of these to shoot down radiometric dating, and we have at least 3 things which can never be proven.
And the sad part is in any other branch of science it would make those test INVALID and they would never be used as PROOF of anything.
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Ecclesiastik
Guest
Thorsson,
The current school systems of most of the Western world act with a bias similar to any older school system of Greek philosophy. They claim to be unbiased but they are not. They are incredibly biased against the idea of religion being true. Because of that, they will accept "facts" that are not facts in order to disprove it so that they will not even have to entertain the notion of religion except in a historical sense. If you do not think it is true, then I beg you to do the research. I once thought creation science was non-sense until I did the research myself.
The current school systems of most of the Western world act with a bias similar to any older school system of Greek philosophy. They claim to be unbiased but they are not. They are incredibly biased against the idea of religion being true. Because of that, they will accept "facts" that are not facts in order to disprove it so that they will not even have to entertain the notion of religion except in a historical sense. If you do not think it is true, then I beg you to do the research. I once thought creation science was non-sense until I did the research myself.
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Thorsson
Guest
I was away from this forum for a long time because I was rather upset with the lack of intellect I saw... Anyway, in my school, we were taught about all the religions, from Buddhism, Hinduism, Christianity, Islam etc. to other major religions you can think of + philosophy from the first Greek philosophers to the philosophy of the 21st century. How's that for bias?
American schools are biased, some of them still teach that dinosaurs walked together with men.
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Tintin
Guest
Very few. Only those that believe the Bible is Absolute Truth and that Genesis 1-11 contain historical accounts and literal truth do this. Sadly, evolutionary theory is humanism's god now, and also many Christians.
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Thorsson
Guest
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Ecclesiastik
Guest
Lack of intellect? If you were brought up in North Korea or Soviet Russia, you would have walked away from me and thought I was stupid if I told you there was a God in heaven. If you were brought up in Nazi Germany, you would have probably thought me a fool to say that Jews were people and should be treated as such.
Simply because you study religions and Greek philosophy doesn't mean there is no bias. Don't you realize what a bias is? It's not necessarily neglecting the study of something. It is putting it in a box for a reason that is not based on logic but more on emotion, convenience, & etc.
Heres a fact for you, nobody is without bias. No school system is without bias. Everyone operates with presuppositions. If you studied philosophy, why didn't they teach you that?
"evolution and God do not nullify each other"
If you mean evolution does not nullify the idea of a god, you are correct. If you are saying that evolution does not nullify the idea of the God of the Bible, you are wrong. It stands in stark contrast to the Genesis account. If you want to think of the Genesis account as a metaphor, then you are welcome to. But it is only a matter of time before the entire Bible becomes a metaphor to you and, eventually, a work of fiction in your mind.
You are not to twist Scripture to fit to this age of thinking, rather you should bring your own way of thinking into subjection with Scripture. Either believe God or don't. Don't play games.
Science is wrong all the time (even when the entire world comes to think of one theory as fact) and has room to update itself. For example, Stephen Hawking just said there are no black holes. The Bible doesn't have this room. Either it is wrong and we throw it out, or it is right and it stays on our desk.
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biscuit
Guest
Relax Thorsson, some American have an uncanny sense of humor ... they are just teasing you.
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AgeofKnowledge
Guest
This will be news to the theistic evolutionary organization BioLogos. You better rush over there and let Dr. Francis Collins and the tens of thousands of scientists and intellectuals associated with BioLogos that know a lot more than you that the God of the Bible cannot be the God of evolution as they assert the exact opposite un-metaphorically speaking.
BioLogos: Science and faith in harmony
Ignorance and bias are leaking out of you like a lemon that got run over in the street.
BioLogos: Science and faith in harmony
Ignorance and bias are leaking out of you like a lemon that got run over in the street.