Isa 9:6

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K

KD

Member
#1
Nov 20, 2018
74
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#1
Isaiah 9:6 (NKJV): For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

I’ve always understood the Trinity to be 3 separate “persons/entities” in 1 God.

Why does this prophesy of the Christ refer to Him as Everlasting Father?

It made me think of John ch. 10 when the Jews wanted to stone Him for saying “I and My Father are one” (v.30)

I’ve understood this to be one in essence. Equal but seperate. Similar to the Church(body of Christ)being seperate parts of the body but one church. Man and wife, being two individuals but become one in flesh.

What are y’all’s thoughts on this?
 
P

Poinsetta

Well-known member
#2
Nov 24, 2018
10,520
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#2
I totally agree.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#3
#3
Could it be refering to christ as the everlasting father of the jews? As YHWH of the OT nation of Israel?
 
H

hunterpoet2531

New member
#4
Nov 4, 2018
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A section of commentary from the British Family Bible for your consideration...
The everlasting Father, Or, "Father of eternity," or "of that which is everlasting," a title very applicable to the Messiah, whether we consider Him as "the Author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him," Heb 5:9, or as the Founder of the new age, or world to come, the Head and Introducer of a dispensation which is to last for ever: agreeably to this last notion, the Septuagint, Vulgate, and others render, "Father of the age to come." Vitringa. The phrase might also be rendered, "the Father of eternity," that is, the Owner of it, the Everlasting; according to the Eastern custom of calling the possessor of any quality the father of it. Bp. Stock.
 
K

KD

Member
#5
Nov 20, 2018
74
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#5
hunterpoet2531 said:
A section of commentary from the British Family Bible for your consideration...
The everlasting Father, Or, "Father of eternity," or "of that which is everlasting," a title very applicable to the Messiah, whether we consider Him as "the Author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him," Heb 5:9, or as the Founder of the new age, or world to come, the Head and Introducer of a dispensation which is to last for ever: agreeably to this last notion, the Septuagint, Vulgate, and others render, "Father of the age to come." Vitringa. The phrase might also be rendered, "the Father of eternity," that is, the Owner of it, the Everlasting; according to the Eastern custom of calling the possessor of any quality the father of it. Bp. Stock.
Click to expand...
Thank you for sharing! That certainly shed some light.
 
FlyingDove

FlyingDove

Senior Member
#6
Dec 27, 2017
1,259
431
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#6
KD said:
Isaiah 9:6 (NKJV): For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

I’ve always understood the Trinity to be 3 separate “persons/entities” in 1 God.

Why does this prophesy of the Christ refer to Him as Everlasting Father?

It made me think of John ch. 10 when the Jews wanted to stone Him for saying “I and My Father are one” (v.30)

I’ve understood this to be one in essence. Equal but seperate. Similar to the Church(body of Christ)being seperate parts of the body but one church. Man and wife, being two individuals but become one in flesh.

What are y’all’s thoughts on this?
Click to expand...
Hello KD, A few thoughts:

Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace

Each Capitalized name in Isa 9:6. Is a TITLE, each title represents a different attribute of the Son that shall be given.)

Exodus 34:6-7 gives, 13 Attributes of Mercy, that God taught Moses.

Every time I read Isa 6, I think of Micah 5.

Micah 5:2 Oh Bethlehem, you are little to be among the clans of Judah; out of you shall One come forth for Me Who is to be Ruler in Israel, Whose goings forth have been from old, from everlasting.

Christ is God: The Creator Jn 1:3 & 10, Col 1:16, 1 Cor 8:6. He holds every TITLE mentioned above

1 Tim 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Jesus a fleshly theophany

Theophany definition: a visible manifestation to humankind of God.
 
N

Noose

Senior Member
#7
Apr 18, 2016
5,096
932
113
#7
KD said:
Isaiah 9:6 (NKJV): For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

I’ve always understood the Trinity to be 3 separate “persons/entities” in 1 God.

Why does this prophesy of the Christ refer to Him as Everlasting Father?

It made me think of John ch. 10 when the Jews wanted to stone Him for saying “I and My Father are one” (v.30)

I’ve understood this to be one in essence. Equal but seperate. Similar to the Church(body of Christ)being seperate parts of the body but one church. Man and wife, being two individuals but become one in flesh.

What are y’all’s thoughts on this?
Click to expand...
Let no man fool you, Jesus is simply the Father; it doesn't really matter what other word anyone would attach to the title 'Father', it won't change anything.
Added to the controversy, that verse also calls Jesus the Holy spirit because the title counselor belongs to the Holy spirit.
 
K

KD

Member
#8
Nov 20, 2018
74
61
18
#8
Thank you all for the input

Peace and blessings
 
L

louis

Senior Member
#9
Nov 1, 2017
1,102
86
48
#9
KD said:
Isaiah 9:6 (NKJV): For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

I’ve always understood the Trinity to be 3 separate “persons/entities” in 1 God.

Why does this prophesy of the Christ refer to Him as Everlasting Father?

It made me think of John ch. 10 when the Jews wanted to stone Him for saying “I and My Father are one” (v.30)

I’ve understood this to be one in essence. Equal but seperate. Similar to the Church(body of Christ)being seperate parts of the body but one church. Man and wife, being two individuals but become one in flesh.

What are y’all’s thoughts on this?
Click to expand...
Three separate spiritual entities, and yet one as well.
So too, will the marriage be between the saints and the Lord.
Countless separate spiritual entities, and yet one as well.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#11
Jul 18, 2017
24,328
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#11
KD said:
Why does this prophesy of the Christ refer to Him as Everlasting Father?
Click to expand...
Since Christ cannot be the same as God the Father, we need to find the proper meaning of this. The only biblical way to understand this is to see that Christ as Creator is "the Father" of all creation ("the firstborn of all creation"), and since He is eternal, He is the everlasting Father.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#12
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#12
KD said:
Isaiah 9:6 (NKJV): For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

I’ve always understood the Trinity to be 3 separate “persons/entities” in 1 God.

Why does this prophesy of the Christ refer to Him as Everlasting Father?

It made me think of John ch. 10 when the Jews wanted to stone Him for saying “I and My Father are one” (v.30)

I’ve understood this to be one in essence. Equal but seperate. Similar to the Church(body of Christ)being seperate parts of the body but one church. Man and wife, being two individuals but become one in flesh.

What are y’all’s thoughts on this?
Click to expand...
Well, consider Hebrews....Jesus is the EXPRESS IMAGE of the invisible Heavenly Father......the word is IKON in Greek....it is hard for us to grasp with these finite, limited minds trying to grasp the infinite majesty of God and his Being....for example....God uses "be verbs" to describe his being and essence....

God is light
God is love
God is the lofty one that inhabits eternity

HOW do we grasp these truths, 3 distinct personages in 1......even comparing ourselves in like manner seems woefully inadequate ...

I am Dave
Intellectual life <-Heavenly Father
Physical Life <--The Son
Spiritual Life <--Holy Spirit

The Hebrew of Genesis proves the trinity concept....

Hebrew has

singular = 1
dual = pairs or twos
plural = 3 or more

God said, let US make man in OUR IMAGE

He breathed into Adam the breath of LIVES <--plural in Hebrew....3 or more

I know king jimmy translates it breath if life, but im Hebrew it is lives.......

Points to ponder is all!
 
so-jesus-e-deus

so-jesus-e-deus

Senior Member
#14
Feb 7, 2017
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#14
KD said:
Why does this prophesy of the Christ refer to Him as Everlasting Father?
Click to expand...
.

Because He is God, That Who created all things:

  • "And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life." (1John 5.20).
 
A

Adstar

Senior Member
#15
Jul 24, 2016
7,425
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#15
KD said:
Isaiah 9:6 (NKJV): For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

I’ve always understood the Trinity to be 3 separate “persons/entities” in 1 God.

Why does this prophesy of the Christ refer to Him as Everlasting Father?

It made me think of John ch. 10 when the Jews wanted to stone Him for saying “I and My Father are one” (v.30)

I’ve understood this to be one in essence. Equal but seperate. Similar to the Church(body of Christ)being seperate parts of the body but one church. Man and wife, being two individuals but become one in flesh.

What are y’all’s thoughts on this?
Click to expand...
I believe the Three are One...
 
JimmieD

JimmieD

Senior Member
#16
Apr 11, 2014
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#16
KD said:
Isaiah 9:6 (NKJV): For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

I’ve always understood the Trinity to be 3 separate “persons/entities” in 1 God.

Why does this prophesy of the Christ refer to Him as Everlasting Father?

It made me think of John ch. 10 when the Jews wanted to stone Him for saying “I and My Father are one” (v.30)

I’ve understood this to be one in essence. Equal but seperate. Similar to the Church(body of Christ)being seperate parts of the body but one church. Man and wife, being two individuals but become one in flesh.

What are y’all’s thoughts on this?
Click to expand...
I don't think Isaiah 9:6 is about God's ontological nature, but rather about functions of the king. The king was the "father" of the people in the sense that he was their ruler and protector. "Everlasting" probably refers to the throne/dynasty as everlasting as God had promised David's dynasty would be.
 
PS

PS

Senior Member
#17
Jan 11, 2013
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695
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#17
KD said:
Isaiah 9:6 (NKJV): For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

I’ve always understood the Trinity to be 3 separate “persons/entities” in 1 God.

Why does this prophesy of the Christ refer to Him as Everlasting Father?

It made me think of John ch. 10 when the Jews wanted to stone Him for saying “I and My Father are one” (v.30)

I’ve understood this to be one in essence. Equal but seperate. Similar to the Church(body of Christ)being seperate parts of the body but one church. Man and wife, being two individuals but become one in flesh.

What are y’all’s thoughts on this?
Click to expand...
God in three persons.

Meditate on it.
 
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