No, the elect were not bon saved. They were under God's wrath, even as others.[Ephesians 2:3]
We were elected to salvation, but pre-conversion, we were still lost, born lost.
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No, the elect were not bon saved. They were under God's wrath, even as others.[Ephesians 2:3]
We were elected to salvation, but pre-conversion, we were still lost, born lost.
Exactly. Now, these are God's ways, and to us they may not make logical sense, but yes, all the elect were under wrath as well as the rest of mankind.
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kaylagrl
Guest
[FONT="]Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.
Ummm that does not say anything about Adam,nor does it say sinless. David was called a man after Gods own heart and yet he sinned. This does not show Adam as sinless.[/FONT]
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kaylagrl
Guest
Adam was made in the image of God. We are the marred image of God, post-fall. Seth was made in Adam's image, the marred image of God.[Genesis 5:3]
People don't really need more and more answers, they simply need to believe what they've already been shown: Ephesians 2:3, all those to whom Paul had written, that is, the elect, they were taught they too were under God's wrath. This completely destroys hyper-calvinism.
People need to also understand this: election is the milk of the Word, not the meat, there is absolutely no reason to be gagging on it.
People need to also understand this: election is the milk of the Word, not the meat, there is absolutely no reason to be gagging on it.
Actually the biblical stance would be we were elected from BEFORE the creation of the world.[Ephesians 1:4]
They were left in their fallen state, not made for destruction.
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kaylagrl
Guest
We are made in His image,yes, but we are not sinless nor was Adam. Adam was,obviously,capable of sin and he received the punishment for it along with Eve.
Adam was breathed life by God. To say Adam was not sinless pre-fall is heresy.
The wages of sin is death. If Adam was not sinless prior to eating of that tree, then eating of it would have never affected him.
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kaylagrl
Guest
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Alright,before creation is still before birth,before you landed on earth. Left in a fallen state still means made for destruction.They cannot respond,correct?
They can. But you know what? They will not. Why? Habit.
"Can an Ethiopian change his skin or a leopard its spots? Neither can you do good who are accustomed to doing evil."
Jer 13:23
Do not make God what He is not. Our own evilness is stepping on our leash.
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kaylagrl
Guest
If Adam was sinless he wouldn't have eaten of the tree! He couldn't,he was sinless. Are you saying Adam was deified?
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kaylagrl
Guest
The gospel, when it is proclaimed, never goes w/o a response. Ppl will say yea or nay. The unregenerate don't want God, they don't go around seeking Him.
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kaylagrl
Guest
Adam was given a choice and he chose sin.The possibility was there to sin and Adam and Eve chose to sin. They were given choice,as we all are. They were not incapable of sinning as Jesus was.
Exactly. If he was sinless before that choice, then God warning him that he'd die the moment he ate of that tree would have been moot.
They were made incorrupted, but not incorruptible.
When they sinned, they fell completely. Even their wills. After God came seeking them, they ran and hid. Not so before then.
Never stated anything to the contrary.
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kaylagrl
Guest
The Holy Spirit is always drawing man to God. And they have the choice to heed the call. The Bible says "seek Him while He may be found" The Bible says to repent and live. That shows we have a choice to listen and to follow.