Leibniz’ Contingency Argument

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Marano

Marano

Senior Member
#1
Dec 7, 2011
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#1
So, what do you guys think of this video?


 
T

theanointedsinner

Guest
#2
#2
everything that exist (does this include also God himself) has an explanation of it's existence

what it's saying is, either there's infinitely long chain of contingently existing things (ie: I don't have to be born)

or, there is at least one "necessary" thing to cause those ongoing chain of contingently existing thing

it ultimately depends if someone is open-minded to the possibility of a spiritual being that created physical things
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#3
Aug 17, 2015
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#3
The core of the Leibnizian argument is that there are two different groups of things:
a) things that exist necessarily - God, abstract objects
b) things that exists contingently - as a reaction on something else (like Universe); the length of the chain is irrelevant, somewhere in the beginning it had to be created by a necessary existing object.
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#4
Aug 17, 2015
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The counterargument I can imagine is that somebody will say "the necessary existing object that created everything there is, is not a personality, it can be strings or something similar"

One would have to get into discussion if the supposed strings are existing necesarrily or not.
 
Marano

Marano

Senior Member
#5
Dec 7, 2011
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trofimus said:
The counterargument I can imagine is that somebody will say "the necessary existing object that created everything there is, is not a personality, it can be strings or something similar"

One would have to get into discussion if the supposed strings are existing necesarrily or not.
Click to expand...
If the necessary being isn't a person with intelligence it would not be able to create anything, every contigent thing demands an intelligent creator, or do we suppose chance created every contingent thing.
Also if the necessary being isn't intelligent how do we not fall on an infinite regress? We would never really know if that being was really necessary as it could just be the creation of another non intelligent being, so we end up on an infinite regress, etc.
 
tourist

tourist

Senior Member
#7
Mar 13, 2014
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Tennessee
#7
trofimus said:
The counterargument I can imagine is that somebody will say "the necessary existing object that created everything there is, is not a personality, it can be strings or something similar"

One would have to get into discussion if the supposed strings are existing necesarrily or not.
Click to expand...
Maybe that is what 'string theory' is about.
 
Marano

Marano

Senior Member
#8
Dec 7, 2011
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tourist said:
I enjoyed it very much and found it to be spiritually plausible.
Click to expand...
I don't know if you know about this, but there are many channels/videos on youtube that do philosophy from a christian/biblical perspective but I will never say they are always right, we should examine these things carefully, this one seems good.
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#9
Aug 17, 2015
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tourist said:
Maybe that is what 'string theory' is about.
Click to expand...
I also think that the theory of strings is a try of atheism to get rid of God. Like multiverse is a try of atheism to get rid of fine tuning of this universe.

It cannot be proved, its just a hypothetical model. We will see what the future will bring.
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#10
Aug 17, 2015
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#10
Marano said:
If the necessary being isn't a person with intelligence it would not be able to create anything, every contigent thing demands an intelligent creator, or do we suppose chance created every contingent thing.
Also if the necessary being isn't intelligent how do we not fall on an infinite regress? We would never really know if that being was really necessary as it could just be the creation of another non intelligent being, so we end up on an infinite regress, etc.
Click to expand...
If I am not mistaken, the theory of strings postulates that strings vibrate on all possible frequencies making all possible universes at once. Therefore there is no specific willful creation of one line/plan, but all various universes are still being created eternally.
 
T

theanointedsinner

Guest
#11
#11
flip 12 coins and line them up verbatum from left to right, up to down

THT
HHH
THT
THT

2^12 = 4096
so that happen randomly is the odds of 1/4096

and since the H's form the image of the cross, the human mind can immediate recognize it as "intentioanlly set up" hence, helps eliminate some bias against the "intelligent design" argument
 
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