IMO MO is GW.
IYO YO is GW.
The same is true for all on CC.
We will see see whose O is GW in heaven.
GOD'S WORD vs. man's opinion like GWHs.
- Thread starter Ouch
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IMO MO is GW.
IYO YO is GW.
The same is true for all on CC.
We will see see whose O is GW in heaven.
Bro, just speak in Morse code at this point.
Why do you even pretend to speak English since most don’t understand your army mentality?
Why do you stop short of Jesus commending her faith? He did answer her in the end, with a miracle. Then Jesus answered her, “O woman, great is your faith! Be it done for you as you desire.” And her daughter was healed instantly. (Matthew 15:28)
On another note. Why did God choose a Nation to call His own? What was their purpose?
I have about given up using English to communicate with y'all, so I thought I might try SIT.
GWH, per your request, will you answer the questions now?
Here we are GWH, your opinion vs GOD'S word as you requested my own thread just for you to back up your words.
For those who don't know what's going on, I continue to ask GHW to explain or back up what he says with GOD'S word and he either refuses to or just cant.
I told him if he does not explain his opinion I would start a thread just for that, he said he would answer then. SO here we are.
First, baptism in water and being filled with God's Spirit are TWO separate things.
1. In GOD's word water baptism is for remission of sins.
Acts 2:38, 22:16.
2. Spirit baptism is when when JESUS fills us with HIS Spirit, the Holy Ghost, and we speak in tongues as described in the chapter and verse below.
None of this is my opinion but HIS WORD ONLY, what happens when a person is baptized in the Holy Ghost.
JESUS TOLD HIS DISCIPLES NOT TO GO ANYWHERE UNTIL THEY RECEIVED IT.
Acts 1.
2 Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen:
3 To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God:
4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.
5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.
Acts 2:3-4
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
Acts 10:44-46
44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
Acts 19:6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.
PETER said, speaking in tongues is what happens when a person is filled.
Acts 2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
Jesus said in Mark, speaking in tongues is what happens when a person is filled.
Mark 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
GHW OPINION is
1. Spirit baptism REPLACED water baptism.
2. Being filled with the Holy Ghost means YOU ARE FILLED WITH LOVE.
3. Being filled with the Spirit and speaking in tongues was for that time and was perverted by some into a faux gift of mere babbling.
I asked GWH to back up his opinion on July 27th AND I"M STILL WAITING.
GWHs OPINION as he CLAIMS GOD WORD SAYS IT.
The Kerygma - God's Requirement for Salvation #821
"GW says WB was replaced with SB because they are two separate things: one is an outward work that may be imitated, while the other is the inward faith in JESUS that is salvific."
The Word: The accounts in the NT include both water baptism and speaking in tongues after receiving the infilling of the Holy Ghost as noted above.
The Kerygma - God's Requirement for Salvation #976
GWH
Just noticed this point: Yes, believers are either Spirit-filled or not, and love is the evidence of filling that justifies believing someone is filled (and the basis of spiritual unity) per John 13:35.
"And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance." Acts 2:4
The Kerygma - God's Requirement for Salvationon #1,082
Regarding speaking in tongues, the original occurrence at Pentecost (in Acts 2:4-11) was earthly languages given as a sign of reversing Babel for the purpose of evangelism, but by the time of its occurrence in the church at Corinth it had morphed into mere babble, which Paul tried to quash tactfully (1Cor. 14:19), possibly because even pagan religions practiced it. Again, the purpose of the original gift at Pentecost and for a while longer was to fulfill prophecy and ensure the planting of the first Christian church, but that gift apparently ceased after the apostolic era (1Cor. 13:8-13) and was perverted by some into a faux gift of mere babbling, so one should not be myopic and focus only on a problematic proof-text (1Cor. 14:18-20).
PROBLEMATIC PROOF-TEXT???? You do know that ALL SCRIPTURE IS GIVEN BY INSPIRATION OF GOD AND IS PROFITABLE FOR DOCTRINE, REPROOF, CORRECTION, FOR INSTRUCTION IN RIGHTEOUSNESS THAT THE MAN OF GOD MAY BE PERFECT, THOROUGHLY FURNISHED UNTO ALL GOOD WORKS. 2 Tim. 3:16-17
!!!!!!!! So to throw out scriptures one doesn't like keeps people from coming to the truth. !!!!!!!!
Paul explained there are diversities of tongues, meaning they serve different purposes of God. Such as evidence of the infilling of the Holy Ghost, edification of one's reborn spirit, and edification of church members through the spiritual gift of tongues and interpretation.
"For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries." 1 Cor. 14:2
So who is right GOD and HIS word or GWH?
GWH the ball is in your court!
Prove being filled with the Holy Ghost fills us with love.
Prove water baptism was replaced spirit baptism.
Prove that speaking in tongues was morphed into mear babble.
Prove that spaking in tongues stopped.
NOT YOUR OPPIOION you shared that all ready HIS WORD, PROVE ALL OF THIS WITH HIS WORD.
I did not OMIT v. 19. I cited it to you earlier. My synthesis of the relevant texts is that Paul discourages, in any particular assembly, public glossolalia beyond two or three, if there has been no interpretation offered of those two or three in that meeting. But Paul encourages everyone to practise glossolalia privately, and also in assemblies with the previous proviso, because glossolalia is the Holy Spirit and the Christian's spirit in direct communication, unmuddied by one's culturally distorted thinking, which has innate pharisaical confirmation bias that would want to reject the Holy Spirit's insight. The imparted wisdom percolates in the tongues-speaking saint's spirit and eventually, when the same wisdom is offered to the saint's mind, s/he approaches it with a more berean attitude that is willing to be persuaded of the wisdom.
Your synthesis is not a real synthesis. It is a denial of 1Co 14:5
I would that you all spoke with tongues, but rather that you prophesied: for greater is he that prophesies than he that speaks with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.
Must be too late for you. This makes no sense.
You said you did not call tongues babbling but you did and more than once. When your own words confront you, you ask the rocks to fall on you.
Re "Have you tried one of those brain supplements?
I'm really not a mean person, but you did say what you said."
How is saying what you said not being demeaning?
It could only be demeaning if you look down on people who are forgetful as they grow older
I hope you are not still surprised. Jesus said don't be surprised. If you know what I mean
He conflates water with the Holy Spirit? God does give some the gift of teaching and that is one of the gifts a cessationist will say is still good to go. They forget the part that GOD decides.
So far I have share my understanding of GW regarding witnessing to atheists, God's requirement for salvation, the teachings of Jesus and Paul, key OT teachings, the history of beliefs, and the controversial issue of abortion. Now I will introduce the didache, which are doctrines that build on the essential Gospel. Hebrews 6:1-3 indicates that Christians should not only learn the Gospel or God’s requirement for salvation (which may be signified by the Greek word for preaching, kerygma) but also go on to learning teachings that will lead to moral maturity (which may be distinguished by use of the Greek word for teaching, didache), and “God permitting”, this study will discuss didachaic doctrines that will build on the kerygmatic foundation–being careful how we build (1Cor. 3:10-11)–and lead believers to become blameless in practice as well as because of forgiveness in Christ (Eph. 1:4-7).
Perhaps we should note that although the didache is not most important or necessary to know/believe in order to be saved, it is very important and requisite for becoming spiritually mature, The distinction between kerygma/saving faith and didache/sanctifying faith was made by Jesus when He commissioned His disciples (Matt. 28:19-20). The kerygma is indicated by verse 19, “Therefore go and make disciples of all nations”, and the didache is implicit in verse 20, “teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you.” It is the “all truth” that is taught by the Spirit referred to in John 16:13. The distinction is made also in 2Tim. 3:15-17 and 1 Cor. 3:10-15.
As the didache is studied with the aim of achieving moral maturity, one should not think that it will be perfectly attained during this earthly sojourn, because Paul said (in Phil. 3:12-14), “Not that I have already… been made perfect, but I press on… toward the goal… for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus”. Paul went on to condemn those who “live as enemies of the cross of Christ… whose destiny is destruction” (Phil. 18b-19a). Thus, he connected saving faith (Eph. 2:8-9) with sanctifying good works (Eph. 2:10), which is the likely meaning of Rom. 1:17: “In the gospel a righteousness from God is revealed… that is by faith from first to last” (cf. Hab. 2:4).
If we truly believe in Jesus as Lord, we will want to please Him by cooperating with His will (Matt. 7:21, Eph. 5:8-10), but remaining faithful is as easy as an act of our will, even though Jesus referred to His yoke as a cross (Matt. 11:29-30, 16:24), and Peter acknowledged that a believer’s joy may sometimes be despite suffering (1Pet. 1:6-9). Paul explained that the reason Christ called some to be pastor-teachers is “to prepare God’s people for works of service… until we all reach unity in the faith… and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ” (Eph. 4:11b-13), which fullness is indicated by having the power to love (Eph. 3:16-19), which is why Paul said “In Christ Jesus… the only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love” (Gal. 5:6, cf. v. 22-23).
Paul urged believers to renew their minds by learning God’s perfect will (Rom. 12:2), which is conveyed via inspired Scripture and “is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work” (2Tim. 2:17). This is why Jesus said, “Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God” (Matt. 4:4). Learning the manifold teachings regarding God’s moral will takes a lifetime, so let us continue to persevere from “what we have already attained” or learned (Phil. 3:16, 2Tim. 3:14), “making every effort to add to our faith goodness… godliness… and love” (2Pet. 1:5-7).
Fullness is indicated by having the power to love (Eph. 3:16-19), which is why Paul said “In Christ Jesus… the only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love” (Gal. 5:6, cf. v. 22-23). The didache teaches God’s will regarding how saints or those who have been saved should live in order to be a good witness for Christ, which involves learning more of God’s Word throughout one’s lifetime (Col. 2:6-7).
Building on the kerygma is important, but because believers are fallible, they may disagree about how to interpret secondary doctrines regarding relatively minor issues. May we receive God’s blessing as peacemakers, who draw inclusive circles around fellow Christians based on the kerygma rather than denominational lines between them due to didachaic differences. Jesus prayed for spiritual unity (cf. John 17:20-23, “May they be one…”), because unity regarding the Gospel is more important than accuracy regarding doctrinal details, so may we feel free to speak honestly and disagree friendly without becoming unduly upset.
An obvious hint from Scripture about building on saving faith is the list of additions in 2 Peter 1:5-7: “faith, goodness, knowledge, self-control, perseverance, godliness, kindness, love” because these qualities will make our knowledge of the Gospel productive and give reasons for confidence in our election (v. 8-11). Paul was confident that God, “who began a good work you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus” (Phil. 1:6), meaning the Second Coming or Judgment Day.
Other than saving faith being first, it does not appear that Peter’s list is in a particular order, and it may be compared with Paul’s list of fruit produced by the Holy Spirit in Galatians 5:22-23: “love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control”. We can note that qualities cited in both lists include: faith, love, goodness, kindness, and self-control, with godliness being akin to goodness, and perseverance being akin to faithfulness.
Also, we know that several places in Scripture “love” is employed as the summary term that includes the rest of godly attributes (as in Matt. 22:37-40, John 13:35, Gal. 5:6 and James 2:8). Paul prayed that “love may abound more and more in knowledge and depth of insight, so that you may be able to discern what is best and may be pure and blameless” (Phil. 1:9). This prayer is echoed (in Col. 1:9-12a) by Paul’s request that believers would be filled “with the knowledge of God’s will through all spiritual wisdom and understanding… in order that they may life a life worthy of the Lord and may please him in every way: bearing fruit in every good work… being strengthened with all power… so that they may have great endurance and patience, joyfully giving thanks.”
Ephesians chapter four seems to begin explaining the meaning of Ephesians 2:10, so perhaps it would be edifying to collect a list of didachaic doctrines based on what Paul says there. Verse 1 instructs believers to live a life worthy of the calling they have received, which Paul describes as including the following: Live worthy of the calling to be a Christian (v.1); Be humble, gentle and patient (v.2);
Maintain the unity of the Spirit (v.3); Speak the truth in love (v.15&25).
Perhaps we should note that although the didache is not most important or necessary to know/believe in order to be saved, it is very important and requisite for becoming spiritually mature, The distinction between kerygma/saving faith and didache/sanctifying faith was made by Jesus when He commissioned His disciples (Matt. 28:19-20). The kerygma is indicated by verse 19, “Therefore go and make disciples of all nations”, and the didache is implicit in verse 20, “teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you.” It is the “all truth” that is taught by the Spirit referred to in John 16:13. The distinction is made also in 2Tim. 3:15-17 and 1 Cor. 3:10-15.
As the didache is studied with the aim of achieving moral maturity, one should not think that it will be perfectly attained during this earthly sojourn, because Paul said (in Phil. 3:12-14), “Not that I have already… been made perfect, but I press on… toward the goal… for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus”. Paul went on to condemn those who “live as enemies of the cross of Christ… whose destiny is destruction” (Phil. 18b-19a). Thus, he connected saving faith (Eph. 2:8-9) with sanctifying good works (Eph. 2:10), which is the likely meaning of Rom. 1:17: “In the gospel a righteousness from God is revealed… that is by faith from first to last” (cf. Hab. 2:4).
If we truly believe in Jesus as Lord, we will want to please Him by cooperating with His will (Matt. 7:21, Eph. 5:8-10), but remaining faithful is as easy as an act of our will, even though Jesus referred to His yoke as a cross (Matt. 11:29-30, 16:24), and Peter acknowledged that a believer’s joy may sometimes be despite suffering (1Pet. 1:6-9). Paul explained that the reason Christ called some to be pastor-teachers is “to prepare God’s people for works of service… until we all reach unity in the faith… and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ” (Eph. 4:11b-13), which fullness is indicated by having the power to love (Eph. 3:16-19), which is why Paul said “In Christ Jesus… the only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love” (Gal. 5:6, cf. v. 22-23).
Paul urged believers to renew their minds by learning God’s perfect will (Rom. 12:2), which is conveyed via inspired Scripture and “is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work” (2Tim. 2:17). This is why Jesus said, “Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God” (Matt. 4:4). Learning the manifold teachings regarding God’s moral will takes a lifetime, so let us continue to persevere from “what we have already attained” or learned (Phil. 3:16, 2Tim. 3:14), “making every effort to add to our faith goodness… godliness… and love” (2Pet. 1:5-7).
Fullness is indicated by having the power to love (Eph. 3:16-19), which is why Paul said “In Christ Jesus… the only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love” (Gal. 5:6, cf. v. 22-23). The didache teaches God’s will regarding how saints or those who have been saved should live in order to be a good witness for Christ, which involves learning more of God’s Word throughout one’s lifetime (Col. 2:6-7).
Building on the kerygma is important, but because believers are fallible, they may disagree about how to interpret secondary doctrines regarding relatively minor issues. May we receive God’s blessing as peacemakers, who draw inclusive circles around fellow Christians based on the kerygma rather than denominational lines between them due to didachaic differences. Jesus prayed for spiritual unity (cf. John 17:20-23, “May they be one…”), because unity regarding the Gospel is more important than accuracy regarding doctrinal details, so may we feel free to speak honestly and disagree friendly without becoming unduly upset.
An obvious hint from Scripture about building on saving faith is the list of additions in 2 Peter 1:5-7: “faith, goodness, knowledge, self-control, perseverance, godliness, kindness, love” because these qualities will make our knowledge of the Gospel productive and give reasons for confidence in our election (v. 8-11). Paul was confident that God, “who began a good work you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus” (Phil. 1:6), meaning the Second Coming or Judgment Day.
Other than saving faith being first, it does not appear that Peter’s list is in a particular order, and it may be compared with Paul’s list of fruit produced by the Holy Spirit in Galatians 5:22-23: “love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control”. We can note that qualities cited in both lists include: faith, love, goodness, kindness, and self-control, with godliness being akin to goodness, and perseverance being akin to faithfulness.
Also, we know that several places in Scripture “love” is employed as the summary term that includes the rest of godly attributes (as in Matt. 22:37-40, John 13:35, Gal. 5:6 and James 2:8). Paul prayed that “love may abound more and more in knowledge and depth of insight, so that you may be able to discern what is best and may be pure and blameless” (Phil. 1:9). This prayer is echoed (in Col. 1:9-12a) by Paul’s request that believers would be filled “with the knowledge of God’s will through all spiritual wisdom and understanding… in order that they may life a life worthy of the Lord and may please him in every way: bearing fruit in every good work… being strengthened with all power… so that they may have great endurance and patience, joyfully giving thanks.”
Ephesians chapter four seems to begin explaining the meaning of Ephesians 2:10, so perhaps it would be edifying to collect a list of didachaic doctrines based on what Paul says there. Verse 1 instructs believers to live a life worthy of the calling they have received, which Paul describes as including the following: Live worthy of the calling to be a Christian (v.1); Be humble, gentle and patient (v.2);
Maintain the unity of the Spirit (v.3); Speak the truth in love (v.15&25).
Started reading, RED FLAG.
"So far I have share my understanding of GW"
Ended right there since you don't understand HIS WORD your sharing what you say HIS word says.
If you paid attention, you would know that I share what I have learned from my study of GW for the edification of fellow truthseekers (1Cor. 4:2-5).
And by the way, regarding truthseeking, a reason I am confident and bet my belief is better than some others is because I amend my belief as soon as I encounter new truth, and I have amended our website numerous times as the result of discussions on CC.
For example, as a result of discussions with tulipists I added this to the second paragraph in Lesson 2 on The Christian Creed:
"or how to satisfy God’s condition for forgiveness of sins that is indicated in Scripture by the word “IF” (e.g., Rom. 10:9), which is the fulcrum of faith, implying the ability either to cooperate with God or not (e.g., Deut. 30:19, Matt. 23:37) or MFW. Note that the choice is binary: God’s Way to heaven or the highway to hell."
I also added Lesson 11 on Systematic Scripture Study to the website with a section on election, because I travel in Baptist, Independent Bible and Conservative Methodist churches and had never had extensive interaction with tulipists before joining CC. Currently In Lesson 11 I am in the process of doing a study of the Didache and also of Ephesians.
Also before CC I had never encountered folks who believed WB was essential for salvation, because the denominations I cited view it as symbolic. Similarly, I had little interaction with those who believe SIT is the sign of salvation, although I had read about them. My encounters of this kind led me to add this to Part VI of Lesson 2:
Paul warned Christians to beware of Judaizers, who revert to teaching justification by observing the law (Gal. 4:8-5:12). In Phil. 3:1-9 Paul said, “Finally, my brothers, rejoice in the Lord!… Watch out for those… mutilators of the flesh. For it is we who are the circumcision [cf. Rom. 2:29]… If anyone else thinks he has reasons to put confidence in the flesh, I have more:… in regard to the law, a Pharisee… as for legalistic righteousness, faultless. But whatever was to my profit I now consider loss for the sake of Christ… I consider them rubbish, that I may gain Christ and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ–that comes from God and is by faith.”
Jesus taught that his righteousness (Matt. 5:10&20) surpassed and superseded that of those who obeyed and taught the law (cf. Matt. 12:5-12, 19:3-9, Heb. 7:18-10:1). The law is represented by John the Baptist in Matt. 3:11a, “I baptize you with water [WB] for repentance” [forgiveness of sins indicated in the Torah, cf. Rom. 7:4-8:17], and Spirit baptism (SB) is indicated in Matt. 3:11b, “but after me will come one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not fit to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire.”
However, some people (“Actsers”) focus on events in Acts such as WB and glossolalia rather than on teachings in the epistles about faith/SB being what is essential (“Faithers”). The book of Acts does not teach foundational Christian doctrine but merely records what occurred during the early days of the church era as the revelation of GRFS transitioned from OT beliefs to the NT doctrine that is taught in the epistles, which never command WB or tongues as signs of SB or as essential for salvation.
By the last of Paul’s epistles, WB came to be understood as a good but non-essential work or rite, like physical circumcision, and the basis for believing folks are filled with the HS is reflecting God’s love for everyone (Matt. 22:37-40, 1John 4:7-21, John 13:35, Rom. 5:5, Gal. 5:6 & 22, etc.). Then, like now, the rite is performed as an apt way of portraying saving faith in the atonement of Christ, even though the work is not required, just as physical circumcision was not required for salvation either per Paul in Romans 3:21-5:1.
Regarding speaking in tongues, the original occurrence at Pentecost (in Acts 2:4-11) and for awhile longer was earthly languages given as a sign that fulfilled Joel 2:28-32 (cf. Isa. 28:11-12 cited in 1Cor.14:21), which reversed Babel and evangelized 3,000 people, thereby ensuring the planting of the first Christian church, but by the time of its occurrence in the church at Corinth it had morphed into a faux gift of mere babbling, which Paul tried to quash tactfully (1Cor. 14:19, possibly because pagan religions practiced it), writing that the gift would cease (1Cor. 13:8-13), so one should not be myopic and focus only on a problematic proof-text (1Cor. 14:18), ignoring the absence of affirming tongues in other Pauline epistles.
Needless to say, in the circles I travelled I had never been hated or persecuted by supposed fellow Christians as I am now on CC by those who vilify me and demean my beliefs, which is why I have been adding 1Cor. 4:2-5 and Matt. 5:10-12 to some posts. Quite an eye opener and education I have received at this late stage of my life!
For example, as a result of discussions with tulipists I added this to the second paragraph in Lesson 2 on The Christian Creed:
"or how to satisfy God’s condition for forgiveness of sins that is indicated in Scripture by the word “IF” (e.g., Rom. 10:9), which is the fulcrum of faith, implying the ability either to cooperate with God or not (e.g., Deut. 30:19, Matt. 23:37) or MFW. Note that the choice is binary: God’s Way to heaven or the highway to hell."
I also added Lesson 11 on Systematic Scripture Study to the website with a section on election, because I travel in Baptist, Independent Bible and Conservative Methodist churches and had never had extensive interaction with tulipists before joining CC. Currently In Lesson 11 I am in the process of doing a study of the Didache and also of Ephesians.
Also before CC I had never encountered folks who believed WB was essential for salvation, because the denominations I cited view it as symbolic. Similarly, I had little interaction with those who believe SIT is the sign of salvation, although I had read about them. My encounters of this kind led me to add this to Part VI of Lesson 2:
Paul warned Christians to beware of Judaizers, who revert to teaching justification by observing the law (Gal. 4:8-5:12). In Phil. 3:1-9 Paul said, “Finally, my brothers, rejoice in the Lord!… Watch out for those… mutilators of the flesh. For it is we who are the circumcision [cf. Rom. 2:29]… If anyone else thinks he has reasons to put confidence in the flesh, I have more:… in regard to the law, a Pharisee… as for legalistic righteousness, faultless. But whatever was to my profit I now consider loss for the sake of Christ… I consider them rubbish, that I may gain Christ and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ–that comes from God and is by faith.”
Jesus taught that his righteousness (Matt. 5:10&20) surpassed and superseded that of those who obeyed and taught the law (cf. Matt. 12:5-12, 19:3-9, Heb. 7:18-10:1). The law is represented by John the Baptist in Matt. 3:11a, “I baptize you with water [WB] for repentance” [forgiveness of sins indicated in the Torah, cf. Rom. 7:4-8:17], and Spirit baptism (SB) is indicated in Matt. 3:11b, “but after me will come one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not fit to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire.”
However, some people (“Actsers”) focus on events in Acts such as WB and glossolalia rather than on teachings in the epistles about faith/SB being what is essential (“Faithers”). The book of Acts does not teach foundational Christian doctrine but merely records what occurred during the early days of the church era as the revelation of GRFS transitioned from OT beliefs to the NT doctrine that is taught in the epistles, which never command WB or tongues as signs of SB or as essential for salvation.
By the last of Paul’s epistles, WB came to be understood as a good but non-essential work or rite, like physical circumcision, and the basis for believing folks are filled with the HS is reflecting God’s love for everyone (Matt. 22:37-40, 1John 4:7-21, John 13:35, Rom. 5:5, Gal. 5:6 & 22, etc.). Then, like now, the rite is performed as an apt way of portraying saving faith in the atonement of Christ, even though the work is not required, just as physical circumcision was not required for salvation either per Paul in Romans 3:21-5:1.
Regarding speaking in tongues, the original occurrence at Pentecost (in Acts 2:4-11) and for awhile longer was earthly languages given as a sign that fulfilled Joel 2:28-32 (cf. Isa. 28:11-12 cited in 1Cor.14:21), which reversed Babel and evangelized 3,000 people, thereby ensuring the planting of the first Christian church, but by the time of its occurrence in the church at Corinth it had morphed into a faux gift of mere babbling, which Paul tried to quash tactfully (1Cor. 14:19, possibly because pagan religions practiced it), writing that the gift would cease (1Cor. 13:8-13), so one should not be myopic and focus only on a problematic proof-text (1Cor. 14:18), ignoring the absence of affirming tongues in other Pauline epistles.
Needless to say, in the circles I travelled I had never been hated or persecuted by supposed fellow Christians as I am now on CC by those who vilify me and demean my beliefs, which is why I have been adding 1Cor. 4:2-5 and Matt. 5:10-12 to some posts. Quite an eye opener and education I have received at this late stage of my life!
I do understand you have good intentions but if you don't follow HIS word you will end up lost.
You say things that are not true.
If you studied the didache you would see it, like what comes out of your mouth does not line up with GODS word.
So I will ask you truthseekers of what?
If your involved, does your fellow trushseekers use HIS word to keep you in check like I did which showed you how wrong you are?
You know your wrong, why do you not repent and change?
Or do you really think your words trump GOD AND HIS WORDS?
What you fail to understand is that only rejecting the Gospel/Creed causes condemnation,
which is why I share the kerygma so frequently. Perhaps your sharing of Acts regarding WB is also
well-intentioned, but you fail to acknowledge the reasons most Protestant Christians view WB as symbolic.
You continually (ad nauseum) accuse such Christians of being wrong, but that does not make you right.
You have never proved anything I/we have shared to be untrue or out of alignment with GW/NT doctrine.
All you have shown is that WB was practiced in Acts 2-10, often accompanied by SIT.
I don't reject anything in HIS word.
Is sharing your view on how to be reborn a good thing?
I don't care what people think, BRING WATER BAPTIZED FOR REMISSION OF SINS started in the book of Acts and never ended. PROVE IT ENDED.
FIRST I don't accsue anyone of anything, I share HIS word. The question is are they Christians? If they have NOT BEEN REBORN????
With the thread you told me to start proved you to be a liar!
You have had many chance to prove you are not, your lies just keep building.
I'm sure you know if you had the Holy Ghost JESUS would keep you in check.
Being water baptized for remission of sins started in the second chapter in Acts and HAS NEVER ENDED. PROVE IT ENDED.