Is cessation an observation or theology?
- Thread starter Lamar
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
My doctrine has a strong basis in scripture.
You cessationism reduces God’s Word to a materialist philosophy with no supernatural power.
The miraculous age of the New Testament is not upon you, but it is upon others.
Your assertion that God withdrew His ability to heal and perform miracles leaves you in reliance on the world’s solutions.
You have listened to corrupt pastors who have no faith, they just hope for luck to rescue them.
You go too far in your interpretation of this verse. In context, when Jesus spoke of "blaspheming the Holy Spirit He was speaking about how the Pharisees who had seen and heard Jesus (who was the living image of the invisible God) and seen first hand miracles which they should have recognized as being God's works. Some of this party, like Nicodemus, did acknowledge this when he said: “Rabbi, we know that You are a teacher who has come from God. For no one could perform the signs You are doing if God were not with him.”
(John 3:2)
Although Nicodemus at that time was, apparently, not yet a disciple he was not denying that Jesus was who He said He was. Neither had be completely believed. Only someone who lived when Jesus lived, heard Him, saw Him and His miracles any then DENIED Him would be guilty of the unforgivable sin. Even Paul, who was around at that time had not yet believed though he did later. It seems to me that Jesus was speaking of those who fully and finally DID NOT BELIEVE. If this were not so, then Paul's own sin of unbelief would have been unforgivable.
Cessationists often emphasize that the so-called "sign gifts" were manifest to authenticate the Messiaship of Jesus . Although that is true. I think it is at least AS IMPORTANT to reveal what KIND of KING He was. His miraculous works showed His love for mankind and His willingness to reach out and deliver us a mission that would ultimately be accomplished by His work on the cross.
11 For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to everyone (Titus 2:11)
Neither did Paul see Jesus personally or any miracles performed, when he persecuted the early church, he was convinced that he was persecuting a cult worshiping a false messiah. It was precisely his personal experience with Jesus that converted him.
TASTE and SEE that the Lord is good, Ps.34:8. Not read and hear. Jesus also taught that you must drink his blood and eat his flesh, meaning participation in the church and experience him personally.
It is you who have ignored the real purpose of Scripture laid out in 2 Tim. 3:16, not for instruction, correction, reproof, etc. but ulimately for GOOD WORK.
No, you are wrong, that was his response to the SADDUCCEES, not Pharisees or Scribes.
First of all, what exactly constitutes as "doctrines the commandments of men"? There're plenty of such church traditions and doctrines not found anywhere in the scriptures but formulated over the centuries, are they "doctrines the commandments of men"? Second, one important purpose for those doctrines in first century Judea was to serve as a "fence" to prevent accidental or inadvertant lawbreaking, not out of ignorance.
T
TruthDefender
Guest
“Then the Pharisees and scribes asked Him, “Why do Your disciples not walk according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashed hands?” He answered and said to them, “Well did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written: ‘This people honors Me with their lips, but their heart is far from Me. And in vain they worship Me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ For laying aside the commandment of God, you hold the tradition of men —the washing of pitchers and cups, and many other such things you do.” He said to them, “All too well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition.”
Mark 7:5-9 NKJV
And that's just proven that they did know the scripture and the real commandment of God, but they were not following what they preached, thus making them hypocrites. They were still the experts of the Scripture, compared to the multitudes of Jesus's followers who were untrained and uneducated (e.g. Peter and John, Acts 4:13), and that onyl made them more guilty. I didn't call them experts of the Scripture as a compliment.
This shows that Paul, during the time he persecuted believers had NOT committed the unforgivable sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. If he had, then his own sins could not have been forgiven.
31Therefore I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. 32Whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the one to come.…(Matthew 12:31-32)
The inverse of this is when humans will one day see the miracles done by the Antichrist (who will be Satan incarnate) call them the works of the Holy Spirit and submit to receive the mark of the beast. This sin will be unpardonable as well.
“He [the Beast] required everyone… to receive a mark on their right hand or forehead” (Revelation 13:16).
In Revelation 14:9-10, an angel warns that anyone who worships the beast and takes this mark will “drink the wine of God’s wrath.”
When I see supposed tongues and guys flapping their jackets at a crowd and people flip flopping it appears fake and the type of signs and wonders I would expect to be deceptive and warned against in Scripture - however, if a person manifest a demon before me I would seek to cast it out in the vested authority in Christ Jesus I have as His servant.
So its a sobering serious sort of matter I submit, that is to be considered with meekness and humility - I don't want to a part of the coming deception and apostasy - nor do I wish to grieve the Spirit of God if He seeks to move miraculously before me.
So its a sobering serious sort of matter I submit, that is to be considered with meekness and humility - I don't want to a part of the coming deception and apostasy - nor do I wish to grieve the Spirit of God if He seeks to move miraculously before me.
Those that should be ashamed and fearful are those who label these false healings, resurrections and the mundane as physical supernatural manifestations of the Holy Spirit.
Those who are part of the Pentecostal movement and their ilk are guilty of this behavior regardless if they did the labeling, came to their defense or were silent on the issue.
Blessed and highly favored are those who experience miracles from the Lord and who know that God is still manifesting supernatural powers today!
The Apostles and those gathered in the upper room were not Pentecostal or Charasmatic or enlightened Baptists.
The Holy Spirit came upon those in the upper room on the day of Pentecost. You apparently despise Pentecostals for some reason, but you are wasting that emotion on that denomination since there are people of every denom who speak in tongues etc
The more you go on, the more you reveal a personal grudge and agenda. That, is why you should not be taken seriously
What you are describing is typical of the Pentecostal movement
If you see a demon by all means attempt to cast him out. Just be cautious to not confuse a "claimed" demon from a "real" demon.
Pentecostals are well known for finding "demons" behind every corner.
Many here are quick to judge even the most mundane event as a physical supernatural manifestation. I suspect most here do not even understand the meaning of the term.
I think you are wise enough to know the difference between a miracle and a fraud.
Blessed and highly favored are those who believe in the supernatural power of God and His promises but have not seen it manifested.
John 20:29
Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”
Your "belief" in what you falsely label as supernatural is carnal.