Has anyone heard of Ravi Zacharias?

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Bladerunner said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communion_of_saints

Maybe you can read the above article in Wikipedia about 'Communion of Saints.'


In my opinion if he is indeed connected with the RCC, then YES, YES, YES, His teachings are at the very least suspect and need to be checked out before one commits to his version of Apologetics. The RCC is a false Religion of its own and will lead many many people to Hell.

Now if you are Catholic,,,I am sorry if the truth hurts. Are we supposed to tip-toe around the RCC and their soteriology and eschatology in fear of hurting someones feelings. Are we to just let them fall unknowingly.
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For goodness sake!
I am NOT RCC and neither is RZ.

I have already told you the meaning of the phrase.

These are just gratuitous smears based on ignorance.
You claim to be a Berean yet your whole approach has been to justify your position based on ignorance...
 
onlinebuddy said:
What church/ denomination does he belong to?
Are his teachings bionically sound?
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I liked him up until the point he declared that catholism was Christianity.. He is like a second Billy Graham type figure to me.. Started out great.. Ended up as an ecumenicalist mixing darkness with the light to get more widespread approval..
 
Adstar said:
I liked him up until the point he declared that catholism was Christianity.. He is like a second Billy Graham type figure to me.. Started out great.. Ended up as an ecumenicalist mixing darkness with the light to get more widespread approval..
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Unless you have a specific reference to this I suggest that you withdraw it!
I have just watched a video of RZ explaining his approach to the RCC - there is no unconditional acceptance of the RCC as Christian.
He does say that there will be real Christians in the RCC and phrases it like this: It is possible to be a good Christian and a bad Catholic!

Is Roman Catholicism a cult? - Ravi Zacharias at Texas A&M's Veritas Forum
 
graceNpeace said:
For goodness sake!
I am NOT RCC and neither is RZ.

I have already told you the meaning of the phrase.

These are just gratuitous smears based on ignorance.
You claim to be a Berean yet your whole approach has been to justify your position based on ignorance...
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Like I said in my first post to you...You would not like anything I said. As far as my ignorance;

Image result for communion of Saints
The communion of saints (Latin, communio sanctorum), when referred to persons, is the spiritual union of the members of the Christian Church, living and the dead, those on earth, in heaven, and, for those who believe in purgatory, those also who are in that state of purification.
Communion of saints - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communion_of_saints

If this dictionary (a bad one at that) is not sufficient for your superior intellect, I have plenty of other dictionaries that say the same thing and they are far more legitimate.

I was simply referring to his "Statement of Faith" and what it had in it... How he uses it I do not know and really do not care. I do not use him Not because of that one thing but because all points combined as stated in an earlier post. Simple as that.

If you or anyone else want to use him in your studies, fine,,,I have no problems there. Either way, as far as I am concerned, this subject and conversation between you and I is closed irregardless of what you think or NOT think.

I still hope you have a blessed evening.

Blade



 
Bladerunner said:
Like I said in my first post to you...You would not like anything I said. As far as my ignorance;

Image result for communion of Saints
The communion of saints (Latin, communio sanctorum), when referred to persons, is the spiritual union of the members of the Christian Church, living and the dead, those on earth, in heaven, and, for those who believe in purgatory, those also who are in that state of purification.
Communion of saints - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communion_of_saints

If this dictionary (a bad one at that) is not sufficient for your superior intellect, I have plenty of other dictionaries that say the same thing and they are far more legitimate.

I was simply referring to his "Statement of Faith" and what it had in it... How he uses it I do not know and really do not care. I do not use him Not because of that one thing but because all points combined as stated in an earlier post. Simple as that.

If you or anyone else want to use him in your studies, fine,,,I have no problems there. Either way, as far as I am concerned, this subject and conversation between you and I is closed irregardless of what you think or NOT think.

I still hope you have a blessed evening.

Blade
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The guy is NOT RCC.
Secondly, plenty of non-RCC churches use this very phrase in their statements of faith - and it does not refer to an RCC doctrine, but to fellowship with other living believers.

I say again that you are condemning someone based on your ignorance!
 
graceNpeace said:
The guy is NOT RCC.
Secondly, plenty of non-RCC churches use this very phrase in their statements of faith - and it does not refer to an RCC doctrine, but to fellowship with other living believers.

I say again that you are condemning someone based on your ignorance!
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The RZMI website statement of faith is the Apostles Creed. The reference to the holy catholic church is understandibly confusing to anyone who has not been taught the difference between catholic and Catholic.

catholic means universal: all believers in all times and places; but Catholic means RCC.

Nobody is born knowing that so we would do well to patiently explain the difference.
 
An oxymoron "Christian Catholic" But they do exist. The baby should not always be thrown out with the bathwater...


Believe me I am not defending Catholics but Christians....
 
MarcR said:
The RZMI website statement of faith is the Apostles Creed. The reference to the holy catholic church is understandibly confusing to anyone who has not been taught the difference between catholic and Catholic.

catholic means universal: all believers in all times and places; but Catholic means RCC.

Nobody is born knowing that so we would do well to patiently explain the difference.
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Well Marc, it can be little difficult to be patient with someone who keeps making unsubstantiated allegations, and further justifies those allegations based on ignorance, all the while counselling others to RUN from the person against whom the allegations are made.

I will make the strong suggestion that Bladerunner contact RZIM direct and ask for clarification if he does not believe me or you.
In the meantime I will not accept that it is OK to continue to slander a person for no reason!
 
graceNpeace said:
Well Marc, it can be little difficult to be patient with someone who keeps making unsubstantiated allegations, and further justifies those allegations based on ignorance, all the while counselling others to RUN from the person against whom the allegations are made.

I will make the strong suggestion that Bladerunner contact RZIM direct and ask for clarification if he does not believe me or you.
In the meantime I will not accept that it is OK to continue to slander a person for no reason!
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I believe that he has sufficiently demonstrated that he is not doing that.

I don't think that most people (including Blade) expressing opinions on the forum expects those opinions to be taken as incontrovertible.

I have made errors of fact on this very thread. When corrected I accepted correction (or at least hope I did) in good grace.

I don't think it is appropriate to expect more of others.
 
In every denomination mixed in amongst the pews of the outward structure which is called the church are those who inwardly profess and know who and what they worship
GOD

And those who outwardly just do lip service to HIS NAME

GOD knows who belongs to HIM
And in the Catholic denomination there are those who belong to THE CHURCH (that inward building being built up upon THE ONE And ONLY FOUNDATION needed)
CHRIST
 
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graceNpeace said:
Well Marc, it can be little difficult to be patient with someone who keeps making unsubstantiated allegations, and further justifies those allegations based on ignorance, all the while counselling others to RUN from the person against whom the allegations are made.

I will make the strong suggestion that Bladerunner contact RZIM direct and ask for clarification if he does not believe me or you.
In the meantime I will not accept that it is OK to continue to slander a person for no reason!
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I will also make the strong suggestion that GraceNpeace be a good Berean (Acts 17:11) and earnestly look up Ravi's history. If you do, I think you will get clarification.

However, I doubt that you will be a good Berean, as you and many others who call themselves Christians are dogmatic in their beliefs even when facts are different then what they believe.

As far as your attack of me and calling me ignorant; you are right?? I am ignorant in so many things especially those concerning Jesus Christ and the Christian Faith. I have been studying the Christian religion and theology for a while now and I can tell you I am subject at anytime to change my mindset when facts prove my old beliefs to be in error.

BUT, I am just glad to meet someone who knows it all, like you, I am Honored. Thank you. Blade

 
Bladerunner said:
I will also make the strong suggestion that GraceNpeace be a good Berean (Acts 17:11) and earnestly look up Ravi's history. If you do, I think you will get clarification.

However, I doubt that you will be a good Berean, as you and many others who call themselves Christians are dogmatic in their beliefs even when facts are different then what they believe.

As far as your attack of me and calling me ignorant; you are right?? I am ignorant in so many things especially those concerning Jesus Christ and the Christian Faith. I have been studying the Christian religion and theology for a while now and I can tell you I am subject at anytime to change my mindset when facts prove my old beliefs to be in error.

BUT, I am just glad to meet someone who knows it all, like you, I am Honored. Thank you. Blade
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Again you are making assumptions about things you have no clue about!
In this case what I may know or may not know about Ravi Zacharias.

And then you go on to confidently predict that I must be as narrow-minded a bigot as you have already demonstrated yourself to be by making accusations about a third-party from a position of comfortable anonymity that are hopelessly unsubstantiatable...

I think if anyone's character is in doubt right now it might be yours...
 
graceNpeace said:
Again you are making assumptions about things you have no clue about!
In this case what I may know or may not know about Ravi Zacharias.

And then you go on to confidently predict that I must be as narrow-minded a bigot as you have already demonstrated yourself to be by making accusations about a third-party from a position of comfortable anonymity that are hopelessly unsubstantiatable...

I think if anyone's character is in doubt right now it might be yours...
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Does your mother know you talk like that???? WHERE OH WHERE did I say anything about Hate in any of my post. Yes, I alluded that you were stubborn(dogmatic) but that was it. And where do you get off on calling me a Bigot (You said: "as you have already demonstrated yourself to be"). I wonder sometimes where the moderators are. Oh well, Guess I will mark you off my Christmas gift list.
 
Bladerunner said:
Does your mother know you talk like that???? WHERE OH WHERE did I say anything about Hate in any of my post. Yes, I alluded that you were stubborn(dogmatic) but that was it. And where do you get off on calling me a Bigot (You said: "as you have already demonstrated yourself to be"). I wonder sometimes where the moderators are. Oh well, Guess I will mark you off my Christmas gift list.
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Where do I get off calling you a bigot?
I gave you ALL the reasons!
 
Bladerunner said:
Like I said in my first post to you...You would not like anything I said. As far as my ignorance;

Image result for communion of Saints
The communion of saints (Latin, communio sanctorum), when referred to persons, is the spiritual union of the members of the Christian Church, living and the dead, those on earth, in heaven, and, for those who believe in purgatory, those also who are in that state of purification.
Communion of saints - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communion_of_saints

If this dictionary (a bad one at that) is not sufficient for your superior intellect, I have plenty of other dictionaries that say the same thing and they are far more legitimate.

I was simply referring to his "Statement of Faith" and what it had in it... How he uses it I do not know and really do not care. I do not use him Not because of that one thing but because all points combined as stated in an earlier post. Simple as that.

If you or anyone else want to use him in your studies, fine,,,I have no problems there. Either way, as far as I am concerned, this subject and conversation between you and I is closed irregardless of what you think or NOT think.

I still hope you have a blessed evening.

Blade
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Blade,

I see where your problem is coming from:

The RCC definition of saints is those canonized by the pope.

The Evangelicall definition of saints is believers

From an Evangelical perspective, communion of the saints is a rather stilted way of saying a gathering of believers for fellowship and/or worship.

Ravi Z is using the words from an evangelical perspective.
 
MarcR said:
Blade,

I see where your problem is coming from:

The RCC definition of saints is those canonized by the pope.

The Evangelicall definition of saints is believers

From an Evangelical perspective, communion of the saints is a rather stilted way of saying a gathering of believers for fellowship and/or worship.

Ravi Z is using the words from an evangelical perspective.
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Marc,

All this, and more, has already been explained to him yet he persists with his cowardly slander...
 
graceNpeace said:
Marc,

All this, and more, has already been explained to him yet he persists with his cowardly slander...
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When people respond to me in anger, and I don't understand why they are angry, I usually find someone more pleasant to listen to.
 
MarcR said:
When people respond to me in anger, and I don't understand why they are angry, I usually find someone more pleasant to listen to.
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You are making excuses for him - and none of that kind of reasoning explains his continued accusations toward RZ today...
 
graceNpeace said:
You are making excuses for him - and none of that kind of reasoning explains his continued accusations toward RZ today...
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As I see it:

He shows every evidence of being a believer. As such If he is wrong about something, he doesn't need an excuse--He is forgiven!

Believers, when they are wrong, do indeed need correction. If they will not receive it from people they will receive it from God, Himself. My anger contributes nothing to the process.
 
MarcR said:
As I see it:

He shows every evidence of being a believer. As such If he is wrong about something, he doesn't need an excuse--He is forgiven!

Believers, when they are wrong, do indeed need correction. If they will not receive it from people they will receive it from God, Himself. My anger contributes nothing to the process.
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I don't think his position as a believer has any bearing here.
If you are suggesting that, were he an unbeliever, that a different approach should be taken, I cannot agree with that.

This is not an issue of faith or belief but actually a common law and ethical question to which all of us are subject to:
Slander is both illegal and unethical...
This understanding is common to believers and unbelievers alike!
 
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