Life after salvation

Blik · Dec 25, 2020

After we are forgiven our sins through Christ we will be able to live with the Lord in paradise. After we are saved, does it change how we live in this world?

I think we are to change.

Scripture tells us that when we are saved we are in Christ. We live, not to ourselves, but to Christ. We cannot live to sin and live to be in Christ, for Christ is without sin. Yet, we are told that we cannot be human and be sinless, so we do sin.

The Lord makes allowances for our sin, the Lord offers forgiveness always. It is our will that the Lord asks us for. In the language of scripture we are told to repent. We are only asked to want to be sinless, to strive towards that as our goal.

We are given many instructions about what these goals are to be. Here is a list of some of them: Be baptized, meet with other Christians, pray, give, select Christian friends, grow, serve the Lord, share, praise God, love your neighbor, build others up, do not tear down, accept other without judging, ask that the Lord’s will be done, not our fleshly will.

We are told these things are not to burden us with rules, but to free us to live with the fruits of the spirit in abundance and joy. If they are done reluctantly, like a little boy dragging his feed to obey his Dad, they are only burdens and not freedom.

Romans 8:29 "Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." (II Corinthians 5:17)

Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

"Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." (II Corinthians 5:17)

Magenta · Dec 26, 2020

Galatians 2:20-21

stepbystep · Dec 26, 2020

Salvation is not the end of our life in Jesus, it is the beginning. Those things you listed in your Comment are basic principals of living a Christian life I believe. However, all of us were called by God for a specific purpose that He purposed us for. This "calling" is so very important for us to learn and to do.

Ephesians Chapter 2, verse 10 says:

For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Those God has purposed, He also equips. He does this through the Gifts of the Holy Spirit. Each of us are given a "gift" that will allow us to be able to accomplish what God has purposed us for.

eternally-gratefull · Dec 26, 2020

Magenta said:

Amen

it is not we must, it is more like we will as we live out our new creation

a new creature cannot live like he did before it’s Impossible

Corban · Dec 26, 2020

Blik said:

You have touched an important point. Are we saved to go to heaven to be with the Lord? Or are we saved for some grand purpose? I propose that man is saved for two reasons.

God's honor and councils. Who is God if one of His creatures - an angel, can force Him to change His course and purpose? If so, His claim to the title of "THE ALMIGHTY" lies in tatters. But NO! He IS omnipotent and His councils will come to pass
God's love and sense of responsibility for His creature - Man. You and I, if we had made Adam and saw his abominable state after the fall, would have immediately started anew. But God is God. His every oves shows His glory. And what better opportunity to display His glory than to recover what is totally lost and degraded.

What we call "Salvation" is strictly speaking, a RESTORATION. But because the consequences are so dire, our restoration is called a "Salvation". To understand the scope of our salvation, and this should motivate and give direction to our walk after believing, we must first find out what needs rstoring, and then find out what the original man was made for. If we can discover this, then our walk after salvation (or moment of conversion) should become apparent. Let's reverse the order to shorten the posting.

Man has FIVE major problems.
He is judicially OFFSIDES. He has offended the Living and Perfect God and justice calls for RETRIBUTION. This retribution is to render the man "useless for the intended purpose". The common word for this is "PERDITION". Perdition does not mean annihilation, or cessation of existence. It means that with exquisite suffering attached, you are rendered "useless for the intended purpose". We say that the Titanic was "lost". The Titanic was intended to cruise above the waves with passengers in luxury. Now, it is still a ship, but has become "useless for the intended purpose". The Titanic is all still there, and still a ship, but it lies under the waves and rusts - a heap of ruin. If man is not SAVED from God's RETRIBUTION he face eternity in PERDITION.
His human spirit was supposed to be the home of God, just as the Holy of Holies in the Tabernacle/Temple was. The spirit of man is his vitality (Jas.2:26). But it was made to hold the vitality of God - eternal life. Any man who is not born again will suffer an eternal loss. He never achieved what he was designed for.
His human SOUL, the thinking, feeling and deciding organs, are totally corrupted by a lifetime of pandering to the flesh. A man is a SOUL. It is his major part (Gen.2:7). It is this part of man that was supposed to think, feel and decide for God. But all it does is follow the dictates of the flesh.
His body was supposed to be a member of God's glorious corporate House on earth - the Church. But death due to sin, destroys that House as our bodies are its members (1st Cor.6:15). We are His flesh and bones (Eph.5:30). In His very first mention of the Church, our Lord Jesus said that Hades (not hell), the place of the dead, would not prevail against the Church. That is, the Gates of Hades will be forced open to let the souls of dead men out to join with their bodies in RESURRECTION so that God's House, God's Garden for meeting men, God's EXPRESSION on earth, Christ's Body, CAN BE RESTORED.
Lastly, man was made for SUBDUING and RULING the earth. That is, the establishment of a Kingdom on earth where God's type of rule is enforced. If man does not qualifiy for this Kingdom, he has failed, for it was his PURPOSE (Gen.1:26-28).

Thus, being saved by a Substitute from RETRIBUTION is only the first step in a full recovery. There is a sublime process that a man must follow to achieve his recovery. And it takes a lifetime and it is interwoven with God. Paul was converted on the road to Damascus and Baptized three days later. But his knowledge of God's Word was tainted and tinted by the glasses of the Pharisee. Peter and his motley company of fishermen and tax collectors need 3½ years with the Lord to be prepared for Pentecost. But Paul must (i) learn the mysteries of the Church and (ii) UNLEARN Pharisee-ism. This takes 14 years (Gal.1).

Paul must suffer much. Paul must know the power of God to build a Church among the heathen. Paul must learn the power of God to keep him in a shipwreck and from the bite of a viper. And Paul must lean failure as his ministry of building Churches ends in room in Rome. And writing from Rome, in his letter to the Philippians, he recounts how he must strive to gain Christ (3:8-14). He is, unbeknown to him, just over three years from his martyrdom, and he is still striving, keeping his flesh under and applying the cross. But as the last brutal day appears, Paul can say that he had fought the fight and run the race, and the just Judge would award that coveted crown to subdue and rule the earth after his resurrection. His full salvation though, must wait until he is judged by Christ, just after the Rapture.

Everything that happens to us, says Romans 8, is used by God to walk us through the process from beginning to end. Our darkest hours are our refining fire. Our greatest joys are our proof of a God Who cares. A man who has believed in and embraced Jesus Christ is on a road that leads to the four things that God made, and saved, him for:

He is to be in the image and likeness of Christ (Rom.8:29) to express and display God
He is to be a Bride "up to the standard of" Christ
He is to "fence about and bring to order" (lit. Heb.) a Garden where God can meet with man - the Church
He is subdue whatever opposes God and His plan, and then bring God's rule over the earth, sea and sky

Is this not so much higher than just going off to heaven to do ... who knows what (there are no scriptures)?

Blik · Dec 26, 2020

Corban said:

You have touched an important point. Are we saved to go to heaven to be with the Lord? Or are we saved for some grand purpose? I propose that man is saved for two reasons.

God's honor and councils. Who is God if one of His creatures - an angel, can force Him to change His course and purpose? If so, His claim to the title of "THE ALMIGHTY" lies in tatters. But NO! He IS omnipotent and His councils will come to pass
God's love and sense of responsibility for His creature - Man. You and I, if we had made Adam and saw his abominable state after the fall, would have immediately started anew. But God is God. His every oves shows His glory. And what better opportunity to display His glory than to recover what is totally lost and degraded.

What we call "Salvation" is strictly speaking, a RESTORATION. But because the consequences are so dire, our restoration is called a "Salvation". To understand the scope of our salvation, and this should motivate and give direction to our walk after believing, we must first find out what needs rstoring, and then find out what the original man was made for. If we can discover this, then our walk after salvation (or moment of conversion) should become apparent. Let's reverse the order to shorten the posting.

Man has FIVE major problems.
He is judicially OFFSIDES. He has offended the Living and Perfect God and justice calls for RETRIBUTION. This retribution is to render the man "useless for the intended purpose". The common word for this is "PERDITION". Perdition does not mean annihilation, or cessation of existence. It means that with exquisite suffering attached, you are rendered "useless for the intended purpose". We say that the Titanic was "lost". The Titanic was intended to cruise above the waves with passengers in luxury. Now, it is still a ship, but has become "useless for the intended purpose". The Titanic is all still there, and still a ship, but it lies under the waves and rusts - a heap of ruin. If man is not SAVED from God's RETRIBUTION he face eternity in PERDITION.
His human spirit was supposed to be the home of God, just as the Holy of Holies in the Tabernacle/Temple was. The spirit of man is his vitality (Jas.2:26). But it was made to hold the vitality of God - eternal life. Any man who is not born again will suffer an eternal loss. He never achieved what he was designed for.
His human SOUL, the thinking, feeling and deciding organs, are totally corrupted by a lifetime of pandering to the flesh. A man is a SOUL. It is his major part (Gen.2:7). It is this part of man that was supposed to think, feel and decide for God. But all it does is follow the dictates of the flesh.
His body was supposed to be a member of God's glorious corporate House on earth - the Church. But death due to sin, destroys that House as our bodies are its members (1st Cor.6:15). We are His flesh and bones (Eph.5:30). In His very first mention of the Church, our Lord Jesus said that Hades (not hell), the place of the dead, would not prevail against the Church. That is, the Gates of Hades will be forced open to let the souls of dead men out to join with their bodies in RESURRECTION so that God's House, God's Garden for meeting men, God's EXPRESSION on earth, Christ's Body, CAN BE RESTORED.
Lastly, man was made for SUBDUING and RULING the earth. That is, the establishment of a Kingdom on earth where God's type of rule is enforced. If man does not qualifiy for this Kingdom, he has failed, for it was his PURPOSE (Gen.1:26-28).

Thus, being saved by a Substitute from RETRIBUTION is only the first step in a full recovery. There is a sublime process that a man must follow to achieve his recovery. And it takes a lifetime and it is interwoven with God. Paul was converted on the road to Damascus and Baptized three days later. But his knowledge of God's Word was tainted and tinted by the glasses of the Pharisee. Peter and his motley company of fishermen and tax collectors need 3½ years with the Lord to be prepared for Pentecost. But Paul must (i) learn the mysteries of the Church and (ii) UNLEARN Pharisee-ism. This takes 14 years (Gal.1).

Paul must suffer much. Paul must know the power of God to build a Church among the heathen. Paul must learn the power of God to keep him in a shipwreck and from the bite of a viper. And Paul must lean failure as his ministry of building Churches ends in room in Rome. And writing from Rome, in his letter to the Philippians, he recounts how he must strive to gain Christ (3:8-14). He is, unbeknown to him, just over three years from his martyrdom, and he is still striving, keeping his flesh under and applying the cross. But as the last brutal day appears, Paul can say that he had fought the fight and run the race, and the just Judge would award that coveted crown to subdue and rule the earth after his resurrection. His full salvation though, must wait until he is judged by Christ, just after the Rapture.

Everything that happens to us, says Romans 8, is used by God to walk us through the process from beginning to end. Our darkest hours are our refining fire. Our greatest joys are our proof of a God Who cares. A man who has believed in and embraced Jesus Christ is on a road that leads to the four things that God made, and saved, him for:

He is to be in the image and likeness of Christ (Rom.8:29) to express and display God
He is to be a Bride "up to the standard of" Christ
He is to "fence about and bring to order" (lit. Heb.) a Garden where God can meet with man - the Church
He is subdue whatever opposes God and His plan, and then bring God's rule over the earth, sea and sky

Is this not so much higher than just going off to heaven to do ... who knows what (there are no scriptures)?

Actually our purpose can be boiled down to two purposes, just as the purpose of Israel could be just two. First, to be saved and to live with the Lord eternally, and the second follows--to have our life reflect the Lord as the Lord lives within us.

Corban · Dec 26, 2020

Blik said:

I'll accept that, but it is a little bit more involved than that. Here are two scriptures that lay forth the purpose of God. I'll just post them with only one comment.

Ephesians 1:9-12
9 "Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:
11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ."

Ephesians 3:3-11
3 "How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
6 That the Gentiles should be fellow-heirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.
8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;
9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,
11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord"

In the first scripture from Ephesians 1 the purpose of God is that the universe should be headed up by Christ and Christ, together with those who have His divine life to do things which bring glory to God. In the second scripture from Ephesians 3 the "eternal purpose" of God is that select MEN, led by Jesus, and including Gentiles, should be HEIRS to INHERIT and RULE the earth over an above principalities and powers. See Genesis 1:26-28.

Webers.Home · Dec 26, 2020

.
There's been times during my twenty-three plus years of internet forum
activity when I've encountered people wanting to know what they're
supposed to do now that they decided to become a Christian.

A mega Baptist church that I attended back in the decade of the 1970's had
a discipleship program that incorporated an outreach booklet called "The
Four Spiritual Laws" authored in 1952 by Campus Crusade for Christ founder
Dr. Bill Bright.

Those guidelines are helpful as far as they go, but they're pretty elementary
and in my opinion inadequate for taking Christ's believing followers to
infinity and beyond, so to speak.

Some years ago, just for the fun of it, I set out compiling a home-spun
catalogue of Christ's instructions from the new Testament that apply to all
his followers regardless of denominational affiliation. In time I realized that
his instructions, accompanied by a little commentary, would make a pretty
good how-to handbook.

I chose to start in the book of Acts because that's pretty much where
Christ's apostles began telling his believing followers what to do in accord
with the Lord's instructions as per Matt 28:19-20.

To access my hand book, click the link.

Christ's Ways
_

Guojing · Dec 27, 2020

Webers.Home said:

How do you handle Acts 4:32?

TimothyGirl · Dec 27, 2020

Corban said:

It is so refreshing to hear someone expound the Scriptures and delve into the truths of the Word - thank you for taking the time to write it in such an eloquent way.

And I am in total agreement! Our Christian walk is so much more than what can be boiled down to "3 easy steps," or as some people say: instant salvation -- just add water!

No, Paul calls it a MYSTERY, and it is only the very Word of God itself, facilitated by the Holy Spirit, that can reveal that mystery through a daily diet. Man does not live by bread alone, but by EVERY WORD that proceeds out of the mouth of God. As we live off this diet, we then grow in our understanding and knowledge of Christ and His Kingdom.

SONS OF GOD. Wow! What does that mean? What could it mean?!
One of my favourite Scriptures is found in 1 Timothy 3:16,

And without controversy, GREAT is the MYSTERY of GODLINESS...

I long to live that life - to discover God's purpose for creating me as I walk in obedience to His Word and His Spirit.

Christ's sacrifice and atonement brought restoration and redemption for me. In layman's terms, in taking the form of man and living MY life, He REDEEMED my life to be AS SIGNIFICANT as His. When I understand my IDENTITY, I can can understand my CALLING.
His mission, like it says in Romans 8:29, is to CONFORM ME TO THE IMAGE OF HIS SON, that, like Corban has pointed out, I might be able to rule and to reign with Him. Wow!

My Pastor always says that this life is the TRAINING GROUND for what we are called to in eternity. We learn faith, servanthood, patience - in essence, the character of Christ - so that we can take our place alongside Christ in eternity.
Just like the parable that Jesus teaches in Luke 19,

"...and He said to him, 'Well done, good servant; because you were faithful in a very little, have authority over ten cities..."

I'm not saying that we don't have a purpose and Divine role down here - one leads to the other. But this life is expendable - Jesus Christ showed us that. The trouble is, I think many of us have made our homes down here instead of appreciating that this life is merely a TENT, and like I said, the training ground where we learn the Kingdom principles. We will live up there like we live down here: BY FAITH, serving, loving, extending grace, and worshipping God...

We are caught up in something much bigger than ourselves! We're caught up in a Divine Drama that I want to do my share in and see His Kingdom come! If that means cleaning toilets or preaching to thousands, I'll happily do either knowing that my life is significant and has substance because of Christ! He has redeemed me, and I want to "work out" the salvation that He has already made available to me (Phillipians 2:12).

Deuteronomy · Dec 27, 2020

Hello @TimothyGirl, I see that you joined us awhile ago as a member, but now that you've begun to post, I thought that I should say, welcome to CChat, and thank you for joining in the discussions with us

I like most of what you had to say above, and it is my hope that you will continue on with much more of the same

I do have one thing that I'd like to ask you about, do you really believe that your life, in Christ, is "as significant" as His is

(or perhaps better, please explain what you mean by that

).

Thanks

God bless you!

~Deut

1 Thessalonians 5

23 May the God of peace Himself sanctify you entirely; and may your spirit and soul and body

be preserved complete, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

24 Faithful is He who calls you, and He also will bring it to pass.

TimothyGirl · Dec 27, 2020

Thanks, @Deuteronomy, for the welcome, and you are quite right. I joined last year sometime when I was going through a huge transition in my life and couldn’t quite make sense of anything. When I was younger, I found huge comfort and encouragement on a forum site similar to this, so I guess you could say I was reaching out to an ‘old comfort.’😊

But it’s been years since I’ve participated in such things and I’m not as bold as I used to be in ‘putting myself out there’. It’s taken me a while to pluck up the courage and “find my voice”, so to speak! And trust me to, in my first post, hit a nerve and touch on something controversial!!!

I suppose to say that “my life is as significant as Christ’s” could sound alarming—and even like heresy—if taken out of context. But when we consider, like it says in Ephesians 1:22-23, that we, as the Church, are the BODY of Christ, the FULLNESS of Him who fills all in all; that, as it has already been quoted in Galatians 2:20, it is no longer I who live, but CHRIST lives in me, how is my life less significant than His? He is indeed dwelling in His Body, which I am a part of. My identity is no longer an individual one, but my identity is wrapped up in Him; I have been BAPTIZED into HIS Body.

Apologies for any prickles my statement may have caused.

oyster67 · Dec 27, 2020

TimothyGirl said:

Amen. Should not the worm desire to become the butterfly which is it was originally designed to be? Yet it is only in these few short years that we have opportunity to store up treasures in Heaven and spread the good news to the lost and dying world around us.

Philippians
1:21 For to me to live [is] Christ, and to die [is] gain.
1:22 But if I live in the flesh, this [is] the fruit of my labour: yet what I shall choose I wot not.
1:23 For I am in a strait betwixt two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better:
1:24 Nevertheless to abide in the flesh [is] more needful for you.
1:25 And having this confidence, I know that I shall abide and continue with you all for your furtherance and joy of faith;

oyster67 · Dec 27, 2020

TimothyGirl said:

We are caught up in something much bigger than ourselves! We're caught up in a Divine Drama that I want to do my share in and see His Kingdom come! If that means cleaning toilets or preaching to thousands, I'll happily do either knowing that my life is significant and has substance because of Christ! He has redeemed me, and I want to "work out" the salvation that He has already made available to me (Phillipians 2:12).

Amen!!! PTL! That is something to get excited about!

oyster67 · Dec 27, 2020

TimothyGirl said:

It is inevitable. You will be getting red X'ed, just like the rest of us have, before long. Some will be caused by legitimate differences of understanding, other times it will be based on simple misunderstanding or even typos. It doesn't mean that we don't love one another.

Corban · Dec 27, 2020

TimothyGirl said:

Thanks, @Deuteronomy, for the welcome, and you are quite right. I joined last year sometime when I was going through a huge transition in my life and couldn’t quite make sense of anything. When I was younger, I found huge comfort and encouragement on a forum site similar to this, so I guess you could say I was reaching out to an ‘old comfort.’😊

But it’s been years since I’ve participated in such things and I’m not as bold as I used to be in ‘putting myself out there’. It’s taken me a while to pluck up the courage and “find my voice”, so to speak! And trust me to, in my first post, hit a nerve and touch on something controversial!!!

I suppose to say that “my life is as significant as Christ’s” could sound alarming—and even like heresy—if taken out of context. But when we consider, like it says in Ephesians 1:22-23, that we, as the Church, are the BODY of Christ, the FULLNESS of Him who fills all in all; that, as it has already been quoted in Galatians 2:20, it is no longer I who live, but CHRIST lives in me, how is my life less significant than His? He is indeed dwelling in His Body, which I am a part of. My identity is no longer an individual one, but my identity is wrapped up in Him; I have been BAPTIZED into HIS Body.

Apologies for any prickles my statement may have caused.

I knew what you meant. I think most others did too. Consider, your life is so important that God gave His Son for it. We are intrinsically not valuable. But the very God of the universe put a price, and thus a value, on us - an unimaginable value.

wattie · Dec 27, 2020

Webers.Home said:

I was part of a campus Crusade club at Canterbury University in the mid 2000s. I remember the four spiritual laws booklet and shared it with alot of people.

I'm not such a fan of it now as it has making Jesus Saviour AND Lord of your life right on the spot for salvation.

Biblically it is surely Saviour first.. His giving of salvation.. then when already saved.. sanctification is making Jesus Lord of your life.

Every area of your life submitted to Jesus doesn't happen straight away at salvation.

Anyway.. dont want to derail the thread but this is my experience of the 4 spiritual laws booklet

oyster67 · Dec 27, 2020

TimothyGirl said:

Amen and Amen and Amen!!!!!!!!!!

Deuteronomy · Dec 27, 2020

TimothyGirl said:

No apologies are necessary sister, as I experienced no "prickles" from your post

I was just looking to clarify the point that I 'thought' you were making (a point that, from a certain POV anyway, I agree with).

Happy New Year and may God bless you in it!

~Deut

TimothyGirl · Dec 28, 2020

Corban said:

Thanks Corban, and well said. That's exactly it. It's the value and significance that GOD has put on each of our lives that we underestimate.
If we could just click our value, we wouldn't scratch around and waste our lives, but follow in Christ's steps and know that despite our obscurity at times, God is using us in His Kingdom. Back to the topic of this thread, the question was "life after salvation." If we do not understand our identity, we will not understand our calling. God called us as sons and sent His very Own Son to lead the way and give us an example.

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