i know someone who doesn't like Israel...

[kaylagrl]

Calling it a "replacement" as opposed to a fulfilment is hateful towards the first Jewish Christians and their descendants. We don't say that Judaism "replaced" the Hebrew religion. There is a conflict of interpretation between Christianity and Orthodox Judaism. Much like Roman Catholic and Orthodox Catholic Christians. Who left whom? The original Jewish Christians and their descendants are still Jewish by birthright and never "replaced" their faith with "something else" when Christ came.

Replacement Theology is exactly that, a theology. I didn't make it up out of whole cloth. It's the belief that the church gets all the blessings and the Jews get all the curses. The Bible doesn't say that. The Bible says God has made everlasting promises to the Jews and He will keep those promises.

Which Israel? The scriptural Israel (not all of Israel are Israel)?

You've disliked or disagreed with "not all of Isreal are Israel" a lot. What is your interpretation? What do you see as the correct context of that passage?.

There is no such things as "Spiritual Israel" which people try to say is the church. The church doesn't replace Israel. The verses are saying just because you are a Jew doesn't make you automatically saved. Which I never disagreed with and said Jews come the same way we do, through Christ.

Where does it speak of mourning?

In the Bible.

Hypergrace for Jews is not scriptural. There are clear passages which speak of those that are excluded from the promise (the ones that bear thorns instead of good fruit). The blindness is mentioned, yes, and it is possible with scripture that a Jew may be saved by grace posthumously by turning to Christ.

No one can be saved after they have died. And no one is talking about hyper grace for anyone. Read Romans 11.

It might be the case that most people that called themselves "Jews" are saved. It depends on whether the love of God is in their heart (bearing good fruit). But scripturally there are people that will call themselves "Jews" and are not. I don't know how you could say all that call themselves "Jews" are saved when this contradicts scripture.

I didn't say they are all saved, I said they will become saved. Again, read Romans 11, it's very clear.

 

[Jocund]

Replacement Theology is exactly that, a theology. I didn't make it up out of whole cloth. It's the belief that the church gets all the blessings and the Jews get all the curses. The Bible doesn't say that. The Bible says God has made everlasting promises to the Jews and He will keep those promises.

That the "church" gets all the blessing? I'm not sure on that. Scripture speaks to those in Christ, which isn't necessarily the same thing.

Maybe you are confusing my posts for a different user. I never proposed that "Jews get all the curses" (curse of Law vs the curse of Christ?). My concern was for a possible misconception that all that call themselves "Jews" somehow are eligible for a form of hypergrace. Jewish hypergrace isn't scriptural. The concept that a portion of Jews may find salvation through Christ (perhaps even after death) is consistent with scripture.

The context of the everlasting promise is explained in Romans 9 with "Not all of Israel are Israel". The promise given to Abraham's seed is for Christ and all of those in Christ. That is scripture.

There is no such things as "Spiritual Israel" which people try to say is the church. The church doesn't replace Israel.

One who is "with the church" isn't necessarily saved either. Only those in Christ, which isn't necessarily the same thing. It's the whole wheat vs tares conversation. If the love God takes hold in your heart and produces goodness through you, those same are saved.

The point I disagree with is that "Israel", the modern political state, would necessarily be the same Israel in the Bible. It's a different nation and a different people. This new nation has tried to replace the Biblical Israel and falsely claim to be the only true Israelites and only true Jews. What they represent is hateful to the first Jewish Christians and their descendants that are Jewish by birthright and never "left" or "replaced" their faith by embracing Christ as their Lord and saviour.

The verses are saying just because you are a Jew doesn't make you automatically saved. Which I never disagreed with and said Jews come the same way we do, through Christ.

Only those in Christ are saved. If that is your understanding too, I think we're on the same page.

"That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed." - Romans 9:8 KJV

[Jews mourning] In the Bible.

Which passages?

And no one is talking about hyper grace for anyone. I didn't say they are all saved, I said they will become saved. Again, read Romans 11, it's very clear.

Romans 9-11 is very clear that not all of Israel are Israel, and that promise does not apply to all that call themselves "Jews". Trying to make a distinction between "are saved" and "will become saved" is a word game. If you believe that all that call themselves "Jews" will become saved is hypergrace for Jews. Hypergrace for Jews is not scriptural.

No one can be saved after they have died.

Which passages make this claim?

The two thoughts you present are puzzling. On one hand you say that all Jews will be saved, on the other hand you say that no one can be saved after they have died. Do all Jews turn to Christ before their death? How does this work in your worldview?