I bet I can start a discussion with two words: Free Will

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ChristIsTruth said:
As I stated before, free will is the ability to do what you want the most within the constraints of our physical reality. I know that many people are still slaves. This in a way applies to work and employees. Slaves obey for a greater want. They don't want to die. Employees obey for the same reason, a greater want, for money. What about flying? What if a kid wants to fly? He can try, but free will is limited within whatever reality you exist in. Your free will will be limited always be limited to whatever reality you exist in. Any confusion? Let me know!
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So...slaves have the ablity not to die, that's what they want. Ok.

They must REALLY want NOT to die. That doesn't make sense, the double negative. You should say, a slave wants to live.

I think that makes better sense. But doesn't everyone want to live?
What about the dying do they have free will? They may still want to live, but they can't, they are going to die! Do we have a 'choose your own death' kind of thing here, where everyone can choose how they want to die?
 
Lanolin said:
So...slaves have the ablity not to die, that's what they want. Ok.

They must REALLY want NOT to die. That doesn't make sense, the double negative. You should say, a slave wants to live.

I think that makes better sense. But doesn't everyone want to live?
What about the dying do they have free will? They may still want to live, but they can't, they are going to die! Do we have a 'choose your own death' kind of thing here, where everyone can choose how they want to die?
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I didn't say that they have the ability to not die. That's not even an ability. You don't do, "not dying". You aren't, "doing living". If they are executed against their greatest desire, they still have free will based on my definition, which is to be able to do your greatest desire within the reality you live in.
 
Lanolin said:
What about the dying do they have free will? They may still want to live, but they can't, they are going to die! Do we have a 'choose your own death' kind of thing here, where everyone can choose how they want to die?
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Does having to work keep your will from wanting to rest? Or does your unemployment constrain your will to work? The circumstances cannot constrain your will even if they do limit your option to perform your will.
 
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Mem said:
Does having to work keep your will from wanting to rest? Or does your unemployment constrain your will to work? The circumstances cannot constrain your will even if they do limit your option to perform your will.
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Yes, in the same way that the child cam continue to desire to fly, try as he might, but still fail. He still desires to fly the most, the fact is he simply can't.
 
ChristIsTruth said:
Yes, in the same way that the child cam continue to desire to fly, try as he might, but still fail. He still desires to fly the most, the fact is he simply can't.
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Exactly, he would if he could where "would" (*and "shall") is a derivative of "will," and could is, likewise, a conjugation of "can."
*I'd have to brush up to remember if "shall" is actually a merger of 'should' and 'will' :unsure:
 
Mem said:
Exactly, he would if he could where "would" (*and "shall") is a derivative of "will," and could is, likewise, a conjugation of "can."
*I'd have to brush up to remember if "shall" is actually a merger of 'should' and 'will' :unsure:
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On point! I like your deep thinking. I would say one thing: Words are meaningless without, well, meaning. So, we have to think how we are defining terms. When someone says, "I shall go touch this thing!", isn't he showing us indirectly what he might be wanting to do? It could be true that he wouldn't like it.
 
ChristIsTruth said:
On point! I like your deep thinking. I would say one thing: Words are meaningless without, well, meaning. So, we have to think how we are defining terms. When someone says, "I shall go touch this thing!", isn't he showing us indirectly what he might be wanting to do? It could be true that he wouldn't like it.
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Is there any active verb that doesn't engage the will to do it even if the desire to do it is lacking?
 
ChristIsTruth said:
I didn't say that they have the ability to not die. That's not even an ability. You don't do, "not dying". You aren't, "doing living". If they are executed against their greatest desire, they still have free will based on my definition, which is to be able to do your greatest desire within the reality you live in.
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No, doesn't make any sense.
Slaves don't have a will to live if everyday they are doing something that is going to end up killing them. They don't want to do it. They have no choice.

Free will is having choices.
Slaves have no choices. They can only do what their masters tell them to do. They have no options. Do the will of their master or don't and die.

So NO, Nope, nada.

End of.
 
If you are a slave---you are NOT Free.

Repeat - you are not free.

You are a slave!

You don't have free will. You are bound to your captors/masters.

This is why Jesus came to set the captives free. They could not free themselves.

I can't believe some Christians, people who read the Bible, don't know this!!!
 
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