Israel police say Jewish settlers stone US consular officials during West Bank visit

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kaylagrl

Guest
#21
#21
Desdichado said:
Thank you. :)

I've always been caught in between. By Halakhic law, I am a Jew, so I cannot really escape the label (try as I may, hahaha), but since I am a very devout Christian, I have learned to admire them through the lens of an outsider as you have.

The good news, kaylagirl, is that, as a daughter of Christ, you are every bit as chosen as they (we?) are. Actually much moreso.

I'm kind of in a transition phase regarding my eschatological/dispensational beliefs. Not sure what to think about the fate of the Jews and their current and future place in God's order? Is Israel the "super-sign" of the end times. Are the Jews entitled to that land Biblically? Will He redeem a literal 144,000 during the Great Tribulation? Are they just another band of lost people that have to be relentlessly evangelized? I know none of these things for certain.

What I do know for certain is that I am far more blessed to know the love of Christ and his eternal priesthood than I am to be a genetic son of Levi. One of those actually means something of in the grand scheme of things, the other is a nice little fact to share at a dinner party.
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The Jews have such an amazing history.That there is any Jew alive today I believe is the providence of God.Hitler did his best to rid the world of its remaining Jews.Others have tried and many have come against this one race.The fact that there is a country today called Israel,to me,is a miracle in and of itself.And I believe the hand of God is still covering Israel.I also believe the US has been blessed because they stood behind Israel. JMO from what I have studied down through the years.I still believe Israel is the apple of His eye.Glad you are a Christian and can share that faith with others.Blessings :)
 
D

didymos

Guest
#22
#22
kaylagrl said:
God has not taken His hand off Israel.They are surrounded on all sides by enemies.They stand on 1% of land in the Middle East.They have been thrown out of more than 100 countries through history.They have been tortured,cast out,displaced and mass murdered.Still they stand.Have they always done right? No. But His mercy endures forever.To look at the history of Israel and not see Gods hand is unbelievable to me.Gods favor is still with the Jews or they would have gone the way of the Philistines,and others,years and years ago.
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Again, my comments are about the present day nation state of Israel, not the Israel of 1000 BC or about the jews. Israel is a highly secularized nation, the fast majority of Israelis don't care about the Lord God of Israel anymore. However, God only favours who walk in obedience to Him and keeps His commands.

[SUP]57 [/SUP]May the Lord our God be with us as he was with our ancestors; may he never leave us nor forsake us.[SUP]58 [/SUP]May he turn our hearts to him, to walk in obedience to him and keep the commands, decrees and laws he gave our ancestors.

(1 Kings 8:57–58 / NIV)


If God still favours this Israel it can probably do whatever it wants.


 
Desdichado

Desdichado

Senior Member
#23
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
113
#23
didymos said:
Again, my comments are about the present day nation state of Israel, not the Israel of 1000 BC or about the jews. Israel is a highly secularized nation, the fast majority of Israelis don't care about the Lord God of Israel anymore. However, God only favours who walk in obedience to Him and keeps His commands.

[SUP]57 [/SUP]May the Lord our God be with us as he was with our ancestors; may he never leave us nor forsake us.[SUP]58 [/SUP]May he turn our hearts to him, to walk in obedience to him and keep the commands, decrees and laws he gave our ancestors.

(1 Kings 8:57–58 / NIV)


If God still favours this Israel it can probably do whatever it wants.
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This is why I consider Texas to be more of a promised land than Israel. :p
 
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didymos

Guest
#24
#24
Desdichado said:
This is why I consider Texas to be more of a promised land than Israel. :p
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Heck, I even consider the Netherlands with its capitol Amsterdam (! המקום) more of a promised land.
All the nations that gather together there agree with me. ;)
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#25
#25
The New Testament confirms Gods calling on Israel by promise and not because they deserve it...but simple because God keeps His promises.....Paul said they are beloved because of the promises made to the fathers...but they are yet enemies of the gospel. When you see Israel blessed and supernaturally protected by God...know that its not because they "earned" it...
 
P

prodigal

Guest
#26
#26
i apologize in advance if apartheid supporters find this offensive,

[video=youtube;iqL048x4msM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iqL048x4msM[/video]
 
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prodigal

Guest
#27
#27
its very clear

1 kings 11

9 The Lord became angry with Solomon because his heart had turned away from the Lord, the God of Israel, who had appeared to him twice.10 Although he had forbidden Solomon to follow other gods,Solomon did not keep the Lord’s command.11 So the Lord said to Solomon, “Since this is your attitude and you have not kept my covenant and my decrees, which I commanded you, I will most certainly tearthe kingdom away from you and give it to one of your subordinates.12 Nevertheless, for the sake of David your father, I will not do it during your lifetime. I will tear it out of the hand of your son.13 Yet I will not tear the whole kingdom from him, but will give him one tribe for the sake of David my servant and for the sake of Jerusalem, which I have chosen.”
( i.e the birth of jesus was the promise david looked forward too and prophecy fulfilled by the birth of Jesus)
This promise was for us, those that follow Jesus and Paul continues to explain

galations 3

16 The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. Scripture does not say “and to seeds,” meaning many people, but “and to your seed,”[i] meaning one person, who is Christ. 17 What I mean is this: The law, introduced 430 years later, does not set aside the covenant previously established by God and thus do away with the promise. 18 For if the inheritance depends on the law, then it no longer depends on the promise; but God in his grace gave it to Abraham through a promise.

26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.


so we have 2 choices accept Jesus or dont, there is not a third way its Jesus or no way,
Paul himself was proof that jews are saved in the same way as gentiles.

Romans 1:16

​
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#28
#28
didymos said:
Again, my comments are about the present day nation state of Israel, not the Israel of 1000 BC or about the jews. Israel is a highly secularized nation, the fast majority of Israelis don't care about the Lord God of Israel anymore. However, God only favours who walk in obedience to Him and keeps His commands.

[SUP]57 [/SUP]May the Lord our God be with us as he was with our ancestors; may he never leave us nor forsake us.[SUP]58 [/SUP]May he turn our hearts to him, to walk in obedience to him and keep the commands, decrees and laws he gave our ancestors.

(1 Kings 8:57–58 / NIV)


If God still favours this Israel it can probably do whatever it wants.
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Yes,I understand what you are saying.I'm talking about todays Israel too and God still favors them.Looking at history that is what I see and believe.Agree to disagree.:)
 
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Mitspa

Guest
#29
#29
prodigal said:
its very clear

1 kings 11

9 The Lord became angry with Solomon because his heart had turned away from the Lord, the God of Israel, who had appeared to him twice.10 Although he had forbidden Solomon to follow other gods,Solomon did not keep the Lord’s command.11 So the Lord said to Solomon, “Since this is your attitude and you have not kept my covenant and my decrees, which I commanded you, I will most certainly tearthe kingdom away from you and give it to one of your subordinates.12 Nevertheless, for the sake of David your father, I will not do it during your lifetime. I will tear it out of the hand of your son.13 Yet I will not tear the whole kingdom from him, but will give him one tribe for the sake of David my servant and for the sake of Jerusalem, which I have chosen.”
( i.e the birth of jesus was the promise david looked forward too and prophecy fulfilled by the birth of Jesus)
This promise was for us, those that follow Jesus and Paul continues to explain

galations 3

16 The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. Scripture does not say “and to seeds,” meaning many people, but “and to your seed,”[i] meaning one person, who is Christ. 17 What I mean is this: The law, introduced 430 years later, does not set aside the covenant previously established by God and thus do away with the promise. 18 For if the inheritance depends on the law, then it no longer depends on the promise; but God in his grace gave it to Abraham through a promise.

26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.


so we have 2 choices accept Jesus or dont, there is not a third way its Jesus or no way,
Paul himself was proof that jews are saved in the same way as gentiles.

Romans 1:16

​
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
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Ro 11:23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
 
D

didymos

Guest
#30
#30
kaylagrl said:
Yes,I understand what you are saying.I'm talking about todays Israel too and God still favors them.Looking at history that is what I see and believe.Agree to disagree.:)
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That Israel came into existence in 1948, since then it has been primarily favoured by the West (aka the US). I'd love to see your hypothesis put to the test though. Let's see what happens if the US withdraws its support. :rolleyes:
 
P

prodigal

Guest
#31
#31
Mitspa said:
Ro 11:23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?
are you saying some will be saved without accepting Jesus

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
and paul is the example of this, his point was dont reject jews as they have the same right as gentile to accept christ(people were blaming jews for Jesus death)
27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
the new covenant made by Jesus
28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
by them rejecting Jesus made way for gentile to enter in
29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
laws which are kept recieve the promises of god for keeping them laws,
i refer you to 1kings11:11 the covenant was conditional

26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.


so who are the promises for ???
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,,,,,,,,,,,
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#32
#32
didymos said:

That Israel came into existence in 1948, since then it has been primarily favoured by the West (aka the US). I'd love to see your hypothesis put to the test though. Let's see what happens if the US withdraws its support. :rolleyes:
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You'd be right there.They will stand or fall if you're right or I am.The US isn't mentioned in the Bible so Israel will have to stand alone.
 
Agricola

Agricola

Senior Member
#33
Dec 10, 2012
2,638
88
48
#33
didymos said:

That Israel came into existence in 1948, since then it has been primarily favoured by the West (aka the US). I'd love to see your hypothesis put to the test though. Let's see what happens if the US withdraws its support. :rolleyes:
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The wars Israel have fought are evidence enough to show that God is protecting them, which the USA had nothing to do with. 5 defeats in 25 years have also persuaded Arab nations that Israel existence is for now in Gods plans.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#34
#34
Agricola said:
The wars Israel have fought are evidence enough to show that God is protecting them, which the USA had nothing to do with. 5 defeats in 25 years have also persuaded Arab nations that Israel existence is for now in Gods plans.
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Great point! Thanks for sharing it.
 
J

jahsoul

Guest
#35
#35
Agricola said:
The wars Israel have fought are evidence enough to show that God is protecting them, which the USA had nothing to do with. 5 defeats in 25 years have also persuaded Arab nations that Israel existence is for now in Gods plans.
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You do know a lot of israel's wars have been preemptive and the ones that weren't were usually the result of the preemptive conflicts. Just want to put that comment into perspective. We can't sit and act as if the state of israel was just some scared country being bullied by it neighbors. Shoot, reading the declassified documents from the Six Day War leads you to believe that others felt as though it was the total opposite.
 
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didymos

Guest
#36
#36
Agricola said:
The wars Israel have fought are evidence enough to show that God is protecting them, which the USA had nothing to do with. 5 defeats in 25 years have also persuaded Arab nations that Israel existence is for now in Gods plans.
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Israel couldn't have done it without arms shipments, financial support and intelligence from the West. The defeats of the 'Arab nations' was also caused by mismanagement and corruption on their part, Israel has always been better organized. Unlike the 'Arab Nations' Israel can not afford to be defeated, they got nowehere to run (except the rest of the world). IF 'the arabs' REALLY could make it their common goal to defeat Israel it would be crushed, but since they are highly divided I doubt that will ever happen.
 
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prodigal

Guest
#37
#37
kennethcadwell said:
Genesis 12:3

And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.
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doesn't paul explain that in galations 3:16 cant be christ and israel, i thought christ was the fulfillment of the law and the prophets or have i got that wrong
 
Desdichado

Desdichado

Senior Member
#38
Feb 9, 2014
8,768
838
113
#38
didymos said:
Israel couldn't have done it without arms shipments, financial support and intelligence from the West. The defeats of the 'Arab nations' was also caused by mismanagement and corruption on their part, Israel has always been better organized. Unlike the 'Arab Nations' Israel can not afford to be defeated, they got nowehere to run (except the rest of the world). IF 'the arabs' REALLY could make it their common goal to defeat Israel it would be crushed, but since they are highly divided I doubt that will ever happen.
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I mostly agree, but I find that is only half the story. The West has a way of pouring oodles of money into failed geopolitical projects.
 
C

ChristIsGod

Guest
#40
#40
Mitspa said:
The New Testament confirms Gods calling on Israel by promise and not because they deserve it...but simple because God keeps His promises.....Paul said they are beloved because of the promises made to the fathers...but they are yet enemies of the gospel. When you see Israel blessed and supernaturally protected by God...know that its not because they "earned" it...
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But He also promised severe chastisement [trodden under by the Gentiles & the false religious system that owns a large part of Jerusalem and has plans for more] to them [because of their sin against Him] BEFORE HE fulfills the promise by His Returning & ransoming a remnant-only of the children of Abraham.
 
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