Is the Catholic Church the root of all evil?

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M

mcap

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#1
I am reading a book written by a minister in Texas,I can't remember his name.He states rather emphatically that the traditional Christian Church has it's roots deeply embedded in the Roman Catholic Church.He states that the RCC got alot of it's teachings from paganism and that the Christian Church picked up on those teachings and spread them around the world.
I would like to give some examples of what the RCC has changed and how it differs from Biblical principle.
Sabbath-they changed the day we worship from the traditional 7th day Sabbath to the first day of the week.
communion-was only supposed to be held annually.
Passover-substituted Easter for Passover
Resurrection-states that Jesus arose Sunday morning,which allowed for Sunday service.He died Wednesday afternoon and arose Saturday afternoon.RCC teaches Jesus died on Good Friday and arose Sunday morning,which is not three days.
Trinity-RCC teaches that the Holy Spirit is a separate spirit being.
Christmas-RCC teaches Jesus was born in late December,allowing for the pagan celebration of the winter solstice.Almost all religious scholars state Jesus was born closer to September.
I took these examples directly from his book.Being a new Christian I am worried that I may join the wrong church and end up missing out on Gods' plan for me.I would greatly appreciate any and all opinions on this subject and please keep in mind these are not my personal examples.
 
Jul 17, 2009
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#2
...He states rather emphatically that the traditional Christian Church has it's roots deeply embedded in the Roman Catholic Church.He states that the RCC got alot of it's teachings from paganism and that the Christian Church picked up on those teachings and spread them around the world.
Well, Protestant Churches have their roots in Roman Catholicism. Most of the reformers were not looking to break away from the Roman Catholics but instead wished to reform Roman Catholicism from the inside out. But they were ex-communicated and the RCC looked to reform herself. And she continues to do that - Vatican 2.

So, it should not come to anyone's surprise that many of the doctrines and practices of modern protestant churches have at their doctrinal bases, Roman Catholic doctrines. However, they have modified most of those doctrines (the majority of which were gotten from the multitudes of early Latin Church Fathers). And many new doctrines have sprung up and are often less than a hundred years old. Some even younger.

To rewind a little, Luther, Calvin, Zwingli etc. had quite a few different opinions on what was right and wrong. However, when they founded their churches, they were still liturgical and somewhat sacramental (with the exception of Zwingli and Calvin). The majority of protestant churches are no longer liturgical and or sacramental with the exception of a few. So for the first time in the history of Christianity, churches ceased to be liturgical/sacramental, with noted exceptions. However, I did read that Calvin wrote liturgy, but I'm pretty sure he wasn't sacramental. Though don't quote me on that because I don't know if that only relates to the Eucharist (communion) or the other (I don't know if the RCC have 7 sacraments) six sacraments.

Also, for the first time in the history of Christianity and at the root of Protestantism come the Solas. Sola scriptura (scripture alone). Sola fide (faith alone). Now many will make the argument that the original Christians (those that wrote the bible) were also Sola scripturaists and believers in sola fide. Many protestants feel James contradicts Paul when he said that faith without works is dead. Many protestants believe Paul is spot on with his statements against (all) works (good and bad) in regards to salvation. However, when it comes to James simple statement which appears to contradict Paul, they often feel that they must interpret that to mean something else. The reason for the multitude of different arguments over this faith vs works debate is because Protestants charge that Catholics believe that "being saved" is dependent upon works and faith whereas the Protestant, sola fide approach, is by faith alone. However, both sides often misunderstand each other because Salvation means very different things to both sides. So naturally they aren't going to agree b/c they're speaking two entirely different languages. When you apply the protestant understanding of Salvation to the "how do you get saved" of Roman Catholicism, they won't match because Salvation itself means something entirely different.

Also, protestants have no real hard and fast doctrines on Salvation. Once Saved Always Saved for instance, though it's of protestant origin isn't accepted by the majority of protestants. Though those numbers seem to be narrowing.

So, though Luther etc. didn't plan on ditching all the traditions of the Church, protestantism wound up pretty much rejecting any notion of Holy Tradition (and for good reason in many cases). However, I do believe that it's a case of throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Do a concordance check for the word Tradition in the scriptures and you'll see that certain traditions were indeed transmitted to the Church and were to be preserved/kept.

Sabbath-they changed the day we worship from the traditional 7th day Sabbath to the first day of the week.
The early Church recognized the Sabbath (Friday night to Saturday evening when the three stars appeared in the sky) on the Saturday. They even commemorated it. However, they did not change it to Sunday. The reason they gathered on Sunday was because Jesus resurrected on Sunday. I won't get into it but it has to do with the New Heaven and New Earth. Jesus resurrection is often called the 8th day of creation (the first day of the beginning of the New creation).

communion-was only supposed to be held annually.
The reason why this Texan dood believes it was only to be held annually is because many believe that the Lord's supper simply replaced Passover which is an annual (though not always) celebration.

Passover-substituted Easter for Passover
Again, this is just a lack of understanding in regards to the traditions. Passover relates to the Exodus. Exodus is a huge theme in Christianity and I believe both Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox (not to be confused) see the Passover as Christological.

Maybe the misunderstanding comes from the Calendar that the RCC chose to follow. For the RCC, Easter (Orthodox call it Pascha) sometimes comes before Passover.

The formula for Easter—"The first Sunday after the first full moon on or after the vernal equinox"—is identical for both Western and Orthodox Easters, but the churches base the dates on different calendars: Western churches use the Gregorian calendar, the standard calendar for much of the world, and Orthodox churches use the older, Julian calendar.

The Eastern Orthodox Church also applies the formula so that Easter always falls after Passover, since the Crucifixion and Resurrection of Christ took place after he entered Jerusalem to celebrate Passover. In the Western Church, Easter sometimes precedes Passover by weeks.

I don't know about the Roman Catholics in regards to Passover but Eastern Orthodox fast during the passover period.


Resurrection-states that Jesus arose Sunday morning,which allowed for Sunday service.He died Wednesday afternoon and arose Saturday afternoon.RCC teaches Jesus died on Good Friday and arose Sunday morning,which is not three days.
Yeah, I don't know where they get Wednesday. But if he died Friday, that's 1. Saturday, that's 2. Sunday until he rose, that's 3.

Trinity-RCC teaches that the Holy Spirit is a separate spirit being.

Again, perhaps I'm unfamiliar with the RCC but this might just be a case where the Texan doesn't realize that Trinity means 3. Father, Son, Holy Spirit. I don't know if he's suggesting that the Trinity is 2 in one.

Christmas-RCC teaches Jesus was born in late December,allowing for the pagan celebration of the winter solstice.Almost all religious scholars state Jesus was born closer to September.

Probably has to do with the Calender but I don't know. The Orthodox (Catholic) celebrate it on January 6 because they use the Julian calendar. But I don't know if the RCC Pope changed it.

I took these examples directly from his book.Being a new Christian I am worried that I may join the wrong church and end up missing out on Gods' plan for me.I would greatly appreciate any and all opinions on this subject and please keep in mind these are not my personal examples.
Well, it's always a journey toward God. Seek first the Kingdom of God and He will add unto you all the other stuffs.. Fo' sho.

Personally, I'm Orthodox Catholic but I started out at a Pentecostal church and church shopped like crazy and prayed and prayed and prayed and read my bible and asked a gazillion questions and prayed and prayed.

So seek and you will find. I wish you well on your journey toward God and I will keep you! in my prayers.

God bless! :)
 
May 21, 2009
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#3
There are lots of bad churches out there sadly. You want a spirit filled church. Where God is the leader of the church. Where they lift up their hands in worship to God. Where they invite the spirit and you feel him. Where he comes and talks. God bless you, Love
 
M

mcap

Guest
#4
I want to thank everyone who has posted so far,your thoughts and prayers are truly appreciated. God bless
 
L

Laiahna

Guest
#5
M

MaggieMye

Guest
#6
Scripture says that the LOVE OF MONEY is the root of all evil.
So consider how RICH the RCC is!! and the Mormons~~~
Maggie
 
Jul 6, 2009
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#7
Pish posh. Everyone knows that the Telletubies are the root of all evil.
 
Jan 31, 2009
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#8
Yeah, I don't know where they get Wednesday. But if he died Friday, that's 1. Saturday, that's 2. Sunday until he rose, that's 3.
:)
Jesus said Mt 12:40For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
then the Bible says

Mt 28:1In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.Mt 28:2And, behold, there was a great earthquake: for the angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat upon it.
there is no way, I don't care how you count it that you can get 3 days and three nights between friday afternoon and sunday morning. a teaching among some folks is that after He arose that He went back to hell and retrieved the keys which account, for the last night that can't be accounted for if he was put in the grave on Friday afternoon. but Jesus din't say that Jonah came out of the whale's belly then went back in so if He compared His time in the grave with johan in the whale's belly, then that teaching of Him going back for the last night would disagree with scriptures ,

in the Bible days, a Holy day such as the passover was also called a sabbath. Jesus wanted to observe the passover with His disciple, so the passover was Friday, the regular Sabbath was Saturday and the first day of the week was Sunday. most folks say that the jewish calendar a day starts at 6 pm, so you have Him being put in the grave after 6 on thursday night. Thursday night and friday was one day, friday night and saturday morning was 2 days and Saturday night and Some of sunday moring would have accounted for thre days and three night. But I believe the true teaching is that if you agree with creation time a day and a evening was one day, then He would have been put in the grave sometime thursday before 6 pm thus thursday afternoon and thursday night would be one day friday and friday night ( the passover/sabbath that they didn't want those on the cross to be hanging on the cross on the pass over), would be 2 days then the sabbath/ saturday and saturday night would be 3 days. the ladies approached the tomb, as sunday was beginning to dawn and He was already risen.

but as far as the question of the thread , The love of money is the root of all evil
 
L

Laiahna

Guest
#9
Being baptised is for dedication of our lives to our lord. How can a baby dedicate anything? First commandment. I am the lord your God. I shall have no other Gods before me. How do people pray to Mary, or saints? They made me kneal down in front of statues and pray to them when I was a child.That is idolitry, and fornication. Not to mention the repititious hail maries and our fathers I was told to say as a prayer to those statues. Gad said: "Confess your sins to no man. Only to me.". So, explain the confessional. Do I need to go on?
 
J

Jair

Guest
#10
Sabbath-they changed the day we worship from the traditional 7th day Sabbath to the first day of the week.

communion-was only supposed to be held annually.
Passover-substituted Easter for Passover

Resurrection-states that Jesus arose Sunday morning, which allowed for Sunday service. He died Wednesday afternoon and arose Saturday afternoon. RCC teaches Jesus died on Good Friday and arose Sunday morning, which is not three days.

Trinity-RCC teaches that the Holy Spirit is a separate spirit being.

Christmas-RCC teaches Jesus was born in late December, allowing for the pagan celebration of the winter solstice.


OK
let's deal with them one by one

Sabbath- Christians in the first centaury started going to 'church' on Sunday as the ones that were Jews still went to their service on Saturday to preach to them about Jesus.
This is inconsequential as "the Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath" All Christians go to church on Sunday anyways, not just Catholics.

communion- Again this is a crazy idea, Jesus celebrated this ON Easter Sunday AND Holy Thursday night. (They recognized him at the breaking of the bread aka communion)

Passover- The Catholic Church celebrates Passover for one night, and then they celebrate Easter for the following six weeks.

Resurrection-The Bible says Jesus rose on the first day of the week!!

Trinity-RCC teaches that the Holy Spirit of the same substance as God the Father and God the Son.

Christmas-RCC does not teaches Jesus was born in late December, it simply celebrates His birth on that day.

God Bless,


Jair
 
J

Jair

Guest
#11
Being baptised is for dedication of our lives to our lord. How can a baby dedicate anything?
Umm. the PARENTS dedicate the baby to the Lord,
Just like Samson, Samuel, and Jesus Christ!
Just like the Bible says to. Just like people in the Bible do.

Catholic parents dedicate their child through Baptism to God.

Acts 18:8
Crispus, the synagogue ruler, and his entire household believed in the Lord; and many of the Corinthians who heard him believed and were baptized.

(Not just the adults but the entire household.)

God Bless,


Jair
 
L

Laiahna

Guest
#12
Umm. the PARENTS dedicate the baby to the Lord,
Just like Samson, Samuel, and Jesus Christ!
Just like the Bible says to. Just like people in the Bible do.

Catholic parents dedicate their child through Baptism to God.

Acts 18:8
Crispus, the synagogue ruler, and his entire household believed in the Lord; and many of the Corinthians who heard him believed and were baptized.

(Not just the adults but the entire household.)

God Bless,


Jair
ok they believed to be baptised. We must repent of sin to be baptised.
 
Dec 12, 2006
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#13
Umm. the PARENTS dedicate the baby to the Lord,
Just like Samson, Samuel, and Jesus Christ!
Just like the Bible says to. Just like people in the Bible do.

Catholic parents dedicate their child through Baptism to God.

Acts 18:8
Crispus, the synagogue ruler, and his entire household believed in the Lord; and many of the Corinthians who heard him believed and were baptized.

(Not just the adults but the entire household.)

God Bless,


Jair
Yes people were baptised but being baptised doesn't save us.
 
L

Laiahna

Guest
#14
True John 3:5 tells how we are saved :)
 
L

Lifelike

Guest
#15
I am reading a book written by a minister in Texas,I can't remember his name.He states rather emphatically that the traditional Christian Church has it's roots deeply embedded in the Roman Catholic Church.He states that the RCC got alot of it's teachings from paganism and that the Christian Church picked up on those teachings and spread them around the world.
I would like to give some examples of what the RCC has changed and how it differs from Biblical principle.
Sabbath-they changed the day we worship from the traditional 7th day Sabbath to the first day of the week.
communion-was only supposed to be held annually.
Passover-substituted Easter for Passover
Resurrection-states that Jesus arose Sunday morning,which allowed for Sunday service.He died Wednesday afternoon and arose Saturday afternoon.RCC teaches Jesus died on Good Friday and arose Sunday morning,which is not three days.
Trinity-RCC teaches that the Holy Spirit is a separate spirit being.
Christmas-RCC teaches Jesus was born in late December,allowing for the pagan celebration of the winter solstice.Almost all religious scholars state Jesus was born closer to September.
I took these examples directly from his book.Being a new Christian I am worried that I may join the wrong church and end up missing out on Gods' plan for me.I would greatly appreciate any and all opinions on this subject and please keep in mind these are not my personal examples.
Hi mate, check out the site www.amazingdiscoveries.org it has awesome teachings about this subject! I think there are still a lot of things in the christian church today that are either out of line or come from erronious teaching of past movements, but generally i think we are ok. Your relationship with God is important, and we all need to have a better understanding of the word ourselves so we can discern more correctly. Its good to hear that this kind of stuff concerns you and that you genuinely want to be in the right place with God, and serve Him fully and not grieve Him. Well done. If you have any questions, feel free to drop me a line, im looking into all of this stuff at the moment, and my church is currently undergoing some changes based on these topics, its a really exciting time where we have the opportunity to come out of the things god is not pleased with and come into proper order so He can be glorified :) The next move of God will definately deal with a lot of these issues and we will need to respond correctly to move with Him or we may be the ones that are unwilling to change and criticize the new move of God. Peace.
 
Jul 17, 2009
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#16
OK
let's deal with them one by one

Sabbath- Christians in the first centaury started going to 'church' on Sunday as the ones that were Jews still went to their service on Saturday to preach to them about Jesus.
This is inconsequential as "the Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath" All Christians go to church on Sunday anyways, not just Catholics.

communion- Again this is a crazy idea, Jesus celebrated this ON Easter Sunday AND Holy Thursday night. (They recognized him at the breaking of the bread aka communion)

Passover- The Catholic Church celebrates Passover for one night, and then they celebrate Easter for the following six weeks.

Resurrection-The Bible says Jesus rose on the first day of the week!!

Trinity-RCC teaches that the Holy Spirit of the same substance as God the Father and God the Son.

Christmas-RCC does not teaches Jesus was born in late December, it simply celebrates His birth on that day.

God Bless,


Jair

Thanks for the clarification. This stuff makes me dizzy. :p


God bless!
 
B

broken

Guest
#17
Well if that pastor from texas is Southern baptist or fundamental baptist, he has an axe to grind with the catholic church. I encountered this throughout my youth as I was raised southern baptist but went to catholic school. All my friends were catholic and as a good little southern baptist I was taught they are all going to hell. I don't know where that axe comes from but it seems to be very stereotypically baptist. No offense to any of my baptist brothers and sinsters implied.

The bible teaches the love of money is the root of all evil. The bible also teaches about the great apostasy. That may be what the author is refering too as many seem to equivocate catholisism with this apostasy. Personally, I've seen examples of apostasy in most of the churches I've attended.

Yes, the catholic church does some things that are not scriptual, but so then does every church I've ever been to. Last time I checked only Christ can know the condition of a man's (humankind) heart.

We are ONE church with CHRIST as its head. If Christ is your center, you (any member of humankind) are redeemed. *shrug* If it were me, I'd toss the guy's book in the recycling.
 

BLU

Banned
Jul 26, 2009
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#18
I am reading a book written by a minister in Texas,I can't remember his name.He states rather emphatically that the traditional Christian Church has it's roots deeply embedded in the Roman Catholic Church.He states that the RCC got alot of it's teachings from paganism and that the Christian Church picked up on those teachings and spread them around the world.
I would like to give some examples of what the RCC has changed and how it differs from Biblical principle.
Sabbath-they changed the day we worship from the traditional 7th day Sabbath to the first day of the week.
communion-was only supposed to be held annually.
Passover-substituted Easter for Passover
Resurrection-states that Jesus arose Sunday morning,which allowed for Sunday service.He died Wednesday afternoon and arose Saturday afternoon.RCC teaches Jesus died on Good Friday and arose Sunday morning,which is not three days.
Trinity-RCC teaches that the Holy Spirit is a separate spirit being.
Christmas-RCC teaches Jesus was born in late December,allowing for the pagan celebration of the winter solstice.Almost all religious scholars state Jesus was born closer to September.
I took these examples directly from his book.Being a new Christian I am worried that I may join the wrong church and end up missing out on Gods' plan for me.I would greatly appreciate any and all opinions on this subject and please keep in mind these are not my personal examples.
I suggest you do a little more research then. RCC did not change the sabbath.
Crist was born October 2, 7 B. C.. BUT IT DOES NOT MATTER WHEN PPL WISH TO MAKE IT HIS BIRTHDAY, THOUGH, THEY DID DO IT TO CONTRADICT THE SUN WORSHIPPERS.
Christ rose on a Sunday, not wednesday read the verse for yourself.
The word easter was on a sunday and it is a biblical term, nothing to do with RCC.
Holy spirit is one of the three but God is one, big mystery -you will never figure it out.
Be careful of hateful ple they will lead you from loving your neighbor, The Golden rule!:D
 
Jul 17, 2009
353
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#19
Jesus said Mt 12:40For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
then the Bible says

Mt 28:1In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.Mt 28:2And, behold, there was a great earthquake: for the angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat upon it.
there is no way, I don't care how you count it that you can get 3 days and three nights between friday afternoon and sunday morning. a teaching among some folks is that after He arose that He went back to hell and retrieved the keys which account, for the last night that can't be accounted for if he was put in the grave on Friday afternoon. but Jesus din't say that Jonah came out of the whale's belly then went back in so if He compared His time in the grave with johan in the whale's belly, then that teaching of Him going back for the last night would disagree with scriptures ,

in the Bible days, a Holy day such as the passover was also called a sabbath. Jesus wanted to observe the passover with His disciple, so the passover was Friday, the regular Sabbath was Saturday and the first day of the week was Sunday. most folks say that the jewish calendar a day starts at 6 pm, so you have Him being put in the grave after 6 on thursday night. Thursday night and friday was one day, friday night and saturday morning was 2 days and Saturday night and Some of sunday moring would have accounted for thre days and three night. But I believe the true teaching is that if you agree with creation time a day and a evening was one day, then He would have been put in the grave sometime thursday before 6 pm thus thursday afternoon and thursday night would be one day friday and friday night ( the passover/sabbath that they didn't want those on the cross to be hanging on the cross on the pass over), would be 2 days then the sabbath/ saturday and saturday night would be 3 days. the ladies approached the tomb, as sunday was beginning to dawn and He was already risen.

but as far as the question of the thread , The love of money is the root of all evil

Mark 16:9 (I didn't know it was in scripture! so, cool) --
9

Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.






He IS risen! :D
 
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