James 5:14-16

[Pamella]

'Is anyone among you sick? Then he must call for the elders of the church and they are to pray over him...and if he has committed sins, they will be forgiven him.'

I heard this 'sick' is actually a sin sickness. What does the Greek say for this word?

Then it says 'Confess your sins to one another and pray for one another that you may be healed.'
That seems to be in line then with it being sin and not physical sickness.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

You could be right.

G770 ἀσθενέω astheneo (as-then-eh'-o) v.
1. to be feeble (in any sense)

 

[John146]

Take the word for what it says. Besides, just after it says "if" he has committed sins.

Now I ask, does this happen? Scripture says here that the prayers of the elders shall save the sick. It is a guarantee to the audience of James that if one is sick and the elders pray over them, he will be healed. Not only that, but if he has committed sins, his sins will be forgiven. How can you reconcile this with what the Lord said through Paul?

 

[Pamella]

Take the word for what it says. Besides, just after it says "if" he has committed sins.

Now I ask, does this happen? Scripture says here that the prayers of the elders shall save the sick. It is a guarantee to the audience of James that if one is sick and the elders pray over them, he will be healed. Not only that, but if he has committed sins, his sins will be forgiven. How can you reconcile this with what the Lord said through Paul?

I just don't see the correlation between getting healed physically thru the elders and getting your sins forgiven. Could you please elaborate on what you talking about concerning the apostle Paul? Thanks

 

[John146]

The signs of the apostles has ceased. Paul tells his understudy Timothy to use a little wine for his infirmities. No where does Paul tell the church to pray over a person and they will be healed.

1 Timothy 5:23, “Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thine often infirmities.”

 

[p_rehbein]

Search of Scriptures concerning healing the sick/afflicted:

James 5:15 - And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.

3 John 1:2 - Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.

James 5:14-16 - Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord: (Read More...)

1 Peter 2:24 - Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Mark 16:17-18 - And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; (Read More...)

Isaiah 53:5 - But he [was] wounded for our transgressions, [he was] bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace [was] upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

2 Corinthians 5:7 - (For we walk by faith, not by sight

1 John 5:14 - And this is the confidence that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, he heareth us:

John 14:13 - And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.

John 14:12 - Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater [works] than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

Hebrews 13:8 - Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

Isaiah 53:4-5 - Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. (Read More...)

Proverbs 4:20-22 - My son, attend to my words; incline thine ear unto my sayings. (Read More...)

Romans 10:17 - So then faith [cometh] by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

James 5:14-15 - Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord: (Read More...)

Exodus 15:26 - And said, If thou wilt diligently hearken to the voice of the LORD thy God, and wilt do that which is right in his sight, and wilt give ear to his commandments, and keep all his statutes, I will put none of these diseases upon thee, which I have brought upon the Egyptians: for I [am] the LORD that healeth thee.

Hebrews 11:1 - Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Psalms 34:19 - Many [are] the afflictions of the righteous: but the LORD delivereth him out of them all.

Hebrews 11:6 - But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

John 10:10 - The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have [it] more abundantly.

Acts 3:6 - Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk.

Mark 16:18 - They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

Psalms 103:2-3 - Bless the LORD, O my soul, and forget not all his benefits: (Read More...)

Mark 16:17 - And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

Psalms 41:4 - I said, LORD, be merciful unto me: heal my soul; for I have sinned against thee.

Revelation 21:4 - And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

Psalms 103:3 - Who forgiveth all thine iniquities; who healeth all thy diseases;

Acts 19:11-12 - And God wrought special miracles by the hands of Paul: (Read More...)

1 Corinthians 12:28 - And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.

 

[garee]

'Is anyone among you sick? Then he must call for the elders of the church and they are to pray over him...and if he has committed sins, they will be forgiven him.'

I heard this 'sick' is actually a sin sickness. What does the Greek say for this word?

Then it says 'Confess your sins to one another and pray for one another that you may be healed.'
That seems to be in line then with it being sin and not physical sickness.

It’s one of those two fold things that works in us in two ways. The spiritual not seen, as well as the physical, as that seen.

I think either could cause the other.

I found what I think is an interesting fact in respect to healing.... either one not seen, the spiritual, and the other as that in which we do see ...or both when I was looking at the word worshipped..

The first worship (eusebeo, to act piously or reverently) is how we normally understand the word but the later in respect to worshipped has a different Greek word used once that gives us the idea of therapeutic

For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship(eusebeo, to act piously or reverently), him declare I unto you.God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;Neither is worshipped (therapeuo, to heal, cure, restore to health)with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things; Act 17:23

Strongs lexicon..... 2323 therapeuo {ther-ap-yoo'-o} from the same as 2324; TDNT - 3:128,331; v
AV - heal 38, cure 5, worship 1; 441) to serve, do service 2) to heal, cure, restore to health

 

[Joidevivre]

Believe what you want, but one morning when a few of the mature, strong in the knowledge of God and faith (elders) in my church prayed for me and anointed me with oil as James directed, that night I was healed completely. It was a type of flu, yet when they prayed, I felt a warmth in my entire body.

Just saying.

 

[hornetguy]

Having the elders pray over you is very powerful. We prayed for one of the guys in our small group, who had colon cancer surgery...he had lost a brother and a sister to the same disease. While none of us were ordained elders, there were a couple of guys that were certainly "qualified" to be...
The surgery was successful, and he's been cancer free for 7 or 8 years now.

Prayer works wonders...

Just because Paul didn't say to do it, doesn't mean we are not to.. I'm sure there are lots of things Paul didn't feel the need to spell out.

 

[John146]

Having the elders pray over you is very powerful. We prayed for one of the guys in our small group, who had colon cancer surgery...he had lost a brother and a sister to the same disease. While none of us were ordained elders, there were a couple of guys that were certainly "qualified" to be...
The surgery was successful, and he's been cancer free for 7 or 8 years now.

Prayer works wonders...

Just because Paul didn't say to do it, doesn't mean we are not to.. I'm sure there are lots of things Paul didn't feel the need to spell out.

What James is saying is that the prayers of the elders WILL heal the sick, and not only that, the prayers of the elders WILL forgive sins of the man being healed. Yes, we are to pray for one another, but sometimes the sick, diseased, and injured aren't healed.

Bible students have never been successful in trying to make the book of James align with Paul.

 

[Grace777x70]

It seems that healing and the knowledge of the forgiveness of sins is somehow tied together. Jesus a few times said.."What is easier to say - your sins are forgiven or to say take up your bed and walk "...

Maybe James is talking about having the knowledge of your sins forgiven will help the person being prayed for because James says "Therefore , confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another , so that you may be healed.

Sins that we are holding against one another in our minds will affect our faith to receive healing. Our hearts ( which to me the mind is a part of ) condemn us, as John says.

1 John 3:20-21 (KJV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things
.
[SUP]21 [/SUP] Beloved, if our heart condemn us not, then have we confidence toward God.

 

[John146]

I'm sorry. There are people who are prayed for all the time by elders of faith that never receive healing. That's a fact. James says that WILL be healed. No maybes, or ifs about it. You cannot reconcile James to the Church Age.

 

[Grace777x70]

I'm sorry. There are people who are prayed for all the time by elders of faith that never receive healing. That's a fact. James says that WILL be healed. No maybes, or ifs about it. You cannot reconcile James to the Church Age.

James doesn't say "by elders of faith". He says "'the prayer offered in faith will restore the one who is sick." Praying over someone by itself because someone calls you an elder is not indicative that some is praying in faith. Those are 2 different things.

James 5:14-16 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] Is anyone among you sick? Then he must call for the elders of the church and they are to pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord;

[SUP]15 [/SUP] and the prayer offered in faith will restore the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up, and if he has committed sins, they will be forgiven him.

[SUP]16 [/SUP] Therefore, confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The effective prayer of a righteous man can accomplish much.

 

[PurerInHeart]

It is physical sickness, but physical sickness can be brought on by sin. Matter of fact, all sickness is a punishment for sin. However, it does not mean the sick person was the one who sinned. If a homosexual gets AIDS, and a mosquito bites him and then bites another person, it does not mean THAT person committed that dreadful sin. But people do get sick due to their own sin problems, but it does not automatically mean that.

The apostles asked Jesus about a man blind since birth. They asked who sinned- him or his parents? Jesus said he was blind for a different reason- so that He could miraculously make him see, so that witnesses can clearly see that Jesus truly was the Son of God. But Jesus also said, "What is easier to say, be healed, or your sins are forgiven you?" Conclusion: sickness is caused by sin, but there are some exceptions, but we all sin anyways and all deserve the consequences thereof, however being that Christ paid for the Christians sins, we may ask the elders to pray over us, because the prayer of a righteous man is powerful and effective.

 

[John146]

James doesn't say "by elders of faith". He says "'the prayer offered in faith will restore the one who is sick." Praying over someone by itself because someone calls you an elder is not indicative that some is praying in faith. Those are 2 different things.

James 5:14-16 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] Is anyone among you sick? Then he must call for the elders of the church and they are to pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord;

[SUP]15 [/SUP] and the prayer offered in faith will restore the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up, and if he has committed sins, they will be forgiven him.

[SUP]16 [/SUP] Therefore, confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The effective prayer of a righteous man can accomplish much.

Are you saying that every time elders pray in faith over a sick, diseased, or injured person, that person is physically healed?

 

[Grace777x70]

Are you saying that every time elders pray in faith over a sick, diseased, or injured person, that person is physically healed?

That's what James said....the key is.."are these elders "- really elders in the Lord or are they just appointed by man and are in fact still baby Christians even though they have been saved for 50 years?

The other question is ..Are these elders really "in faith" believing when they pray?

 

[garee]

Believe what you want, but one morning when a few of the mature, strong in the knowledge of God and faith (elders) in my church prayed for me and anointed me with oil as James directed, that night I was healed completely. It was a type of flu, yet when they prayed, I felt a warmth in my entire body.

Just saying.

I hear what you are saying. Its a blessing you were healed of any kind what we consdier big or little illness. But we are not healed by human hands as if God was served by them..The elders using the laying on of hands symbolized the anointing work of the Holy Spirit not seen and oil can be used .But if there is a healing, to attribute to men is the blaspheme the name we called by. Its a blessing when done in a proper manner of spirit (not after men) I would be thankful they did honor God according to the ceremonial law.

I experienced such laying on of hands by the elders and it moved me to start to get to know the persons the hands were laid on. Seeing Alzheimer's demanded he go into a nursing Home and live apart from his wife of 60 years or so.

 

[Joidevivre]

I hear what you are saying. Its a blessing you were healed of any kind what we consdier big or little illness. But we are not healed by human hands as if God was served by them..The elders using the laying on of hands symbolized the anointing work of the Holy Spirit not seen and oil can be used .But if there is a healing, to attribute to men is the blaspheme the name we called by. Its a blessing when done in a proper manner of spirit (not after men) I would be thankful they did honor God according to the ceremonial law.

I experienced such laying on of hands by the elders and it moved me to start to get to know the persons the hands were laid on. Seeing Alzheimer's demanded he go into a nursing Home and live apart from his wife of 60 years or so.

Of course, I realize that we are to only act as directed by the Lord because he is the one doing any healing. And the oil is symbolic of the Holy Spirit. And the one sick is the one to call for the elders (and I say that loosely). The actual elders in many churches do not have the faith or knowledge and more importantly the compassion that some of the other members have.

In my instance, the Lord gave me a strong impulse to call ask for a few people to pray for me. He not only wanted to heal me, but I also think he wanted to affirm them in the power of their prayers and the reality of his presence to heal. Because one of the ladies who prayed for me actually felt an anointing in her hands for the first time. At the same time I was feeling warmth. It amazed her and moved her to a new dimension of faith in God's presence to heal. Who knows, maybe I was the teaching tool the Lord wanted to use?

And no one knows more than me that not every person is healed through any type of prayer. The key is flowing with the Holy Spirit - discernment.

 

[garee]

I'm sorry. There are people who are prayed for all the time by elders of faith that never receive healing. That's a fact. James says that WILL be healed. No maybes, or ifs about it. You cannot reconcile James to the Church Age.

Hi John.

Yes, not everyone is healed

I would think it is “whose faith” as a work that does the work of healing. We do not look to the elders in respect to the faith of Christ, the anointing faith of God. They can be used as a metaphor as a ceremonial law(shadow) but if there is a healing it is between the one who cries out, and the God who can heal if he so chooses to.

To attribute the work of healing to any man even an apostle .Like with Paul below who first was given the faith coming from heaven in order to perceive the crippled person could be healed .Attributing it to the apostle would be to blaspheme the holy name we are called by. We are to have no gods before our living God .Making a apostle into a god come down to us in the likeness of men, violates the first commandment.

We walk by faith (the unseen eternal) not by sight.

And there sat a certain man at Lystra, impotent in his feet, being a cripple from his mother's womb, who never had walked: The same heard Paul speak: who stedfastly beholding him, and perceiving that he (the cripple) had faith to be healed, Said with a loud voice, Stand upright on thy feet. And he leaped and walked.And when the people saw “what Paul had done”, they lifted up their voices, saying in the speech of Lycaonia, The gods are come down to us in the likeness of men. Act 14:8

 

[John146]

That's what James said....the key is.."are these elders "- really elders in the Lord or are they just appointed by man and are in fact still baby Christians even though they have been saved for 50 years?

The other question is ..Are these elders really "in faith" believing when they pray?

That is what James said to the twelve tribes scattered abroad. You know I view the Bible according to dispensations. I always reconcile church doctrine through the Apostle Paul's 13 epistles as he gave to the body of Christ.