Hebrew Roots Movement

[KohenMatt]

If the Holy Spirit teaching you, why are you trying to live by the Law?

I live by the Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit teaches us how to live.
That often includes doing the practical things found in the Law.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

So when Jesus says:

“Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill.18 For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished.19 Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

You think He really means He made it obsolete?
And you think that the Law Jesus Himself is saying to obey is different than His own Law?

First, gentiles were never put under the law of Moses. Only Israel was.

Second, Christ made that law obsolete because it cannot work righteousness, only wrath.

Third, Christ's law is different than Moses' law that was given by the Levitical priesthood. The priesthood changed, therefore the law had to change as well.

Fourth, GOD said that he was going to send another prophet like Moses who would speak new law, that if ignored would bring judgment.

 

[Gr8grace]

I'll do you one better:

Matthew 5:17-19
"Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill.18 For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished.19 Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

There were still three years to go before the cross when Jesus Christ spoke this. His disciples were still under the law until ALL was accomplished on the Cross.

And at least it is very clear that no matter what the disciples did...............they are IN the Kingdom.

The disciples were still in the "shadow" of law. The reality of the shadow was accomplished on the Cross. And it was FINISHED.

 

[KohenMatt]

First, gentiles were never put under the law of Moses. Only Israel was.

Second, Christ made that law obsolete because it cannot work righteousness, only wrath.

Third, Christ's law is different than Moses' law that was given by the Levitical priesthood. The priesthood changed, therefore the law had to change as well.

Fourth, GOD said that he was going to send another prophet like Moses who would speak new law, that if ignored would bring judgment.

Well, I respectfully disagree with your opinions then.

 

[KohenMatt]

There were still three years to go before the cross when Jesus Christ spoke this. His disciples were still under the law until ALL was accomplished on the Cross.

And at least it is very clear that no matter what the disciples did...............they are IN the Kingdom.

The disciples were still in the "shadow" of law. The reality of the shadow was accomplished on the Cross. And it was FINISHED.

That sounds nice, but Jesus did say that "until heaven and earth pass away", the Law is still valid.

 

[Kefa54]

[h=3]Galatians 5:4 ESV[/h][h=3][/h][h=3][/h] You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.

If a person is not Jewish. They have never been under Mosaic law.

Kefa

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Well, I respectfully disagree with your opinions then.

Then you're disagreeing with what scripture says.

First, gentiles were never put under the law of Moses. Only Israel was.

click > http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...gentiles-have-never-been-under-law-moses.html​

Second, Christ made that law obsolete because it cannot work righteousness, only wrath.

For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect: Because the law works wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression. Romans 4:14-15​

Third, Christ's law is different than Moses' law that was given by the Levitical priesthood. The priesthood changed, therefore the law had to change as well.
​

Thus if perfection was through the Levitical priesthood, for on the basis of it the people received the law, what further need is there for another priest to arise according to the order of Melchizedek and not said to be according to the order of Aaron? For when the priesthood changes, of necessity there is a change of the law also. Hebrews 7:11-12​

Fourth, GOD said that he was going to send another prophet like Moses who would speak new law, that if ignored would bring judgment.

I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him. Deuteronomy 18:18-19​

 

[KohenMatt]

Then you're disagreeing with what scripture says.

First, gentiles were never put under the law of Moses. Only Israel was.

click > http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...gentiles-have-never-been-under-law-moses.html​

Second, Christ made that law obsolete because it cannot work righteousness, only wrath.

For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect: Because the law works wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression. Romans 4:14-15​

Third, Christ's law is different than Moses' law that was given by the Levitical priesthood. The priesthood changed, therefore the law had to change as well.
​

Thus if perfection was through the Levitical priesthood, for on the basis of it the people received the law, what further need is there for another priest to arise according to the order of Melchizedek and not said to be according to the order of Aaron? For when the priesthood changes, of necessity there is a change of the law also. Hebrews 7:11-12​

Fourth, GOD said that he was going to send another prophet like Moses who would speak new law, that if ignored would bring judgment.

I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him. Deuteronomy 18:18-19​

Well, as you and I have been around this mountain MANY times with little agreement of the other's interpretations, I again agree to disagree. I don't think it's worth either of our time to take another road trip around it.

 

[FreeNChrist]

I live by the Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit teaches us how to live.
That often includes doing the practical things found in the Law.

You're trying to have it both ways, just as the Galatians were. Why you would want to is beyond me. But, the end result is always these kinds if contradictory thoughts. There is no end to the ridiculous ways people come up with to try to hold onto the works of the Law as a way of living and still make claim to being saved only by grace through faith. Galatianism is rampant.

I definitely agree that we disagree.

 

[Gr8grace]

Galatianism is rampant.

Spot on. Sin is not the ultimate deception for us. This is.

It is satans ace trump. The counterfeit is pretty close to the truth. It gets to use Jesus's name and His law, it gets to use nice, sweet language, it makes our FLESH do "good" things and it "cleans" up our flesh, it gets to preach against sin....................And it doesn't save a man.

Religion is our great enemy, not sin.

 

[Grandpa]

I live by the Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit teaches us how to live.
That often includes doing the practical things found in the Law.

The Holy Spirit gives us wisdom and Revelation of Christ Jesus.

This wisdom and Revelation is in direct contrast to our work at the law. This wisdom and Revelation causes us to discontinue leaning onto our own knowledge and wisdom and trust fully in the Lord Jesus Christ. By Faith.

And the law is not of faith...

So, eventually you have to choose, your understanding of working at the law to be blessed, or trusting that in the Lord Jesus Christ is your full blessing secured.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It's only applicable if I'm a citizen of those countries.
The Law is applicable to those who are citizen's of God's Kingdom.

thats odd, Considering it was given to people to show them how thy could not get into Gods kingdom. As a symbol or a tutor.. to lead us too Gods kingdom.

So how does that who tells us how to get to Gods kingdom tell us how to live in Gods kingdom?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I'll do you one better:

Matthew 5:17-19
"Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill.18 For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished.19 Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

I think that says it all right, there, He came to fulfill. If jesus came to fulfill. then how can it be applicable to us? Did Jesus fulfill it or not?

oh and do you do all the law? Jesus says here if one law is annulled. then,, well you should get the point.. Obey it all Just like paul said, if your going to obey one, your bound to the whole law

 

[eternally-gratefull]

How is my salvation through Christ alone "shipwrecked" by following God's commands for daily living?

Because your focused on how good YOU ARE (how well you obey said law). and not on how Good GOD was (which proves how bad you really are) . And what you need to do to serve God.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Because the Holy Spirit teaches us how to live, and that includes the commands God Himself gave. You falsely assume that I only live by my own understanding of how to live, and that I do not live by the Holy Spirit.

Are the commands themselves bad or evil and any observance of them will result in evil? Or are they actually wise and beneficial instructions?

The HS teaches the law was given to keep us in check so no one would have an excuse Until the savior came, to lead us to Christ.

So why would the HS go against his own teaching?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I live by the Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit teaches us how to live.
That often includes doing the practical things found in the Law.

No. The HS does not teach that

The HS tells us to live in love in every circumstance, not to follow some law. Which no one can keep.

 

[KohenMatt]

Because your focused on how good YOU ARE (how well you obey said law). and not on how Good GOD was (which proves how bad you really are) . And what you need to do to serve God.

Oh please, not this same ridiculous assumption about me that has been refuted over and over again.

You should know better.

 

[MarcR]

How is Law you are not under still applicable? That's like saying the speed limit on a side road is applicable on the highway. Law is only applicable when you are under it.

I think that it is more like saying that the speed limit is applicable to aircraft flying above the highway; which, IMO, it is NOT!

 

[Kefa54]

I live by the Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit teaches us how to live.
That often includes doing the practical things found in the Law.

The Jews are under the Mosaic Law, the Gentiles are under the law of conscience, and we, the church of God, are under the law of Christ.
What is this law of Christ? The Bible uses many names to describe it, and it contains only one commandment: to love. This law of Christ, which is the only law that brings liberty!

The love that has been poured out in our hearts obviously wants to live a life pleasing to God. This is why all the requirements that the Old Covenant announced will be fulfilled as we live by the New Covenant love.
So when some people think that we are preaching lawlessness, it is a big misunderstanding. We are preaching a higher law: the law of the New Covenant, the law of love, the perfect law of liberty, the royal law according to the Scripture, which only works when Jesus is living in you!

This perfect law exceeds all the requirements of the Old Covenant, but it all happens in the newness of the Spirit, not in the oldness of the letter. The Pharisees’ business with the letter has been replaced by the wonderful fragrance of life that comes from the new life.

We have moved out from the narrow corridor of letter and into the glorious freedom of the Spirit. Hallelujah!

The New Commandment ( Not Law)

We are new creations; we live in a New Covenant with a new commandment.

In the New Covenant we have one commandment instead of ten.

In the New Covenant we have one commandment instead of ten. This one commandment is not written “on tablets of stone but on tablets of flesh, that is, of the heart” (2 Cor. 3:3).

“A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another” (John 13:34).

“And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment” (1 John 3:23).

The key to live in this new commandment is that “the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us” (Rom. 5:5).

The new commandment is an impossible “requirement” if we are to produce this love on our own.

But the solution of God is brilliant! He Himself fulfills the requirement in us by pouring out His love in our hearts; He gives us a new nature when we pass from death to life.

The new nature loves the brethren, just like 1 John 3:17 says. And therefore the requirement is fulfilled in us.

If we should be required to make the first initiative—that love should start with our effort—this requirement would be impossible to fulfill. It would be “mission impossible” if we were the ones who were to produce the love to fulfill the commandment about loving the Lord with all our hearts and our neighbor as ourselves.

So without being born-again, this commandment cannot be put into practice. It is when we pass from death to life that we receive the love, and then it is written on fleshly tablets of the heart. Love comes from God. We love because He first loved us. We forgive because He already has forgiven. He died for us while we were still sinners.

The new nature loves the brethren, just like 1 John 3:17 says. And therefore the requirement is fulfilled in us.

Agape love..translated as "love: the highest form of love, especially brotherly love, charity; the love of God for man and of man for God

“We love, because he first loved us” (1 John 4:19, RSV).

The whole miracle is founded on His work in us; our performance and our boasting are excluded!

This is the key to the new commandment. It is not us who loved God – it is He who loved us! We love, because He first loved us.

“Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. For the commandments, ‘You shall not commit adultery,’ ‘You shall not murder,’ ‘You shall not steal,’ ‘You shall not bear false witness,’ ‘You shall not covet,’ and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law” (Rom. 13:8-10).

By: Åge M. Åleskjær

Kefa

 

[peacefulbeliever]

Aty link doesn't seem to work

I'm so sorry cn - Here is the correct link - https:www. gty.org/resources/Bible-Introductions/
Grace to you - John MacArthur . . . . Then enter the book that you would like the introduction to in the search bar.