June 6, 1944: D-Day In Memoriam

[HeIsHere]

rhetorical spin on any situation could suggest otherwise.

Oh, I know your sarcasm and ignored the word "rhetorical" and answered in the way I wanted to answer, smile emoji indicates I saw you little dig as per your usual style of conversation.

I did not say that society was already here, but surely people who reduce 80 years of history to one paragraph and can only see "good guys versus the bad guys" could fit right in.

 

[ZNP]

The Holocaust I'm referring to are the ~6 million Jews who were murdered by Hitler and the Nazis during WWII:

The Holocaust | The National WWII Museum | New Orleans (nationalww2museum.org)

And amen--if we don't learn from history, we are bound to repeat it. Our current era proves this is true because we are doing some of the same dumb things we have done in the past that yielded bad results.

What about the 5 million who were also killed in the concentration camps by the Nazi's who weren't Jewish? They don't count?

 

[Moses_Young]

I think an important question to ask is why don't people know about the 80th Anniversary of the D-Day invasion taking place but are unthinkingly able to recite a figure of 6 million when the word "holocaust" is mentioned.

 

[HeIsHere]

I think an important question to ask is why don't people know about the 80th Anniversary of the D-Day invasion taking place but are unthinkingly able to recite a figure of 6 million when the word "holocaust" is mentioned.

Interesting point?

 

[iamsoandso]

My point was the Soviets had already won the war in Europe two years prior to D-Day with the battles of Stalingrad, Kurst, Moscow and then Leningrad.

D- Day was an heroic effort but by then the Germans were basically doomed, D-Day allowed them to follow through easier.

The words "won the war" are not really applicable to the situation I was referring to on Warsaw Poland. The reason why took place before the war began in the Molotov, Ribbentrop pact which was an agreement between Russia and Germany to divide Europe at the Curzon line and for Russia to rule the east while Germany ruled the West. Notice that Russia at first stopped it's military at Warsaw Poland and did not help them in Warsaw on the Curzon line. The agreement between Germany and Russia prior to the war was that Germany would have control of that part of Poland. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov–Ribbentrop_Pact Many of these agreements between Germany/Hitler and Russia/Stalin were unknown until the Nuremberg trials and is where and when the "cold war" began(we realized Russia was playing both sides in secret)... You have to read it but here is Adolph Hitler discussing the issue adolph hitler video on train in finlan

 

[iamsoandso]

not sure if the link worked but here it is again

 

[ZNP]

I think it is fair to say that the Normandy landing was "the beginning of the end" of WW2. But Russia had suffered and lost so much that it is still plausible the war would not have ended in unconditional surrender had not the Allies landed in Normandy. Also, the war in Europe was not the war in the Pacific. It is fair for Russia to complain about the allies not landing in Europe sooner, but on the other hand they had very little to do with the war in the Pacific. Also, at the time of D day no one knew about the atomic bomb, so no one was predicting a soon end to the war. Even with Germany falling they were still predicting a million or more casualties in trying to take Japan.

 

[iamsoandso]

not sure if the link worked but here it is again

Yep if you read along with what AH is saying he mentions Normandy as hindering him so D-Day had already taken place by the time of the recording. D-day and the US joining into to the war in Europe thru a monkey wrench into Russia's plan to let Germany be worn down by GB to so that Russia could then continue to invade Germany and rule,,, "all of Europe",,,(they were waiting for GB and Germany to become weak and did not think the US would join in Europe) ,,,,,D-Day and the US presence turned the tide because Russia could no longer take over Germany,GB,France,Spain ect. at their weakest point in time...

 

[SilverFox7]

hmm,all but maybe Warsaw. In their case they decided to take a break and watch the Germans slaughter the Jews and other Polish allies... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Uprising

A tragic event that often gets overlooked in the scope of the entire war.

 

[SilverFox7]

What about the 5 million who were also killed in the concentration camps by the Nazi's who weren't Jewish? They don't count?

They do count for sure. My focus was the Jewish count.

How many other millions of lives are the Nazis responsible for in WW2? ~50 million?

 

[HeIsHere]

The Russians won the war on the battlefield against Nazi Germany.

I stated this

hmm,all but maybe Warsaw. In their case they decided to take a break and watch the Germans slaughter the Jews and other Polish allies... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Uprising

You responded.

My response to now is, if we are going to discuss which country was the most moral/ethical during the war then that would be a different topic.

 

[ZNP]

They do count for sure. My focus was the Jewish count.

How many other millions of lives are the Nazis responsible for in WW2? ~50 million?

not in gas chambers

 

[HeIsHere]

The 80th Anniversary of the D-Day invasion is taking place today, and it is an important day in the history of the free world. As a WWII scholar and historian who focuses a lot on the European campaign, this day is evoking some strong emotions for me on the sacrifices so many English, American, and Canadian soldiers made to begin the liberation process of France and start driving the Nazi forces out of occupied countries.

My grandfather served in Patton's 3rd army during the latter part of the Battle of Bulge in January of 1945, and he was shot through the neck by a sniper in the Spring when his platoon was making their way through a German city. Thankfully, he survived, and he's the primary reason why I am so passionate about preserving this history.

Here are some startling statistics I learned from the news this morning:

View attachment 264468
Thank you to all of those who contributed to the successful landings on the Normandy beaches, and thank you to all of their families as well. While my grandpa was not there for the invasion, he helped to push the Germans back into Germany later in the European campaign. I was struck to learn from my wife that he was 25 years old when he was commissioned, which tells me that America was digging deep into the pool to throw all available resources at winning the war in Europe as swiftly as possible.

My current WWII study is Eisenhower's memoir Crusade in Europe, and it is outstanding:

On a separate note, I respect Eisenhower, he warned of the "military industrial complex."

 

[SilverFox7]

I think an important question to ask is why don't people know about the 80th Anniversary of the D-Day invasion taking place but are unthinkingly able to recite a figure of 6 million when the word "holocaust" is mentioned.

Good point. I think it was education that made the holocaust = 6 million association in my mind. I've heard an 8 million number used, too.

Regardless, what a tragedy and black mark on humanity. It is a fallen world that needs redemption for sure.

 

[SilverFox7]

On a separate note, I respect Eisenhower, he warned of the "military industrial complex."

Thanks. I plan to read about his presidency down the road, too.

 

[HeIsHere]

Thanks. I plan to read about his presidency down the road, too.

An amazing portion of the speech, when leaders spoke intelligently before the advent of Idiocracy, he warned and yet here we are.

 

[iamsoandso]

I stated this




You responded.

My response to now is, if we are going to discuss which country was the most moral/ethical during the war then that would be a different topic.

No really I wasn't meaning who was more or less moral or ethical during ww2(I have low opinions of several of those involved,lol) I just didn't see Russia the same as you is all. Anyway I was only five when it first began and eleven or twelve when it ended in the first place so what would I know about it right?

 

[HeIsHere]

No really I wasn't meaning who was more or less moral or ethical during ww2(I have low opinions of several of those involved,lol) I just didn't see Russia the same as you is all. Anyway I was only five when it first began and eleven or twelve when it ended in the first place so what would I know about it right?

While having experienced it first hand as my parents did in Europe is valuable and I have learned a lot from them, I think that while we may not like a certain country or leader we cannot deny the documented effort and manpower the Soviet Union put in to the defeat the Nazi's on the eastern front.

 

[Susanna]

Oh, I know your sarcasm and ignored the word "rhetorical" and answered in the way I wanted to answer, smile emoji indicates I saw you little dig as per your usual style of conversation.

I did not say that society was already here, but surely people who reduce 80 years of history to one paragraph and can only see "good guys versus the bad guys" could fit right in.

I guess you are one of the people who can see through it all.

While having experienced if first hand as my parents did in Europe is valuable and I have learned a lot from them, I think that while we may not like a certain country or leader we cannot deny the documented effort and manpower the Soviet Union put into the defeat the Nazi's on the eastern front.

A lot of those soldiers were from Ukraine and other republics which seceded from the Soviet Union after the collapse of that empire.

 

[HeIsHere]

I guess you are one of the people who can see through it all.


A lot of those soldiers were from Ukraine and other republics which seceded from the Soviet Union after the collapse of that empire.

Yup, that is the way it goes the powerful oppress .. just like how the Palestinians have been oppressed since 1947.