Has the Church Helped in Teaching Sexual Purity?

[FollowingtheWay]

validation as a man??

what do you mean and how can pornogrpahy give you validation? Looking at naked women gives you validation?

when I once started becoming aware of the seriousness my porn issue. I realized I was getting plenty of sex from my wife and yet My heart was after something else. And it occurred to me after reading ecclesiasties 2. Solomon was chasing everything under the sun from women, accomplishment, fame, and nothing seemed to fill him. He was searching in vain for something only God could give his soul. I Started digging a bit more into understanding what is written into a man’s soul since creation that would drive a man in the way of Solomon . Little boys are asking themselves a question “am I a man?” “Do I have what it takes” this is why boys tend to be ultra competitive and aggressive they want to know “they have what it takes”. this question was meant to be answered by his father, or a group of men in community or by God. Even Jesus needed validation from the Father.
“And a voice from heaven said, “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.””
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭3‬:‭17‬ ‭NIV‬‬

“Then a cloud appeared and covered them, and a voice came from the cloud: “This is my Son, whom I love. Listen to him!””
‭‭Mark‬ ‭9‬:‭7‬ ‭NIV‬‬


When a boy dosent get this divine question answered he goes through physical life looking for someone or something to answer that divine question . Answering that question validates him as a man and makes him secure in his identity. He often will walk around feeling like a young boy internally even though he be physically a young man.
When that answer has been denied. You might say A man child as the secular world calls this particular issue. He may try to get his question answered by a woman or by his work. It may satisfy for a season but it’s never enough. Only masculinity can bestow masculinity …. His soul needs a father figure or God himself to answer that question or he will in vain continue to need more women, more hours at work, more to try to validate his question. Till a man steps back and stops trying to seek that validation from the woman on the screen and takes his need back to God he will continue to struggle.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

A lot of times there are sins behind the sinful behavior. Rarely does a man truly commit adulterous behavior for the sake of sex itself His heart is searching for something deeper at a soul level outside Gods will. It’s not enough to say it’s wrong and just stop doing it. I found that poor advice very unhelpful. I found I also had an idol towards woman’s body in general . Not only a confession and repentance of lust, perversion, adultry but there are core idols to confess and repent of. What in pornography is my heart searching for… validation as a man in my case. I had and still do have to confess heart idols of approval, validation quite often before they give way to sinful behavior. If I catch my want for validation early enough, I can steer the ship away from the behavior before it even happens . It’s deep soul work to change sinful behavior at its core

Thank you for being so open. Do you have children? Either way, how do we get the message through to teens. Really I believe some sort of discussion needs to be happening before that time. How do we package the message to be abstinent when every single message around them is telling them the opposite? And how can the church support that message and back parents up?

 

[FollowingtheWay]

Thank you for being so open. Do you have children? Either way, how do we get the message through to teens. Really I believe some sort of discussion needs to be happening before that time. How do we package the message to be abstinent when every single message around them is telling them the opposite? And how can the church support that message and back parents up?

those are good questions. I have a 7 year old boy. I unfortunately haven’t the slightest idea how to package all that and make it as something available. It’s information I’ve gathered myself over the last few years of battling this issue and listening to various mens ministries big and small around the USA and an Eldership training class my pastor sent me through.

 

[Lanolin]

when I once started becoming aware of the seriousness my porn issue. I realized I was getting plenty of sex from my wife and yet My heart was after something else. And it occurred to me after reading ecclesiasties 2. Solomon was chasing everything under the sun from women, accomplishment, fame, and nothing seemed to fill him. He was searching in vain for something only God could give his soul. I Started digging a bit more into understanding what is written into a man’s soul since creation that would drive a man in the way of Solomon . Little boys are asking themselves a question “am I a man?” “Do I have what it takes” this is why boys tend to be ultra competitive and aggressive they want to know “they have what it takes”. this question was meant to be answered by his father, or a group of men in community or by God. Even Jesus needed validation from the Father.
“And a voice from heaven said, “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.””
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭3‬:‭17‬ ‭NIV‬‬

“Then a cloud appeared and covered them, and a voice came from the cloud: “This is my Son, whom I love. Listen to him!””
‭‭Mark‬ ‭9‬:‭7‬ ‭NIV‬‬


When a boy dosent get this divine question answered he goes through physical life looking for someone or something to answer that divine question . Answering that question validates him as a man and makes him secure in his identity. He often will walk around feeling like a young boy internally even though he be physically a young man.
When that answer has been denied. You might say A man child as the secular world calls this particular issue. He may try to get his question answered by a woman or by his work. It may satisfy for a season but it’s never enough. Only masculinity can bestow masculinity …. His soul needs a father figure or God himself to answer that question or he will in vain continue to need more women, more hours at work, more to try to validate his question. Till a man steps back and stops trying to seek that validation from the woman on the screen and takes his need back to God he will continue to struggle.

so men who look at porn ....just need their Dad to say 'I love you my son'?

 

[Lanolin]

hmm now I think about it that makes kind of sense

A lot of men I knew their dads left or they died and they were a bit hyper sexual. Or if their parents negelected them they became quite attention seeking, and end up becoming actors or involved in performing arts or something cos then at least they'll be seen. Even if they have to take all their clothes off for attention

 

[FollowingtheWay]

hmm now I think about it that makes kind of sense

A lot of men I knew their dads left or they died and they were a bit hyper sexual. Or if their parents negelected them they became quite attention seeking, and end up becoming actors or involved in performing arts or something cos then at least they'll be seen. Even if they have to take all their clothes off for attention

Yup you are witnessing it. absent fathers weather physically absent or even emotionally absent from their sons lives leave a deep and profound emotional void. Without the verbal affirmations and affections expressed by a father, boys will go try to find those affections elsewhere especially subconsciously as an adult. It shows up often as hyper sexual behaviors where they violently try to get a woman to tell them “they’re a man” or use a fake screen woman telling them what a “manly man”he is as she speaks seductively to the viewer. It shows up as working to the point of never coming home, being a workaholic to gain approval from a boss or even their mind may reason that if they work hard enough long enough they might finally get approval from daddy even though their dad is long decease and they do it at the expense of family time as well. It’s essentially an “approval idolatry” driving it rooted in childhood traumas and brokenness. To remove the idolatry in the heart there needs to be confession healing of the trauma that was experienced and repentance

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

what about her dad what happened to him.
why does everyone blame the mother? The dad could have taken off and didnt look after her.

Because her mother has been an unfit mother. Don't know where the father is and I don't think she knows. For a time her grandmother took her in, she has younger siblings. The grandmother has passed. The mother has men coming and going, not sure if drugs are involved.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

Thank you for being so open. Do you have children? Either way, how do we get the message through to teens. Really I believe some sort of discussion needs to be happening before that time. How do we package the message to be abstinent when every single message around them is telling them the opposite? And how can the church support that message and back parents up?

Good Question.
Parents have the responsibility to take their children to a church with a pastor who will preach on topics like Purity.
They are in the minority. This is a Baptist church, but not all Baptist churches are like this. I got fed up with a bunch of them for reasons like many preached a wrong gospel.
The Evangelical Non Denominational experience was mediocre. The Andy Stanley teaching on sex, marriage and dating was OK, but I told the pastor that he needed to preach on those subjects himself.
I opened up a can of spinach on a Catholic guy who had a reputation for fornication.
A staff member was ready to place him in a leadership position over a small group.
What in the world is a Roman Catholic even doing in our singles ministry???

 

[Lanolin]

Because her mother has been an unfit mother. Don't know where the father is and I don't think she knows. For a time her grandmother took her in, she has younger siblings. The grandmother has passed. The mother has men coming and going, not sure if drugs are involved.

the dad was an unfit dad! He wasnt even there

 

[Lanolin]

I had children at school, and some boys that were acting out aged 5-7
the primary principal was called, I dont know what she did, they all had male teachers...but they were a handful even with them and while they were not around, the parents were called in, and I think two of them they spoke with their mothers but I dont know if they contacted their fathers

It seemed a lot of troubled kids had no dads at home. Dads working or even overseas or just not there. All thses children craved attention.

One girl in the other school had family split up and her mum had turned lesbian. She had to look after her younger brother. She was very clingy to me.

Some young boys in Year 4 had already seen too much. Other children complained they were making sexual noises and they would use swear words etc. Parents marital problems would spill over to their children and they would disrupt the class because of all the stress of trying to be the adult in the household when they were still children when their parents were absent.

So its not just teens that its a problem. It affects children and essentially robs them of their childhood.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

the dad was an unfit dad! He wasnt even there

True, both parents were unfit. The grandparents stepped up and took over parenting.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

I had children at school, and some boys that were acting out aged 5-7
the primary principal was called, I dont know what she did, they all had male teachers...but they were a handful even with them and while they were not around, the parents were called in, and I think two of them they spoke with their mothers but I dont know if they contacted their fathers

It seemed a lot of troubled kids had no dads at home. Dads working or even overseas or just not there. All thses children craved attention.

One girl in the other school had family split up and her mum had turned lesbian. She had to look after her younger brother. She was very clingy to me.

Some young boys in Year 4 had already seen too much. Other children complained they were making sexual noises and they would use swear words etc. Parents marital problems would spill over to their children and they would disrupt the class because of all the stress of trying to be the adult in the household when they were still children when their parents were absent.

So its not just teens that its a problem. It affects children and essentially robs them of their childhood.

I believe the stats say that 70% of mass shooters in this country had no dad's in the home. I would say that is a pretty high stat. But it's never discussed after a major shooting.

 

[FollowingtheWay]

I believe the stats say that 70% of mass shooters in this country had no dad's in the home. I would say that is a pretty high stat. But it's never discussed after a major shooting.

pulled this from an online source you might find interesting that coincides with your stats

“IN "MY FATHER'S FACE," author James Robison tells of a federal prison chaplain who decided to improve morale. The clergyman approached a major greeting card company and asked for a donation of 500 Mother's Day cards, one for each inmate. Spotting a good PR story when they see it, the company agreed. Each inmate enthusiastically filled out a card for his mom, and morale picked up.

For Father's Day, the chaplain decided to duplicate his previous success. Again, the greeting card company agreed to donate 500 cards. But this time, the project crashed and burned. Not a single inmate -- not one -- wished to fill out a card for his dad.”

 

[Lanolin]

pulled this from an online source you might find interesting that coincides with your stats

“IN "MY FATHER'S FACE," author James Robison tells of a federal prison chaplain who decided to improve morale. The clergyman approached a major greeting card company and asked for a donation of 500 Mother's Day cards, one for each inmate. Spotting a good PR story when they see it, the company agreed. Each inmate enthusiastically filled out a card for his mom, and morale picked up.

For Father's Day, the chaplain decided to duplicate his previous success. Again, the greeting card company agreed to donate 500 cards. But this time, the project crashed and burned. Not a single inmate -- not one -- wished to fill out a card for his dad.”

yea I had a boy in school, a sweet 6 year old. We had a fathers day where we doing the same thing making cards or entering dads into a draw to win a prize but he refused to particpate becase he hated his dad, his dad beat up his mum

A lot of kids at the public school had dads in jail, or they didnt know where they were or they had died
Private school was opposite their dads were overseas or always working, or they had mistresses

Mothers were doing the job of BOTH mother and father. If dad is absent it will fall on the eldest child to be the breadwinner and thats a big pressure, though it makes them conscientious. Though if its a daughter and they are not training for any vocation, mothers may pressure them to marry someone rich.

Or, in some countries, they will sell them into sex work. Why because they dont earn enough and its easy to sell your body when you are young. Lest you think oh its only undeveloped countries that do that well no richer countries do that too except they give it a veneer of respectability by saying its modelling or acting.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

pulled this from an online source you might find interesting that coincides with your stats

“IN "MY FATHER'S FACE," author James Robison tells of a federal prison chaplain who decided to improve morale. The clergyman approached a major greeting card company and asked for a donation of 500 Mother's Day cards, one for each inmate. Spotting a good PR story when they see it, the company agreed. Each inmate enthusiastically filled out a card for his mom, and morale picked up.

For Father's Day, the chaplain decided to duplicate his previous success. Again, the greeting card company agreed to donate 500 cards. But this time, the project crashed and burned. Not a single inmate -- not one -- wished to fill out a card for his dad.”

That is amazingly sad. I think Jordan Peterson is so popular. Not that I have gotten deep into what he believes but he seems to be aiming at lost young men.

 

[HeIsHere]

I'm not sure you're differentiating between lust and natural, normal desire. It seems to me you're not, but I could be wrong. To have or sustain such a desire for a married woman is lust - to have it for an unmarried woman is not.

These verses from Deuteronomy 21 - rules God gave for an Israelite man who found a beautiful (captive) woman he decided he wanted to marry - would you describe these as lust, or natural desire?

10 When thou goest forth to war against thine enemies, and the Lord thy God hath delivered them into thine hands, and thou hast taken them captive,
11 And seest among the captives a beautiful woman, and hast a desire unto her, that thou wouldest have her to thy wife;
12 Then thou shalt bring her home to thine house, and she shall shave her head, and pare her nails;
13 And she shall put the raiment of her captivity from off her, and shall remain in thine house, and bewail her father and her mother a full month: and after that thou shalt go in unto her, and be her husband, and she shall be thy wife.

Lust is in the person's heart, it is not about whether the other person is married or not.
Jesus is our standard, He did not lust.

 

[Moses_Young]

Lust is in the person's heart, it is not about whether the other person is married or not.
Jesus is our standard, He did not lust.

Neither did Jesus desire a member of the opposite sex to marry. So I state again that a desire to marry someone (unmarried) does not constitute lust - even in the scripture example I gave, where a soldier could identify a beautiful captive woman he would like to marry, and marry her within the month.

 

[HeIsHere]

Neither did Jesus desire a member of the opposite sex to marry. So I state again that a desire to marry someone (unmarried) does not constitute lust - even in the scripture example I gave, where a soldier could identify a beautiful captive woman he would like to marry, and marry her within the month.

Well, now you are speaking about desire which is different than lust which we have already been over and over.

 

[Moses_Young]

Well, now you are speaking about desire which is different than lust which we have already been over and over.

Well, that's the thing. Some of the things you've said, I'd guess you are mixing them up. Which can result in confusion and lead to the very sexual sin that one is trying to prevent. (Note I said I'd guess - which is why I clarified).

 

[Lanolin]

Funny on this topic my church pastor said she was concerned about the books we had in the church library about purity culture.

I wasnt sure what her objection was though I had read a few and thought they were too American and glossed over the whole thing by saying christian daughters had to wear a purity ring though it never mentioned what christian sons had to do. Brides had to wear white while grooms could wear any colour they chose I suppose. 'And the bride wore white' was one.

Also there was a book called 'raising pure kids in an impure world' and I wondered if this was subtle racism implied from US that it was more 'white people' again being scared of anyone that wasnt white.

Rather than have books on sex education (ie what chrsitian couples are meant to do in the bedroom) it was again implied that you should just not know anything about it...until maybe you got a nasty surprise that your new husband is really into porn and you should be too.