Has the second coming occurred already?

[John146]

If I remember right, Scripture says when he returns, so many dead will lay on the ground the birds will feast for over a year.

Blood up to the horse’s bridle.

 

[ProphetExcalibur]

do you even understand what you are saying or question it???
some deep digging needs to be going-on here for sure...

Right back at Cha my brother! But I appreciate the heart ❤️ felt thoughts!

 

[ProphetExcalibur]

Blood up to the horse’s bridle.

Hyperbole! Do you not know the symbolic language of the ancient prophets of God??

 

[7seasrekeyed]

oh great

a call to arms for all closet Preterists

 

[ProphetExcalibur]

Seems like you are spiritualizing Scripture instead of taking it literally. 2 Corinthians 5 is a reference to the believer who has been placed in Christ. Christ has not literally returned to earth to set up His kingdom in Jerusalem and place the government upon His shoulders.

Nope, Paul used the term in Christ in one form or another over 100 times in his writings! There is nothing to spiritualize!

 

[oldethennew]

Right back at Cha my brother! But I appreciate the heart ❤️ felt thoughts!

=============================================
by the way, it's brother and sister:
and yes, we both hear' what you are doing',...
and know your agenda'...

 

[ProphetExcalibur]

=============================================
by the way, it's brother and sister:
and yes, we both hear' what you are doing',...
and know your agenda'...

TKS 😊 my agenda here was to share my thoughts with the person of this thread.

 

[Aerials1978]

Yes the "second coming" came and went, the great tribulation was the war on Jerusalem in 66-70 AD at the end of the age just as Jesus said it would. The futurist theologies have denied the time statements in many places in the new testament.

(Heb 10:37 For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.)

The futurist looking theologies have Jesus tarrying for nearly 2000 years.

Paul stated their deliverance was near and that the night was almost over and the day was at hand when he wrote:

(Rom 13:11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.)

(Rom 13:12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.)

That the days of the seals of John's revelations were in the lifetime of those that heard Jesus speak is established by the "fall on us" motif used by Jesus when speaking to the weeping women and repeated by John.

Jesus tells the women that they would live to see the events John described.

(Luke 23:28 But Jesus turning unto them said, Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for me, but weep for yourselves, and for your children.)
.
(Luke 23:30 Then shall they begin to say to the mountains, Fall on us; and to the hills, Cover us.)

John repeats the motif here:

(Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood)

(Rev 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb)

The millennium lasted 40 years in the first century and ended with the full destruction of the whore of Babylon/Apostate Israel.

I just don’t see this type of replacement theology as being just. There are too many detailed descriptions that had not been recorded or fulfilled.

14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.
Matthew 24:14

Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.
Matthew 24:39

Then there came flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder and a severe earthquake. No earthquake like it has ever occurred since mankind has been on earth, so tremendous was the quake. The great city split into three parts, and the cities of the nations collapsed. God remembered Babylon the Great and gave her the cup filled with the wine of the fury of his wrath.
Revelation 16:18-19

 

[Whispered]

I noticed some apologists use this as Jesus words were true that some would not see death until His second coming. The 40 prothetic terminology. I can see how that is applicable, but there other things that aren’t included such as; worldly events, the entire world would see His second coming, the millennial kingdom, and varies other aspects of Revelation. I’m not sold on replacement theology.

Not am I. Nor do I think scripture supports it. There are also those who think the second coming occurred when Jesus arose from the tomb. His Ascension the prophecy that all would see. I don't buy into that idea. Though with the way the world is going I can see how this time being the Tribulation would make sense to some.

 

[ProphetExcalibur]

oh great

a call to arms for all closet Preterists

You're to funny 7 keep up the good work!?!?

 

[John146]

Nope, Paul used the term in Christ in one form or another over 100 times in his writings! There is nothing to spiritualize!

You’re spiritualizing the second coming of Christ.

 

[Locoponydirtman]

Some sects of Christianity believe that Christ’s second coming had already occurred. This is in conjunction with the Olivet Discourse and specifically with chapter 24 from Matthew’s Gospel(Christ returned around 70 AD prior to the destruction of Jerusalem). Is there validation to any of this? Is there any historical evidence to support such? Has the revelation of Christs second coming being a future event based on tradition and misinterpretation? Is Preterism correct?

Thoughts?

That is a misinterpretation of Mathew, and to answer your title question; no. No he has not returned yet.

 

[azamzimtoti]

I just don’t see this type of replacement theology as being just. There are too many detailed descriptions that had not been recorded or fulfilled.

14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.
Matthew 24:14

Paul considered the gospel fully preached in "all the world" :

(Mark 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.)

(Col 1:23 If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister)

Paul is using Jesus' own words "every creature".

Paul's ministry was to the world "his course":

(Acts 20:24 But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.)

He here he states he's finished his course:

(2 Tim 4:7 I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith)


(Acts 2:5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.)

As for the context of "all the world" it should be understood as a "Jewism" with some hyperbole thrown in:

(John 12:19 The Pharisees therefore said among themselves, Perceive ye how ye prevail nothing? behold, the world is gone after him.)

Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.
Matthew 24:39

Then there came flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder and a severe earthquake. No earthquake like it has ever occurred since mankind has been on earth, so tremendous was the quake. The great city split into three parts, and the cities of the nations collapsed. God remembered Babylon the Great and gave her the cup filled with the wine of the fury of his wrath.
Revelation 16:18-19

Babylon is apostate Israel which killed the prophets the prophets and apostles are told to rejoice over "her"

(Rev 18:20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her.)

(Rev 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.)

There is only on entity that was guilty of the blood of the prophets - Jerusalem:

(Luke 13:34 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!)

 

[ProphetExcalibur]

You’re spiritualizing the second coming of Christ.

Nope! But call it what ever you like! You're the ones who have changed the prophecies of the Holy Spirit! It's not my problem, carry on!

 

[Aerials1978]

Paul considered the gospel fully preached in "all the world" :

(Mark 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.)

(Col 1:23 If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister)

Paul is using Jesus' own words "every creature".

Paul's ministry was to the world "his course":

(Acts 20:24 But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.)

He here he states he's finished his course:

(2 Tim 4:7 I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith)


(Acts 2:5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.)

As for the context of "all the world" it should be understood as a "Jewism" with some hyperbole thrown in:

(John 12:19 The Pharisees therefore said among themselves, Perceive ye how ye prevail nothing? behold, the world is gone after him.)



Babylon is apostate Israel which killed the prophets the prophets and apostles are told to rejoice over "her"

(Rev 18:20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her.)

(Rev 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.)

There is only on entity that was guilty of the blood of the prophets - Jerusalem:

(Luke 13:34 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!)

In all honesty I really think you’re misapplying scripture here to foment a certain belief or doctrine. Much of what you are using is out of context.

 

[azamzimtoti]

In all honesty I really think you’re misapplying scripture here to foment a certain belief or doctrine. Much of what you are using is out of context.

No "fomenting" - just applying scripture.

Revelation is primarily about the judgement of the whore (apostate Jerusalem) of the 1st century.

(Rev 11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.)

42 months in the above applies to the Roman siege and destruction of Jerusalem and the temple in 66-70 AD - 3.5 years.

 

[Lightskin]

Sigh 😔

 

[John146]

Nope! But call it what ever you like! You're the ones who have changed the prophecies of the Holy Spirit! It's not my problem, carry on!

When are you claiming the Lord’s literal, visible second coming to earth to establish His kingdom and reign in Jerusalem on the throne of David?

 

[Aerials1978]

No "fomenting" - just applying scripture.

Revelation is primarily about the judgement of the whore (apostate Jerusalem) of the 1st century.

(Rev 11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.)

42 months in the above applies to the Roman siege and destruction of Jerusalem and the temple in 66-70 AD - 3.5 years.

Frank Turek whom I admire takes the preterism position as well. The Jewish-Roman Wars are well documented and there is no indication that anything supernatural had occurred.

Israel couldn’t have been Babylon as its description is not in conjunction with chapter 17 of Revelation. Israel is show symbolically as the women clothed in the sun. There is a contrast between her and the women atop the beast.

Babylon is described as the abomination of the world. A centralized world power. Israel was certainly not that between 66-70 AD. Rome was more akin to that.

Again there are many flaws with this type of replacement theology.

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

Yes! It has already happened!!

But here's the biggest problem. Everyone alive today has been brainwashed with a future interpretation and this has been etched on the mind of their souls! Written in their worship songs and theologies!

Not much can be done for them; Satan has done his job well, now he can just lean back against the wall, dawn his Jesus mask and let them do the dirty work for him!!

It's become so thick and deep within the whole wall of Christendom, people fear even speaking of it for fear of losing fellowship and or their lives!

It's built into people to defend their religious beliefs to the death, as it should be! So unless God does something to cause you to lay down what you've been taught, and fight to know the truth. Your already defeated!

The funny thing is, you should know this is exactly how God does His business!!! And by you I mean anyone listening, whom God has truly delt with.

So if a lowly prophet of Christ Jesus is heard shouting from the watchtower: the enemy is in your camp; he's not coming he's already there, kill him offer him no quarter, or he will kill you in your sleep! Would you even hear him??

You are going to be so embarrassed when The Lord returns​