Israel Declares War

[ZNP]

When you counsel couples that are having trouble you go in with the assumption that both parties share the guilt. It should be the same with this situation with Israel and Palestine.

Sharing the guilt does not mean it is equal, it may be that one is 80% guilty and the other 20%, and yet you will not restore the relationship unless both repent of their sins.

The second requirement for counseling is that both parties say up front they want a reconciliation. It is pointless to try and reconcile two people if one person does not want to be reconciled. I think it is reasonable to say that Hamas does not want to be reconciled, but for Israel and Palestine I think it is reasonable to say they are more treacherous. They (some not all) may pretend to want reconciliation when in fact they don't. We know that the Jewish strategy has been to use every attack and event to slowly squeeze the Palestinians out of the land.

To me it is not helpful to let people operate in the shadows. Make everyone come forward and make a statement, do you want reconciliation or do you want to kill each other? I suspect you will find the majority of those in both Palestine and Israel want a reconciliation and that will put massive pressure on their respective governments to bow to the will of the people.

Second, you have to make the requirement that if you want reconciliation you must confess and repent of your sins and make atonement.

 

[shittim]

Moses-
Why are you even on Christian forum when you post in denial of the fulfillment of scripture happening before the eyes of the whole world?
You previously posted in support of replacement theology, which looks to be a serious heresy.
G-d keeps His promises.
best wishes brother,

 

[shittim]

Seriously bro, there is a replacement theology out there saying we Christians have replaced Abrahams seed in His promise, not so, don't see anything that supports that in scripture nor does Holy Spirit lead in that way.
best wishes

 

[Moses_Young]

Moses-
Why are you even on Christian forum when you post in denial of the fulfillment of scripture happening before the eyes of the whole world?
You previously posted in support of replacement theology, which looks to be a serious heresy.
G-d keeps His promises.
best wishes brother,

You know Christians worship Jesus and not just anyone claiming to be a Jew? Perhaps you should ask yourself the same question, because there seems to be a religious group that you prefer and defend over the simplicity of the gospel.

 

[Moses_Young]

Seriously bro, there is a replacement theology out there saying we Christians have replaced Abrahams seed in His promise, not so, don't see anything that supports that in scripture nor does Holy Spirit lead in that way.
best wishes

How can Christians replace Abraham's seed? We are Abraham's seed, if we have the faith of Abraham.

 

[Locoponydirtman]

When you counsel couples that are having trouble you go in with the assumption that both parties share the guilt. It should be the same with this situation with Israel and Palestine.

Exactly.

To me it is not helpful to let people operate in the shadows. Make everyone come forward and make a statement, do you want reconciliation or do you want to kill each other? I suspect you will find the majority of those in both Palestine and Israel want a reconciliation and that will put massive pressure on their respective governments to bow to the will of the people.

Which is why i said what i said about the palestinian protesters.

 

[shittim]

When you counsel couples that are having trouble you go in with the assumption that both parties share the guilt. It should be the same with this situation with Israel and Palestine.

Sharing the guilt does not mean it is equal, it may be that one is 80% guilty and the other 20%, and yet you will not restore the relationship unless both repent of their sins.

The second requirement for counseling is that both parties say up front they want a reconciliation. It is pointless to try and reconcile two people if one person does not want to be reconciled. I think it is reasonable to say that Hamas does not want to be reconciled, but for Israel and Palestine I think it is reasonable to say they are more treacherous. They (some not all) may pretend to want reconciliation when in fact they don't. We know that the Jewish strategy has been to use every attack and event to slowly squeeze the Palestinians out of the land.

To me it is not helpful to let people operate in the shadows. Make everyone come forward and make a statement, do you want reconciliation or do you want to kill each other? I suspect you will find the majority of those in both Palestine and Israel want a reconciliation and that will put massive pressure on their respective governments to bow to the will of the people.

Second, you have to make the requirement that if you want reconciliation you must confess and repent of your sins and make atonement.

The fulfillment of G-d's plan to redeem Humanity and the rest of His creation does not translate to a couple who most likely failed to ask their Creator ( who ALWAYS has the best plan) to guide them to mates and now realize they are not in unity.
This is satans and his evil minions fighting anyone and everyone, even there own before he is confined.
best wishes

 

[Locoponydirtman]

You know Christians worship Jesus and not just anyone claiming to be a Jew? Perhaps you should ask yourself the same question, because there seems to be a religious group that you prefer and defend over the simplicity of the gospel.

He is a revisionist zionist, there isnt much talking to him. He needs an act of liberation.

 

[shittim]

How can Christians replace Abraham's seed? We are Abraham's seed, if we have the faith of Abraham.

We have much more than "the faith" of Abraham, He now indwells us, what they longed for is available to each of us, if we receive and grow in Holy Spirit power, every gift Jesus manifested is available to every believer. Jesus modeled how we are to live.
The U.S.A. will no longer be the focus of the world events, for a lot of reasons.
(The ccp and their installed administration has taken us out?)
blessings

 

[shittim]

You know Christians worship Jesus and not just anyone claiming to be a Jew? Perhaps you should ask yourself the same question, because there seems to be a religious group that you prefer and defend over the simplicity of the gospel.

not true, I "prefer" no religious group, no post of mine every hinted at that.
The scripture is being fulfilled whether anyone likes it, supports it, wants it, doesn't want it.
best wishes

 

[ZNP]

Moses-
Why are you even on Christian forum when you post in denial of the fulfillment of scripture happening before the eyes of the whole world?
You previously posted in support of replacement theology, which looks to be a serious heresy.
G-d keeps His promises.
best wishes brother,

Requirements for a Christian testimony

4 I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called,

The items of the flesh have been laid out for us and we must confess and repent of sins and acts of the flesh.

2 With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;

The standard in the NT is much higher than simply dealing with sin.

3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.

Most importantly we are to do what we can to keep the oneness of the Spirit, not divide each other.

4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;

What is the "hope of our calling"? Is it to have the best Eschatology? Nope, it is that we will be with the Lord for all eternity.

5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

Yep, if you believe Jesus is Lord, the NT is the inerrant word of God and our baptism places us into the body of Christ.

6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

Let us consider what is not on this list. Our understanding of the end times is not on the list. You must believe the Bible is the word of God, inerrant, can't add or take away anything, but that still leaves a whole lot of room for various interpretations and understandings.

 

[shittim]

"Let us consider what is not on this list. Our understanding of the end times is not on the list. You must believe the Bible is the word of God, inerrant, can't add or take away anything, but that still leaves a whole lot of room for various interpretations and understandings."

Holy Spirit guides in ALL truth, most groups we call "churches" don't walk in Holy Spirit power and presence, they are the "outward form" that Jesus spoke of in Matthew 16.
We are not to "lean on our own understanding" , but seek His truth by Holy Spirit guidance.
"Various interpretations" result from leaning on our own understanding when there is one truth, one Savior, one truth giver.
best wishes

 

[ZNP]

"Let us consider what is not on this list. Our understanding of the end times is not on the list. You must believe the Bible is the word of God, inerrant, can't add or take away anything, but that still leaves a whole lot of room for various interpretations and understandings."

Holy Spirit guides in ALL truth, most groups we call "churches" don't walk in Holy Spirit power and presence, they are the "outward form" that Jesus spoke of in Matthew 16.
We are not to "lean on our own understanding" , but seek His truth by Holy Spirit guidance.
"Various interpretations" result from leaning on our own understanding when there is one truth, one Savior, one truth giver.
best wishes

All divisions between the body of Christ is based on that reasoning and Paul begins saying that we are to endeavor to keep the oneness, not look for cracks and flaws to take advantage of.

 

[Smoke]

actually we care about them

If hamas and the other terrorist groups are destroyed. Palestine can live in peace.

Do Palestinians live in peace on the West Bank? 0 Hamas terrorists there.

You cannot live in peace when you treat people worse than cattle. There is an apartheid and it needs to stop. We can't stop it because people refuse to accept reality that one is even occurring.

 

[Moses_Young]

Do Palestinians live in peace on the West Bank? 0 Hamas terrorists there.

You cannot live in peace when you treat people worse than cattle. There is an apartheid and it needs to stop. We can't stop it because people refuse to accept reality that one is even occurring.

Peace without justice is slavery. Sad that some people would be happy to have Palestinians living no better than slaves, provided they keep quiet about it and don't revolt. Can imagine the Roman propaganda about Spartacus in ancient times was probably similar to what some people are still pushing today.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

Please tell me you know TV "journalists" will often pose on a fake set or scene?
Just because you saw it on TV doesn't mean it happened.
That you saw it on TV doesn't make it real. It could be - but it's hardly evidence that you should expect anyone to be convinced by.
.

So you're telling me that a tv crew went in and faked an entire village?! They shot up walls, fake blood on floors and blankets. How in the world would they have time to do that?! In the middle of a war zone with rockets over their heads?? Come on now!! Be serious!

And if you can't see a propaganda war going on (by both sides), you're not really going to be impartial enough to make reasonable judgements.

Are you going to sit there are tell me that Hamas didn't strike first? That they aren't terrorists?!! Are you going to explain away 2000 people murdered? 200 at a music festival alone. Are you trying to deny that children were murdered in their own homes?! That families were dragged out of their beds and slaughtered?! That children and women were taken hostage and women were raped? DO YOU DENY THESE?!

I don't have children, but I have nephews in their teens. And if I heard that they were dragged into the street and murdered there would be no impartiality. I would do anything I could to see justice brought for their lives!! I would not stop till the day I died. And that is called RIGHTEOUS ANGER!! And it is utterly and purely disgusting that Christians are not on Israels side and talking stupidity!! Since 1948 Israel NEVER hit first, they NEVER started the fighting!! They have offered land and more for peace. They want peace. They are not occupying the land THAT is PROPAGANDA!! They didn't take land from poor Palestinians THAT IS A LIE, and propaganda, they didn't commit genocide against Arabs!! You can find all this in a history book. Not revisionist liberal biased history, real history! The Bible talks about sending a strong delusion, and boy howdy have I seen it in this horrible thread. smh

 

[Moses_Young]

I don't have children, but I have nephews in their teens. And if I heard that they were dragged into the street and murdered there would be no impartiality. I would do anything I could to see justice brought for their lives!! I would not stop till the day I died. And that is called RIGHTEOUS ANGER!! And it is utterly and purely disgusting that Christians are not on Israels side and talking stupidity!!

This here is the point of propaganda. Get people's emotions to take over, hopefully to the point a course of action is taken that cannot be reversed. Even if one later finds what led to his decision in the first place was wrong information - it may be too late to change. Hence the caution against acting on propaganda. It's designed to evoke an emotional response. Don't give in to it - wait to determine the facts of the matter first.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

Peace without justice is slavery. Sad that some people would be happy to have Palestinians living no better than slaves, provided they keep quiet about it and don't revolt. Can imagine the Roman propaganda about Spartacus in ancient times was probably similar to what some people are still pushing today.

1. All people living in Israel have full equal rights.

There are no inferior or second-class citizens, unlike non-whites in South Africa or minorities in Islamic or Arab countries. Moreover, Arabs occupy senior positions on the Israeli police force, the Knesset and the Israeli judiciary. For example, Salim Joubran, who currently serves on the Israeli Supreme Court, is a Christian Arab. South Africans living under apartheid could only dream of obtaining these types of positions.

Ishmael Khaldi, an Islamic Bedouin, is currently a diplomat in the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs. Majalli Wahabi (Druze) was the acting president of Israel in 2007. These are just a few examples out of the many minority groups holding prominent positions in Israeli society.


2. An Arab judge, George Karra, sentenced an ex-Israeli president Moshe Katsav to prison for seven years.
When an Arab judge sentences a former Israeli president to jail -- this is truly a testament to Israel's equality amongst all citizens, regardless of race or ethnicity.

3. In Israel, citizens are given equal opportunity in the workplace and educational department as evidenced by the fact that there are Palestinians and Arabs in Israeli universities who both study and teach as professors.
Today in Israel there are hundreds of Arab schools. Furthermore, education in the Palestinian areas of the West Bank is controlled by the Palestinian Authority. Courts, laws, taxes, police etc. are also under PA jurisdiction in the majority of the West Bank.

4. Arabs in Israel have more fundamental rights than other Islamic and Arab countries in the Middle East.

5. In Israel, there are 1.6 million Arab citizens integrated within Israeli society.
They make up 20 per cent of Israel's population.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

This here is the point of propaganda. Get people's emotions to take over, hopefully to the point a course of action is taken that cannot be reversed. Even if one later finds what led to his decision in the first place was wrong information - it may be too late to change. Hence the caution against acting on propaganda. It's designed to evoke an emotional response. Don't give in to it - wait to determine the facts of the matter first.

We know the facts!! smh Hamas terrorists murdered 2000 people, there is NO justification for that!! None!

 

[Moses_Young]

We know the facts!! smh Hamas terrorists murdered 2000 people, there is NO justification for that!! None!

Do you know who was involved? Do you know who was funding Hamas? Do you know why Netanyahu ordered the standdown of the Israeli military/intelligence (for reportedly 7 hours), which likely would have prevented the attacks? (Not to mention ignored international intelligence that attempted to warn of the attacks days and weeks in advance). Unless you want to immediately go to war against Netanyahu and those on the Israeli side who were also complicit in the attacks (a foolish move), I don't think it's justified to bomb innocent lives in Gaza, until the situation is properly investigated and understood. Else it could well be one of the masterminds behind the attacks is also able to use the military to tidy up all the loose ends revealing his complicity, and/or start a war which keeps him in power.