And it shall come to pass in that day, that his burden shall be taken away from off thy shoulder, and his yoke from off thy neck, and the yoke shall be destroyed because of the anointing.
In your opinion is the entire Bible "inerrant" or "infallible" as it relates to scripture?
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I haven’t seen the Passover/Last Supper question addressed in this thread. My apologies if it’s here and I missed it.
Is it possible to reconcile the consensus of the three Synoptics that the Last Supper was a Passover meal with John’s statement that it was still the day before Passover? (Matt 26:17-19, Mark 14:12-16, Luke 22:7-15, John 18:28, 19:14)
One discussion of the subject that I found convincing is in Joachim Jeremias’ book The Eucharistic Words of Jesus. He points to several verses in John’s account of the Last Supper that indicate that he is, in fact, describing a Passover meal and not an everyday afternoon or evening meal.
https://archive.org/details/eucharisticwords0000jere/page/n10/mode/1up
Just one example.... You be the judge of where God's word is.
God's Word Is "Inerrant And Infallible"?
Yes, It Absolutely Is Such!:
Handling The Word Of Life!
Amen!!
Yes, It Absolutely Is Such!:
Handling The Word Of Life!
Amen!!
We have entire libraries of writings dating back to 2,300BC. We have entire libraries of hundreds of thousands of all kinds of writings dating from 800 BC just not in literary Hebrew. We have extensive "letters" from the petty kings of Canaanite "cities" dating from about 1,400 BC written to the Egyptian Pharaoh complaining about other Canaanite groups, outlaws and competitions. These are known as the Amarna letters. They are written in Akkadian cuneiform as Hebrew was not a written language by then.
Textural experts see archaic spellings and letter types indicating there is reason to believe that by 800 BC literary writing was a possibility. This was about 200 years after the life and times of important characters. The Kings, Prophets and Judges that lived before the invention of literary writing include:
Patriarchs & Leaders
Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, Joshua
Kings of Judah - Southern
Saul, David, Solomon, Rehoboam, Abijah, Asa, Jehoshaphat, Jehoram, Ahaziah, Athaliah, Jehoash
Kings of Israel – Northern
Jeroboam I (founder), Nadab, Baasha, Elah, Zimri, Tibni, Omri, Ahab, Ahaziah, Joram, Jehu, Jehoahaz, Jehoash (Joash)
Prophets – North and South
Elijah, Elisha, Amos, Jonah, Hosea, Joel, Isiah & Mica lived on the cusp of literary Hebrew
Judges (saviors)
Othniel, Ehud, Shamgar, Deborah, Gideon, Tola, Jair, Jephthah, Ibzan, Elon, Abdon, Samson, Eli, Samuel, Joel, Abiah, Amariah and Zebadiah, Abimelech
It may also surprise you to learn that many writers of the Hebrew Bible used reference books for the stories they wrote. None of these reference books used by writers of the Hebrew Bible survive today, but they are mentioned in the text of the Hebrew Bible.
As mentioned in the Hebrew bible, this includes the Book of Jasher, Book of the Wars of the Lord, Chronicles of the Kings of Israel, Chronicles of the Kings of Judah, (both mentioned over 30 times), Book of Shemaiah, Story of the Prophet Iddo, Book of Statutes, Acts of Solomon, Annals of King David, Book of Samuel the Seer, Book of Nathan the Prophet, Book of Gad the Seer, Book of Anijah, Book of Jehu, Acts of Uzziah, Vision of Isiah, Sayings of the Seers, Laments of Josiah and Chronicles of King Ahasuerus.
The question thus arises, were all the writers of these books that were used as the basis of the Hebrew Bible also "inspired?" If so, why have they disappeared?
As mentioned in the Hebrew bible, this includes the Book of Jasher, Book of the Wars of the Lord, Chronicles of the Kings of Israel, Chronicles of the Kings of Judah, (both mentioned over 30 times), Book of Shemaiah, Story of the Prophet Iddo, Book of Statutes, Acts of Solomon, Annals of King David, Book of Samuel the Seer, Book of Nathan the Prophet, Book of Gad the Seer, Book of Anijah, Book of Jehu, Acts of Uzziah, Vision of Isiah, Sayings of the Seers, Laments of Josiah and Chronicles of King Ahasuerus.
The question thus arises, were all the writers of these books that were used as the basis of the Hebrew Bible also "inspired?" If so, why have they disappeared?
This is your area of study, and I have not dug into it that deeply.
If I am wrong in my assumptions about the availability of old writings I apologize.
I would still ask if it is the case that the books of Moses were originally written in a different form than the Hebrew Bible does this necessarily invalidate them?
If an narrative is transcribed or even translated, that does not make it false.
Evidence of inspiration such as the fulfillment of prophesy are still just as valid.
All of the old manuscripts that we still have of the NT in this time are copies.
Most Christians are not bothered by that, because we understand that no special inspiration is needed for a man to copy a book.
Beekeeper. First let me be clear. I have been an in depth bible student for a good portion of my almost 8 decades. The timing and authorship of these Hebrew Bible books are very different than is generally understood. Having said that, a much later writer (s) and editors are just as capable of being divinely inspired as would have been a Moses. On the other side, much of what today's Christians consider "prophecy" related to Jesus is not. Isaiah 53 for example is using the "body of God's" people as the suffering servant as is well explained in Isaiah 54. The last chapters of Daniel were clearly written about 167BC as all the "predictions" of someone writing later and harkening back to ancient Hebrew experiences and legends "got it right." But nothing after 167 BC in Daniel has come to pass. Thus we tend to time at least the later parts of Daniel then. Again, this has no bearing on the metanarrative of the Hebrew Bible that God was preparing His people to be ready for Jesus....which they were not, unfortunately.
One of the little know realities about the Hebrew Bible is that it and it's Torah were not known nor practiced by the Judean society prior to about 250 BC. None of the Torah requirement were seen in the population for the entire time of pre and post exiles. By the time of the Maccabean and subsequent Hasmonean Dynasty we first see Torah compliance by the general population of Judea. In fact, it laid the groundwork for the transition from Judaism to Christianity. The Synagogue system where the common Jew could hear the Torah read and discussed came into existence about this time. The Essenes took off to the desert about this time and hid their scrolls that included popular books we nor the current Jew accepted as "inspired," but the Essenes were brittly Torah compliant people. When the early Christian missionaries traveled they often started teaching Jesus in Jewish Synagogues many of which were probable less than 100 yrs old. Many bible student's fear that the facts on the ground, the history and the politics outside the bible are a threat to it's inspiration. It is not. What it does do is expand the picture of God's work in the world from the pages of ancient texts into the real world we can often reconstruct through the sciences to demonstrate a clearer picture of God's work in human history.
No. Because man's hand was involved in compiling it.
Example. Earth is not flat.
Believe it or not,not,there are teachings that say gravity is a myth perpetrated by the Devil.
However,God's words perfect.
A lot of information there that I am in no position to verify.
The subject is controversial of course, and we can expect those that deal in it to have personal agendas, however objective they may appear.
As Christians we of course have our personal biases too, but secular sources are no means unbiased when it comes to the Word, or they could not remain secular.
The only historical issue there that I have some familiarity with is the allegation that the last half of Daniel was written after the event.
I found this when I was reading a secular history account of the life of Antiochus Epiphanes.
The description of his life in the book of Daniel so closely matches what they have uncovered from non-Biblical sources that they conclude that Daniel was written after event for that reason.
Here is a Wikipedia version of the story:
Antiochus IV Epiphanes - Wikipedia
What is your personal verdict in the Daniel case?The only historical issue there that I have some familiarity with is the allegation that the last half of Daniel was written after the event.
I found this when I was reading a secular history account of the life of Antiochus Epiphanes.
The description of his life in the book of Daniel so closely matches what they have uncovered from non-Biblical sources that they conclude that Daniel was written after event for that reason.
Here is a Wikipedia version of the story:
Antiochus IV Epiphanes - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
You can read Jesus' own answer to your question:
Bible Gateway passage: Matthew 24:15 - English Standard Version
The Abomination of Desolation - “So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand),
God's Word is perfect but it's written by men who didn't always have a complete understanding of the Inspiration they were receiving.
You can read Jesus' own answer to your question:
Bible Gateway passage: Matthew 24:15 - English Standard Version
The Abomination of Desolation - “So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand),www.biblegateway.com
So can you, so post it and move the discussion forward!
You can read Jesus' own answer to your question:
Bible Gateway passage: Matthew 24:15 - English Standard Version
The Abomination of Desolation - “So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand),
Yes, but so can y'all who were discussing Daniel, so please do so and move the discussion forward to what matters!
Exactly, which is why I suggest that the discussion be about harmonizing Daniel with the Gospel,
which is what matters.
On your marks...
To which manuscripts do you refer? For example, a false teaching was part of the New Testament for 365 yrs. The invented "long ending of Mark" took 1,700
I like the way you think but must inquire about your statement "ex nihilo." While this concept has its origins in the first creation story it is absent from the second creation story. There has been a long tradition of Christian biblical theology favoring one over the other. The core problem lies with the source of the translation itself. The actual and better translation - vis Hebrew Scholars - is "When God began creating the earth was void....... about 20 modern translations including the Hebrew Masoretic Text use this wording.
I won't quibble with you intent in saying "humanity descended from one genetic source," but is did not. Northern Europeans have as much as 2.6% of their genetic makeup from Neanderthals while individual genomes only contain 1-2%, roughly 40% of the entire Neanderthal genome still survives today, scattered across the broader modern human population. The Ayta Magbukon people of the Philippines hold the highest level of Denisovan DNA in the world. They carry up to ~ 5% to 6% Denisovan ancestry. This is about 30% to 40% more than other Indigenous populations in Oceania (like Papua New Guinea and Australia).
"NT teaching that there is one almighty and all-loving God, who desires all humanity to live in harmony on earth and also in heaven, and who allows humanity to experience earthly existence including pain and disappointment (KOTH) for the purpose of teaching them their need for Him." As far as I can determine there is no difference between the Hebrew Bible and the New Testament on God's commands, goals, will and support for humanity. I see the New Testament as the completion of this long process, not a replacement. Jesus fulfilled the Hebrew Bible but did not replace it. That replacement was the work of the writers of the New Testament.
"Current existential reality indicates that mortals need God in order to obtain immortality, that morality needs God for a universal moral imperative (UMI) and ultimate justice, and that the NT offers the best hope that this “duo of desirables” (DOD) or heaven and justice/hell can be attained. Just as physical needs are satisfied by material realities, perhaps our metaphysical needs indicate the reality of supernatural solutions (the God of the DOD).
The idea that to be a moral human being humans need God for what you term universal imperative an ultimate justice......is appropriately ambiguous. Of all the forces in recorded human history, more murders, rapes and thefts were conducted in the name of Christianity than any other single source of moral collapse. Even the God of the Hebrew Bible ordered the killing of men, women and children while allowing His vectors to take the young women as sex slaves. Strangely, He told His people to even kill all the animals but to leave the fruit trees alone. God killed 70,000 innocent members of His people one day just to get King David's attention. As soon as Christianity became a State religion in the 4th century and made Christianity the State religion, they immediately began killing non-Christians. American Christians led the attack and the annihilation of North America's indigenous peoples. They murdered witches. They conducted wars on Mormons. etc. While one might make a claim that belief in God insures moral behavior history proves that to be false.