#241 Dan
Are we justified by faith alone?
Dan says, “We are justified by faith IN CHRIST alone (Romans 3:24; 5:1).
We are not justified by the kind of faith that "remains alone" (solitary, unfruitful, barren) which demonstrates that this claim of faith is not genuine faith but an empty profession of faith/a dead faith - James 2:14-20. Man is saved through faith and not by works (Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9); yet genuine faith is vindicated, substantiated, evidenced by works (James 2:14-24). *Please pay close attention - The word "alone" in regards to salvation through faith "in Christ alone" conveys the message that Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not on the merits of our works. It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24-28; 4:2-6; 5:1); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony.*
Amen! Unfortunately, I see that everything I explained to you here went right over your head.
Let’s look at the two passages he cites:
[SUP]23 [/SUP]for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, [SUP]24 [/SUP]being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus; (Rom. 3: 23, 24)
1 Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, (Rom. 5: 1)
What part of "being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus" and "having been justified by faith" don't you understand? *Keys words here - justified, grace, redemption in Christ Jesus, faith.
Dan says that genuine faith is vindicated and substantiated and evidenced by works but he forgot one term, probably the most important in this account, FAITH IS PERFECTED BY WORKS. Faith is not complete until it obeys.
As I already explained to you numerous times, "perfected" or "made complete" by works means bring to maturity, carry to the end, to complete like love in 1 John 4:18. It
does not mean that Abraham was finally saved AFTER he accomplished the work of offering up Isaac on the altar, many years after he
believed God and his
faith was accounted to him for righteousness in Genesis 15:6. When Abraham performed the work of offering up Isaac on the altar in Genesis 22; he fulfilled the expectations created by the pronouncement of his faith in Genesis 15:6. You are confused about the word "perfected" and this remains a major stumbling block for you! Abraham was already saved many years BEFORE he obeyed God by offereing up Isaac on the altar. You are making this out to be a lot more complicated than it really is and it's all because you erroneously teach salvation by works.
In James 2:14, we read of one who
"says-claims he has faith" but has
no works (produces no works to back up his claim). This is
not genuine faith, but a
bare profession of faith. So when James asks, "Can
that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an
empty profession of faith/a dead faith. *Good works are the fruit, by product and demonstrative evidence of genuine saving faith, but not the essence of faith and not the means of our salvation. James
does not teach that we are saved "by" works. His concern is to
SHOW the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine. Simple! James is discussing the
proof of faith
(says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18), not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God (Romans 4:2-3). Works bear out the justification that already came by faith.
I don’t know the heart of Dan but I do know that neither of those two passages state that justification is by faith alone.
Neither of those two passages state that justification is by faith AND works. NOWHERE does Paul state that justification is based on the merits of our works. In Romans 5:1, Paul said justified by
faith "apart from additions or modifications." Grace and Christ's finished work of redemption is God's part and faith is our part. The Bible clearly teaches in over many passages of scripture that we are saved through belief/faith "apart from additions or modifications." (John 1:12; 3:15,16,18; 6:40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 13:39; 16:31; Romans 1:16; 3:22-28; 4:5; Galatians 2:16; Ephesians 2:8; 2 Timothy 3:15; 1 John 5:13 etc..). You don't need to add the word "alone" next to belief/faith in each of these passages of scripture in order to figure out that the words belief/faith "stand alone" in these many passages of scripture in connection with receiving eternal life/salvation. Do these many passages of scripture say faith "plus something else?" NO! So then it's faith (rightly understood) IN CHRIST alone.
And I know that James, the brother of the Lord, tells us, “You see that a man is justified by works, and not faith alone.”
CONTEXT! James is not using the word "justified" here to mean "accounted as righteous" but is
"shown to be righteous." Again, James is discussing the
proof of faith
(says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18), not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God (Romans 4:2-3).
(James 2: 24) James repudiates the faith alone view!
James repudiates the
kind of faith that
claims to be genuine (
says-claims he has faith but has
no works to back up his claim), thus
demonstrating by the
lack of works that this is
not genuine faith but an
empty profession of faith, a dead faith. That's what James means by "alone" - barren of works." When you hear a genuine believer say that we are saved by "faith alone," they are not saying that we are saved by the "kind" of faith that "remains alone" - barren of works. Saving faith
results in producing good works (Ephesians 2:8-10), so it's
not alone in that sense but it's still
faith (belief, trust, reliance) in Christ for salvation part of the equation that "alone" saves you as the instrumental means. Good works are the fruit, by product and demonstrative evidence of genuine saving faith in Christ, but they are not the instrumental means by which we receive eternal life as well. Good works are the FRUIT of salvation, but NOT the root. So the word "alone" in regards to salvation through faith in "Christ alone" conveys the message that
Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone," not on the merits of our works. It is through faith IN CHRIST alone (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). Simple! Too simple! This is not hard to understand, just hard for you to ACCEPT! Faith (the act of trusting) in Christ "alone" for salvation and faith that remains "alone" (barren of works) are two separate alones in connection with two different things.
We must ask, “In what sense is James saying this?” For we also know that said, “For if Abraham is justified by works, he has something to boast about; but not before God.” (Rom. 4: 2)
In the Strong's Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible, the Greek word for justified "dikaioo" #1344 is:
1. to render righteous or such he ought to be
2. to show, exhibit, evince, one to be righteous, such as he is and wishes himself to be considered
3. to declare, pronounce, one to be just, righteous, or such as he ought to be
In the Bible the word "justified" is often used in the "legal" (judicial) sense. Paul often uses the word "justified" in this "legal" sense (Romans 3:24,28; 4:2; 5:1; 5:9; 8:30 etc..). The word justified is also used in a "declarative sense." James has this aspect of justification in mind. As we have seen, his concern is to
show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine. This is why James says I will
SHOW you my faith by my works.
In Matthew 12:37, "For by your words you will be
justified, and by your words you will be condemned." This is because our words reveal the state of our hearts. Words will appear to be
evidences for, or against a man's being in a state of grace and righteousness.
God is said to have been
justified by those who were baptized by John the Baptist (Luke 7:29). This act pronounced or declared God to be righteous. It did not make him righteous. The basis or ground for the pronouncement was the fact that God IS righteous. Notice that the NIV reads,
"acknowledged that God's way was right.." The ESV says,
"they declared God just.." This is the sense in which God was justified,
"shown to be righteous."
Matthew 11:19 "The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, 'Behold, a gluttonous man and a drunkard, a friend of tax-gatherers and sinners!' Yet wisdom is justified/vindicated/ (dikaioo - shown to be right) by her deeds."
IMO James is saying that a man is justified by works only in the sense that the works perfect or complete our faith.
Justified by works means that we are
"shown to be righteous" by our works (James 2:14-18), but
not accounted as righteous by our works (Romans 4:2-3). Works perfect or complete our faith does not mean we are saved by works. It simply means bring to maturity, carry to the end, to complete like love in 1 John 4:18. When Abraham performed the good work in Genesis 22; he fulfilled the expectations created by the pronouncement of his faith in Genesis 15:6. Simple! *Notice that James was said to be "justified by works" (James 2:21) many years AFTER Abraham was said to believe God and his
faith was accounted to him for righteousness (Genesis 15:6; Romans 4:3). *According to your logic, Abraham remained a lost man UNTIL he offered up Isaac on the altar, which is when his faith was said to be perfected (James 2:22). Your logic of being saved by a "perfected faith" negates Genesis 15:6 and Romans 4:2-3.
We are justified by a “perfected faith”, a “completed faith” and we are saved by a perfected faith and a perfected love.
So according to you, Abraham was not saved UNTIL his faith was perfected, AFTER he offered up Isaac on the altar, (James 2:22) which equates to Abraham being saved by works, which negates Genesis 15:6 and Romans 4:2-3. We are saved the moment that we place our faith (belief, trust, reliance) in CHRIST ALONE for salvation BEFORE we accomplish anything further. We are saved by grace through faith, NOT WORKS, then created in Christ Jesus UNTO/FOR good works (Ephesians 2:8-10). You have the tail wagging the dog, the cart before the horse!
The very fact that the Scriptures speak of a “perfected faith” and a “perfected love”, indicates that there is a lower level or levels of both faith and love.
So you are saying that believers are not actually saved through faith UNTIL their faith and love are perfected? How many good works and acts of love does that take? Where do you draw the line in the sand and say that you have accomplished x,y and z so NOW your faith and love are perfected and NOW the Lord will finally be able to save you?
John tells us that the one who keeps His word is the one in whom the love of God has been truly perfected. Furthermore John says that the one who claims to know God, but does not keep His commandments is a liar. (1 John 2: 4, 5) Paul, on the other hand, speaks of works, of which one may boast, works of the law (based on performance, not faith) and works of merit. (Gal. 2; 16; Titus 3: 5)
You continue to erroneously equate the word "perfected" with salvation by works. *Notice the word
claims to know God (1 John 2:4), but does not keep His commandments. Just like James 2:14 -
claims to have faith but has no works. 1 John 2:3 - Now by this we
know that we know Him (demonstrative evidence),
if we keep His commandments. 1 John 2:4 - He who
says-claims, "I know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a
liar, and the
truth is not in him. By the way, the word "keep" comes from the Greek word tereo Strongs #5083 and means
to keep, to guard, to watch over, preserve. It does not mean sinless, perfect obedience to all of Christ's commandments 100% of the time, so don't turn this into salvation by works. Believers keep His commandments BECAUSE we are saved and not to become saved. You must not confuse DESCRIPTIVE passages of scripture with PRESCRIPTIVE passages of scripture. You also cannot dissect the law. Good works fall under the MORAL aspect of the law so your saved by "these works" and just not "those works" argument fails. Your gospel plan is based on man's performance and is a "different" gospel.
To say that we are not justified by the kind of faith that “remains alone,” indicates that it was alone when it justified.
When we are initially justified by faith in Christ, how many works have we performed in the next couple of seconds? You make it sound like James is saying that our faith cannot save us UNTIL we perform a list of works and then we are saved by those works. That is NOT what James is saying. In James 2:15, we read - "If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, "Depart in peace, be warmed and filled," but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit?" Believers do not feed and clothe brothers and sisters who are in need "instantaneously upon conversion." It takes time to come upon these situations after conversion which demonstrates genuine faith by helping them or a dead faith by simply saying to them, depart in peace, be warmed and filled. You make it sound like our faith is dead UNTIL it produces good works. That's like saying that a tree is dead UNTIL it produces fruit. A dead faith does not produce good works in order to become a living faith but BECAUSE it's a living faith (alive in Christ by grace through faith - Ephesians 2:5-8). A dead tree does not produce fruit in order to become a living tree but BECAUSE it's a living tree.
And James tells us that a faith, which is by itself, is dead and useless. (James 2: 17, 20)
Given time to produce works and "demonstrate" whether it's alive or not. You misinterpret these verses to mean that our faith is dead upon conversion (Ephesians 2:5-8) and is not alive UNTIL we produce good works later (Ephesians 2:10). That is not what James is saying. By your misinterpretation of James 2:14-24, you negate Ephesians 2:5-10.
We are justified by a perfected faith, a faith that was working with and accompanied by works of faith leading to perfection of that faith.
Abraham's faith was not said to be perfected until he offered up Isaac on the altar (James 2:22) yet James was said to believe God and his faith was accounted to him for righteousness many years before (Genesis 15:6). We are justified (in a legal sense) through faith, not works (Romans 4:2-6) and we are justified in a declarative sense "shown to be righteous" by works (James 2:14-18). Your erroneous conclusion leads to salvation through faith AND works. We are saved through faith, NOT WORKS.
We are saved and justified by faith, but not by faith alone.
As I already explained numerous times, it is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24-28; 4:2-6; 5:1); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony.*
We are not saved nor justified by works of the Law nor works of merit.
We are not saved or justified (in the legal sense/accounted as righteous) by works of any kind. Any works that you "add" to salvation through faith (even if they fall under the MORAL aspect of the law) become works of merit because then we are saved by those works. You just don't get it!
We are saved and justified by a faith that is mingled with love.
We are saved through faith and then afterwards our faith works through love because we are born of God, we have become new creations in Christ and we have received the love of God in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us (believers - Romans 5:5).
We are saved and justified by faith which works with works of faith to perfect faith.
Basically you are saying that we are saved and justified (in the legal sense-accounted as righteous) based on faith AND works, so why don't you just come out and plainly admit it.
The works of Christ were completed by Christ but they are received by faith which works in love.
They are received by faith in Christ (which trusts exclusively IN HIM for salvation and not in works) then afterwards works in love because we are in Him.
We are justified by works of faith, but only in the sense that they perfect both faith and love.
God bless.
We are justified by works, but only in the sense that we are "shown to be righteous" (James 2:14-24) and not in the sense that we are "accounted as righteous" (Romans 3:24; 4:2-6; 5:1). Perfected faith (that you confuse with salvation by works) means bring to maturity, carry to the end, to complete like love in 1 John 4:18. So when was Abraham's
faith accounted to him for righteousness? In Genesis 15:6 when he believed God or not until many years later, after he offered up Isaac on the altar in Genesis 22? His faith was said to be perfected in James 2:22 in regards to what he did in Genesis 22. So when was Abraham saved? Before or after he offered up Isaac on the altar? It's a rhetorical question.
Please prayerfully consider the truth and God bless. I continue to hope and pray that you will repent and believe the gospel.
