Faith is a work.

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posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,094
113
#41
John 6:29 “ this is the work of God that you believe ...”. Faith is a work,too. Do you want to eliminate that? Now how do you respond to that verse?
No man can come to Me, except the Father, which hath sent Me, draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
(John 6:44)
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,704
3,649
113
#42
What about Acts 8 where Phillip was converting the lost in Samaria. Verse 12 and 13 says that when they BELIEVED Phillip preaching the things about Jesus, they were BAPTIZED...every example of conversion in the NT has sinners being saved this way. Here are some scriptures. Please read and study them.; Acts 2:38 they believed (what shall we do) and we’re baptized. Acts 8- the Samaritans and the Ethiopian eunuch. Phillip preached Jesus to him and although nothing is said in the scriptures about Phillip teaching baptism, yet as soon as the eunuch came to some water, he said “See, here is water. What hinders me from being baptized?”” And he was baptized. You see the implication. Phillip MUST HAVE TAUGHT baptism. How else would the eunuch have known to do it. ? Then we have Acts 9 the conversion of Saul (Paul). Obviously he believed on the road to Damascus when he talked to Jesus, and he asked, “what would you have me do Lord? This was the perfect place for Jesus to say, you don’t have to do anything you are already saved. Or why didn’t Jesus ask him to say @The sinners prayer” ( not found ANYWHERE in the Bible). Jesus didn’t say there’s nothing you need to do, instead he said “ Go into the city and there it will be told you what you MUST DO”.. later in Acts 22:16 Paul is recounting his conversion to the Jewish mob and he said after 3 days Ananias came to him and told him to “ A rise and be baptized and WASH AWAY YOUR SINS”. This corresponds completely with what Peter said about baptism in Acts 2:38 @baptism for the remission of sins. Quickly, I will just mention Lydia, Acts 16:14,15 ( beloved and was baptized) and the Phillipian jailor. He was told to believe and he would be saved then they taught him the word of the Lord and he was baptized in the wee hours of the morning. They didn’t wait bc baptism was essential to salvation. Everywhere in the NT people obeyed the instructions in Mark 16:16. You will find no contradiction. I left out Acts 10 the conversion of Cornelius ( by mistake) but the apostle Peter COMMANDED them to be baptized inverses 47 and 48. Jesus himself commanded baptism in the great commission in Matthew 28.:18,19. I don’t have a problem believing Mark 16:16 but if you have doubts then I hope you will take the time to study each one of these conversions and see for yourself that belief and baptism equals salvation. God bless.
None of those verses point to the error that is through baptism we are saved. The closest is Acts 22:16 ...
Acts 22:16 NKJV
[16] And now why are you waiting? Arise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.'

which is connected with calling on the name of the Lord. If washing away sins by baptism were true, it would contradict scores of verses that point to the fact thai it is the Blood of Jesus, the Lamb of God, that takes away sin...
Revelation 1:5 NKJV
[5] and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth. To Him who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood,

Ephesians 1:7 NKJV
[7] In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace

Colossians 1:14 NKJV
[14] in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins.

Hebrews 9:22 KJV
[22] And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.

So cherry picking verses won't cut it, especially from non doctrinal books like Acts.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#43
So this went from a faith is a work thread to a baptismal regeneration thread?

CC is being over run
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,094
113
#44
So this went from a faith is a work thread to a baptismal regeneration thread?

CC is being over run

Hivyo hii inatoka kwenye imani ni thread ya kazi kwenye thread ya kuzaliwa upya?

((just in case it also needs to be a tongues thread :LOL:))
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,704
3,649
113
#45
Looking around at some of the other Forums, CC may be the last bastion in Christian Forumville.
I'm making my last stand here, so forgive me when I sound a bit brash with some of these persistent loo loos.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#46
Its all good bro.. I fear CC will go like many other chats, and lose the good it has done for years.
 
Dec 9, 2011
13,703
1,715
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#48
The majority does not prove a thing right. In fact I think I am probably in pretty good company since Jesus said...straight is the way that leads to eternal life and few there be that find it, but broad is the way to destruction and many there be that go there in. No, it doesn’t bother me, only makes me sad that I am not able to save more.
broad Is the way that leads to destruction and you are teaching salvation by faith AND works?Imagine that.
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
12,818
8,594
113
#49
Hivyo hii inatoka kwenye imani ni thread ya kazi kwenye thread ya kuzaliwa upya?

((just in case it also needs to be a tongues thread :LOL:))
Does that say Obama was born in Kenya?
 

theanointedwinner

Well-known member
Nov 6, 2018
2,058
1,125
113
#51
I just have faith that "faith is not works", so by faith I disagree
 

Beckworth

Active member
May 15, 2019
146
30
28
#52
None of those verses point to the error that is through baptism we are saved. The closest is Acts 22:16 ...
Acts 22:16 NKJV
[16] And now why are you waiting? Arise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.'

which is connected with calling on the name of the Lord. If washing away sins by baptism were true, it would contradict scores of verses that point to the fact thai it is the Blood of Jesus, the Lamb of God, that takes away sin...
Revelation 1:5 NKJV
[5] and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth. To Him who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood,

Ephesians 1:7 NKJV
[7] In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace

Colossians 1:14 NKJV
[14] in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins.

Hebrews 9:22 KJV
[22] And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.

So cherry picking verses won't cut it, especially from non doctrinal books like Acts.
At what point does the blood of Jesus wash our sins away? Is it faith? When do we come into contact with his blood? His blood was shed in his death. Now read Romans 6:3-9. We were baptized into his death. Romans pictures us going down into the water a sinful man and coming up out of the water a new man. Resurrected with Christ. In “newness of life”. The only place in the Bible that we come into contac with his blood is in baptism...baptized into his death. That’s where the blood of Christ is. And that’s where his blood washes our sins away.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,704
3,649
113
#53
At what point does the blood of Jesus wash our sins away?
When we confess our sins.
Romans pictures us going down into the water a sinful man and coming up out of the water a new man.
Romans never mentions water or water baptism.

If baptism is so instrumental to salvation, why does Paul say...
"I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;"
(1Co 1:14)

Rather, Paul says...

For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
(Rom 1:16-17) (not works)
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#54
beckworth

WOULD YOU PLEASE WRITE IN PARAGRAPHS?

THE WALL OF TEXT MAKES ME CROSS EYED o_O
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#55
Hivyo hii inatoka kwenye imani ni thread ya kazi kwenye thread ya kuzaliwa upya?


((just in case it also needs to be a tongues thread :LOL:))
oh oh oh! I can translate that

you are saying God forgive me for mocking what I do not understand

gee. things could get serious
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,094
113
#56
The only place in the Bible that we come into contac with his blood is in baptism...
'only' ?

Then Jesus said unto them,
Verily, verily I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink His blood, ye have no life in you.
Whosoever eateth My flesh, and drinketh My blood, hath eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.
For My flesh is meat indeed, and My blood is drink indeed.
He that eateth My flesh, and drinketh My blood, dwelleth in Me, and I in him.
As that living Father hath sent Me, so live I by the Father, and he that eateth Me, even he shall live by Me.
(John 6:53-57)
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,094
113
#57
Can you boast about faith?
i can if i think 'i have faith' because i'm more clever than the person who doesn't.
i can if i think '
i have faith' because i'm more righteous than the person who doesn't.
i can if i think faith is my own work.


What do you have that you did not receive?
And if you did receive it, why do you boast as if you had not received it?
(1 Corinthians 4:7)
we as humans are very good at boasting.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,094
113
#58
The majority does not prove a thing right. In fact I think I am probably in pretty good company since Jesus said...straight is the way that leads to eternal life and few there be that find it, but broad is the way to destruction and many there be that go there in. No, it doesn’t bother me, only makes me sad that I am not able to save more.
it's become a very common fallacy around here to allude to Matthew 7:13-14 and assert that because you are in the minority, you must be right.

the Bible discussion on a Christian chat board is a minority to begin with. we don't represent the majority of the internet, by far. we don't represent the majority of church members, either - most of them don't read their Bibles and don't talk about what's in them. we don't even represent the majority of people who do read their Bibles; most of them don't actively go out and look for a community to discuss what they read. you're not even talking to a majority of CC's membership -- a lot of people avoid the BDF section like plague.

you're already among a minority.
if you have two groups, a '
many' and a 'few' -- and after taking steps to isolate the 'few' if you find a minority within that minority, could it be that what you've discovered is a bit of the majority? a 'many' that found its way into the 'few' ?


being right may make one unpopular, for sure - but being unpopular doesn't make a person right.
 
May 8, 2019
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#59
Speaking of faith, I pray that my heavenly Father gives me stronger faith. I’ve been stuggling with anxiety and I know that worrying and anxiety is a sin and it’s also a lack of faith. I feel like it’s a spiritual battle, well we’re all going through battle everyday as Christians but I really need to get rid of this anxiety and I can’t do it alone. I just don’t want Him to be upset with me, I’m really trying to overcome this. I do believe and I do have faith but I need it to be stronger by surrendering completely to Him and laying it all at his feet, knowing that he’s my protection and shield. I pray that he forgives me and I know he understands and knows exactly why I have this anxiety. I pray to Him how I feel always and how much I need Him. Does anyone else in here struggle with anxiety and think it’s attacking their faith?
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,201
113
#60
Is faith a work?
Then you could get more faith by working harder at faith.

How could you do this? By reading more scripture, by obedience, by praising or walking better
with God?

Our faith grows because God responds, because God does things that gives clarity and understanding
to who He is in our lives. Walking in faith, is trusting the thing that God has given us.

This logic would seem to mean, we actually have no control over how our faith grows, but it is God
who nurtures and helps us to grow in it.

At best by not putting into practice our faith, it can die.

29 Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."
John 6

Gods work is for us to believe in Jesus.
Is there a difference between believing in Jesus and having faith in Jesus?

The aspect of believing someone is proving what they are saying is true.
This takes effort and putting things into practice and seeing the result.

Having faith in Jesus is about trust. I have faith that He will do what He has promised.
So we can work at the results of our belief, but you either believe someone or you do not.

You can interpret what they are saying, which bring about other implications.
Jesus in John 6:27 is saying they are following Him because he fed them not because it was
miraculous. So their loyalty was not spiritual but worldly. This applies as much today as
at any time. God bless you.