Losing Salvation ?!

  • Thread starter Thread starter Abby97
  • Start date Start date
  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Originally Posted by valiant God SAVES. We do not, we are the saved. God gives us new life in the Spirit, and then He moulds us gradually to His will. It is ALL His work.

That mean Changed person doesn't mean not able to commit sin anymore, Am I correct?

No you are incorrect. There is no man who does good, and does not sin.

changed person have possibility of commiting sin, It mean change person have a free Will.

Man does not have free will. He is bound by sin. A saved person is freed from that binding but he is still in his body, and still sins. He is still gripped by the flesh.

change person have a free Will, mean change person have possibility change his mind and not abide to the vine

a saved person will abide in the vine. He is kept by the power of God.

than not bear fruit, than Cut of and trown to lake of fire

A saved person WILL bear fruit, for God is at work in him to will and do of His good pleasure.. He has been saved from the lake of fire for ever.
 
No you are incorrect. There is no man who does good, and does not sin.



Man does not have free will. He is bound by sin. A saved person is freed from that binding but he is still in his body, and still sins. He is still gripped by the flesh.



a saved person will abide in the vine. He is kept by the power of God.



A saved person WILL bear fruit, for God is at work in him to will and do of His good pleasure.. He has been saved from the lake of fire for ever.

1.so No man does good, save person is a man, It mean save person does bad, Am I correct?

2. You Said save person Will abide in the vine.

from 1 and 2 save person abide in vine but he does bad. Am I correct?
 
1.so No man does good, save person is a man, It mean save person does bad, Am I correct?

Jesus said to His disciples. 'If you then being evil ----'. None of us are good. We are 'being saved' as well as 'have been saved'. We are better than we were, but not good, as Jesus said to the rich young ruler.

2. You Said save person Will abide in the vine.

from 1 and 2 save person abide in vine but he does bad. Am I correct?

It is not I but Scripture that says, 'no man does good and sins not'.
 
Jesus said to His disciples. 'If you then being evil ----'. None of us are good. We are 'being saved' as well as 'have been saved'. We are better than we were, but not good, as Jesus said to the rich young ruler.



It is not I but Scripture that says, 'no man does good and sins not'.

so you believe both save and un save person are sinner am I correct?
 
No you are incorrect. There is no man who does good, and does not sin.



Man does not have free will. He is bound by sin. A saved person is freed from that binding but he is still in his body, and still sins. He is still gripped by the flesh


saved person free from the Binding of sin but sin.

unsave bound by sin and sin, what is the different?

wage of sin is death, both are sin, both entitle death penalty






a saved person will abide in the vine. He is kept by the power of God.



A saved person WILL bear fruit, for God is at work in him to will and do of His good pleasure.. He has been saved from the lake of fire for ever.

I personal believe, unsave is a sinner, save capable doing sin, but saved person, invite Jesus come to his heart, and admit his sin, repent, hire counselor. The couselor is Holy spirit. It doesn't mean he not able fall in sin, but If he fall in sin, the counselor remain him, than It is up to him, whether he obey to his counselor or not. If he obey, he save, If he obey for a while than fall again, he has to repent again, If he decide No more repent till his death, he lose his salvation
 
No. Only one example is not a saved believer and that is the one Satan took the seed out of their heart from being sown.
False, but you are free to believe whatever you want.

Verbalizing faith in God's Providence without leading by example is dead. That is the only kind of faith James was talking about.
Empty profession of faith/dead faith that produces NO works at all (James 2:14) is what James is talking about. All genuine believers are fruitful (Matthew 13:23) but not all are equally fruitful.

Remember 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 where if a man only had stubble, hay, and wood, it is burned up in fire, but yet he is still saved as verse 15 says, because that foundation remains? Where are his fruits even though he is still saved?
Paul is not implying that ALL the works of believers will be stubble, hay and wood. Paul is making a contrast between the works that are burned up and the works that are not. This does not mean that ALL of our works will be burned up. The works that are burned up cause us to suffer a loss of reward, but we are still saved.

Faith in Jesus Christ for salvation is without works because that is the glory of God in salvation showing off the power of God in salvation for all those that believe.. even in His name.
We are saved through faith, not works.

If you apply James' faith without works towards faith in Jesus Christ for salvation, then Paul opposes that application.
The harmony of Romans 4:2-3 and James 2:24 is seen in the differing ways that Paul and James use the term "justified." Paul, when he uses the term, refers to the legal (judicial) act of God by which He accounts the sinner as righteous (Romans 3:24; 5:1). James, however is using the term to describe those who would show the genuineness of their faith by the works that they do.

Man is saved through faith and not works (Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9); yet genuine faith is vindicated, substantiated, evidenced by works (James 2:14-24). Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works. It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony.*

Romans 4:1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?[SUP] 2 [/SUP]For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.[SUP] 3 [/SUP]For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.[SUP] 4 [/SUP]Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.[SUP] 5 [/SUP]But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.[SUP]6 [/SUP]Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,[SUP] 7 [/SUP]Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.[SUP] 8 [/SUP]Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
Amen!

James was never talking about the faith in Jesus Christ for salvation for it is without works which is why Paul & James spoke the same thing.
Paul and James do not contradict one another. They are simply describing saving faith from two different perspectives.

Saving belief is when the seed has been received.
Received on good ground.

What withers away is the result of the cares of this life choking out the word and so that is why they are unfruitful.
No root, no fruit, no salvation.

That is why I do not see it as the fruit of salvation... because salvation is without works and is without fruits... but living that reconciled relationship with God through Jesus Christ as His disciple is about bearing fruit so that our joy may be full.
Faith is the root of salvation and works are the fruit. No fruit at all demonstrates there is no root or salvation.

Jesus did warn His disciples that they could become castaways in Luke 12:40-49. Paul certain said that it could happen to himself, and not just lose the rewards of crowns.

1 Corinthians 9:[SUP]24 [/SUP]Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.[SUP] 25 [/SUP]And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.[SUP] 26 [/SUP]I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:[SUP]27 [/SUP]But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.
Paul said disqualified for the prize, not disqualified for the gift of eternal life. In context, Paul has been discussing preaching the gospel. In verse 18 he says, "What is my reward, then?" In verses 24-27 he illustrates this thought of his reward by the picture of a race run for the prize. We must pay attention to the context—this passage concerns reward, prize not losing salvation. Salvation is a gift that we receive by grace through faith, not a prize that we race for to earn by winning. Verse 24 settles the matter for me. 24 - Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one gets the prize? Run in such a way as to get the prize. That sounds like running a race in the Olympics. All runners run but only one gets the gold medal. So what happens to the runners that get the silver medal or bronze medal or finish the race with no medal? Are they disqualified from the Olympics or from the prize, receiving the gold medal?

Of Judas, there is no argument, but applying Judas to John 15th chapter is not agreeable. Judas was not offended by His words. He simply did not believe in Him.
Yet Judas was an example of a self attached branch who did not abide and was cut off.

Also... the branch was a part of the vine.. and was cut off.. therefore hardly applying to Judas whom was never a believer.
Dead branches that are still self attached to the vine are cut off.

John 15th chapter is about bearing fruit as His disciple; not about salvation. There are consequences for not abiding in Him as His disciples and that is to be cut off as John 15:6 testify. When read with Luke 12:40-49, we see that the cut off is referring to being left behind at the pre trib rapture event... and yet He still calls them His servants as they receive stripes for the degree of iniquity that they had committed.... many stripes if they knew it was iniquity and less stripes if they knew it was not an iniquity.
Only Judas was cut off, but not the remaining 11 disciples. There are different degrees of punishment, just as there are different degrees of reward.

Correct. The church was born on Pentecost. The disciples were officially saved at Pentecost. BUT Jesus was speaking in regards to future saved believers in how to abide in Him as His disciples and why they should.. to bear fruit and that their joy may be full.
What Jesus said applied immediately, before the New Covenant was fully established.

So no. The parable of the sower has to be discerned again and reapplied differently than how you are doing it.

[video=youtube;_rR_Rdb1CTE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rR_Rdb1CTE[/video]
I believe that I have properly discerned and applied the parable of the sower, but you are free to believe whatever you choose to believe. Great song by Chris Tomlin! :)
 
False, but you are free to believe whatever you want.

Empty profession of faith/dead faith that produces NO works at all (James 2:14) is what James is talking about. All genuine believers are fruitful (Matthew 13:23) but not all are equally fruitful.

Paul is not implying that ALL the works of believers will be stubble, hay and wood. Paul is making a contrast between the works that are burned up and the works that are not. This does not mean that ALL of our works will be burned up. The works that are burned up cause us to suffer a loss of reward, but we are still saved.

I do read verse 14 below as meaning if any work remains, he shall have his reward, but verse 15 reads as no work remains which followed by the consequence for defiling the temple of God which is our body resulting in physical death.

1 Corinthians 3:[SUP]14 [/SUP]If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.[SUP] 15 [/SUP]If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.[SUP] 16 [/SUP]Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?[SUP]17 [/SUP]If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

We are saved through faith, not works.

Your analogy of the parable of the sower appears otherwise which is why I would believe you need to discern that again.

The harmony of Romans 4:2-3 and James 2:24 is seen in the differing ways that Paul and James use the term "justified." Paul, when he uses the term, refers to the legal (judicial) act of God by which He accounts the sinner as righteous (Romans 3:24; 5:1). James, however is using the term to describe those who would show the genuineness of their faith by the works that they do.


Yet Paul cited the works of Abraham as not the reason why he was justified before God.
Man is saved through faith and not works (Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9); yet genuine faith is vindicated, substantiated, evidenced by works (James 2:14-24). Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works. It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not by the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (solitary, unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony.*

Seems to be double-minded reading here. The faith that justifies is never alone is hardly saying faith without works that justifies.

James 2:14-24... if you start at the beginning of chapter 2, you will see the beginning of the church's example in neglecting and disrespecting the poor by showing favoritism to the rich. Then the church went so far in disrespecting the poor after church service by giving a benediction of the church's faith in God's providence to the departing poor by saying "Be warmed and be filled" as if divinely, & supernaturally, God will meet the immediate needs of the poor so that the church will not need to give anything from the bounty collected at church' service to meet the immediate needs of the poor that were about to perish from the elements and starvation. It was in this example is why the church's faith in the eyes of the poor, will not profit the poor nor save the poor because the church was failing to lead by example. James made a reference to Abraham & Isaac of the story about God's provision because the place where it happened, testified of Him as called Jehovahjireh.. The Lord provides....

Genesis 22:[SUP]7 [/SUP]And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering?[SUP] 8 [/SUP]And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.....[SUP]13 [/SUP]And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns: and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son.[SUP] 14 [/SUP]And Abraham called the name of that place Jehovahjireh: as it is said to this day, In the mount of the Lord it shall be seen.

So James reference is about faith in God's Providence that if a church verbalize that faith to the poor, they had best be leading by example. That is the kind of faith James was talking about that requires works to justify voicing that faith in His Providence.

Amen!

Paul and James do not contradict one another. They are simply describing saving faith from two different perspectives.

I believe Paul is talking about faith in Jesus Christ for salvation requiring no works following to have that justification... whereas James was addressing the abuse of the church towards the poor by verbalizing faith in His Providence to the poor to get out of helping the poor. That is why that "faith" in God's Providence "without works" is dead.

Received on good ground.

No root, no fruit, no salvation.

Faith is the root of salvation and works are the fruit. No fruit at all demonstrates there is no root or salvation.

Matthew 13:[SUP]18 [/SUP]Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.[SUP] 19[/SUP]When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.

That is the example of the unbeliever because he did not understand the gospel and thus the seed was not received.

[SUP]20 [/SUP]But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.

This is a saved believer. If you came across someone that was persecuted because of the evolution theory and became offended by the word because the lies of the evolution theory made it look like a joke, then they stop believing in Him.

What do you do? Preach the gospel? No. He already knows it. Address the lies of the evolution theory by His grace & by His help in drawing the line between real science.. what can be actually observed and proven and false science which the evolution theory is now changing from gradual macroevolution to rapid macroevolution... and still in the dark. One can even use the laws of science in proving that everything is breaking down and not building up or becoming more complex thus disproving the evolution theory.

Or as in 2 Timothy 2:18-21, some can err and turn from the truth and have their faith overthrown when they are led by the lies that the resurrection had happened already.... probably referring to this reference...

Matthew 27:[SUP]52 [/SUP]And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, [SUP]53 [/SUP]And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

And so they think Christ is not returning...are they still saved? In according to 2 Timothy 2:13, they are.

2 Timothy 2:[SUP]13 [/SUP]If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

We read my earlier reference...where even former believers having His seal are called to depart from iniquity.

2 Timothy 2:[SUP]18 [/SUP]Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some. [SUP]19 [/SUP]Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. [SUP]20 [/SUP]But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. [SUP]21 [/SUP]If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

So then... the vessels unto dishonor are those that did not depart from iniquity whereas those that did look to Jesus Christ for help in discerning the lies of the world by the truth in His words to depart from iniquity will be received as vessels unto honor in His House.


What makes a vessel unto dishonor that cannot ever be that vessel unto honor? When God judges His House at the pre trib rapture event, leaving those saints not abiding in Him behind as castaways to be received later on after the great tribulation. That is why there are vessels unto dishonor in His House as they will receive stripes for they are still His servants; see Luke 12:40-49.

Matthew 13:[SUP]22 [/SUP]He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.

This is another example of a saved believer above. What do you do when you see a fellow believer or church member worrying about the cares of this life or a believer boasting about getting riches that he is coveting after? Do you say...that they are unsaved? Do you point them out, rallying the church to kick them out as fake believers? Or do you preach the gospel to them and yet they say they already know & believe in Him... what then? Would you encourage the believer that worries, by the scripture that God will take care of them and to submit their prayers to God for help in being content and thankful for what they do have? And to the covetous believer, do you read the scripture warning him of the evil of the love of money will bring about their own destruction as 1 Timothy 6th chapter does warn?

Do you see my point? If you do not judge a fellow believer or church goer as unsaved when they need encouragement or correction or even rebuke, then why do you judge that example in the parable of the sower as unsaved?

Matthew 13:[SUP]23 [/SUP]But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

This is why I believe this example above is about a saved believer abiding in His word as His disciple in bearing fruit so that their joy may be full.


Paul said disqualified for the prize, not disqualified for the gift of eternal life. In context, Paul has been discussing preaching the gospel. In verse 18 he says, "What is my reward, then?" In verses 24-27 he illustrates this thought of his reward by the picture of a race run for the prize. We must pay attention to the context—this passage concerns reward, prize not losing salvation. Salvation is a gift that we receive by grace through faith, not a prize that we race for to earn by winning. Verse 24 settles the matter for me. 24 - Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one gets the prize? Run in such a way as to get the prize. That sounds like running a race in the Olympics. All runners run but only one gets the gold medal. So what happens to the runners that get the silver medal or bronze medal or finish the race with no medal? Are they disqualified from the Olympics or from the prize, receiving the gold medal?

Paul said castaway is the dire consequence other than just losing the rewards of crowns in 1 Corinthians 9:24-27. And when 1 Corinthians 3:15-17 testify of nothing remaining of any work as it gets all burned up... then the temple of God is destroyed...physical death will happen when God judges in that day the House of God first.

Look at the church at Thyatira...

Revelation 2:[SUP]21 [/SUP]And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.[SUP] 22 [/SUP]Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.[SUP] 23 [/SUP]And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

If any believer does not repent, they will be denied attendance to the Marriage Supper and cast into the bed of the great tribulation where physical death occurs. God will be excommunicating those not abiding in Him as the church suppose to do in leading them to repentance.

1 Corinthians 5:[SUP]4 [/SUP]In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,[SUP]5 [/SUP]To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

What the church is to do symbolically when excommunicating, this will literally happen when God excommunicates. Satan will be waging war on the saints to kill the saints off.

So... that is how I read and apply the parable of the sower. The seed is Christ as He is received where only one example given is where He was not received as that represents unbelievers who do not understand the gospel. All other examples is about discipleship... or lack thereof in comparison to the one abiding in Him & His words to bear fruits as His disciple.

Yet Judas was an example of a self attached branch who did not abide and was cut off.

Jesus speaking futuristically about the church is referring to believers as being part of the vine as a part of Him. Judas Iscariot was never a believer to ever be a part of that vine which is the church when the church was born on Pentecost.

Dead branches that are still self attached to the vine are cut off.

Those who are a part of the vine...are a part of Him.... thus saved.. but are not abiding in Him.. will be cut off. Even branches that bear fruit will be pruned to bear more fruit.

John 15:1I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.[SUP] 2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

Only Judas was cut off, but not the remaining 11 disciples. There are different degrees of punishment, just as there are different degrees of reward.

Judas never having been a believer was hardly a part of the vine nor Him and thus hardly cut off. He is in hell.

What Jesus said applied immediately, before the New Covenant was fully established.

If applied immediately, then to be a part of Him is to believe in Him in according to His words, and yet Judas had never believed in Him, and so he could not be cut off so to speak when he was never a part of Him.

It cannot be applied immediately when He has not died and risen from the dead nor ascended to the Father above. John 3rd chapter and John 14th chapter gives the conditions when the born again of the Spirit will happen at their salvation.

The promise of the permanent indwelling Holy Ghost was to be given by the Father when Jesus was no longer physically present with them. That means the initial beginning of the body of Christ being born again was on Pentecost & thereafter.

John 7:[SUP]38 [/SUP]He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.[SUP] 39 [/SUP](But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

I believe that I have properly discerned and applied the parable of the sower, but you are free to believe whatever you choose to believe.

Well.... we all prophesy in part and know in part, but I do wish to address that it is a double minded saying to believe that we are saved by faith without works and yet faith alone without works vindicating that faith is not saving faith. You either meant what you had formerly stated or you do not mean that we are saved by faith without works.

Do you pity the sinner whom on his death bed believes in the Good News but has died and thus no works follow him to justify His faith as saving faith? Or do you rest assured that he is saved and is in Heaven? I believe you would believe the latter.

Great song by Chris Tomlin! :)

Yes. It does show how we are to depend on Him all the time for following Him and I even need His help to trust Him all the time.
 
I personal believe, unsave is a sinner, save capable doing sin, but saved person, invite Jesus come to his heart, and admit his sin, repent, hire counselor. The couselor is Holy spirit. It doesn't mean he not able fall in sin, but If he fall in sin, the counselor remain him, than It is up to him, whether he obey to his counselor or not. If he obey, he save, If he obey for a while than fall again, he has to repent again, If he decide No more repent till his death, he lose his salvation

so he basically saves himself with a bit of help?

John 6.39 and many other verses disagree with you.
 
so he basically saves himself with a bit of help?

John 6.39 and many other verses disagree with you.

no, no body can save himself, need Redeemer.

But to forgive our sin, you have to admit, say Sorry to the Lord and repent.

you believe do not need repent?

Let say today kill 2 person, Tummorow kill 6 people, the folowing day feel Sorry and confest, repent. Than this person forgiven.

Look like your believe, kill every day not make one lost It salvation, Am I correct?
 
A muslim guy ask me. Is Christian can do what ever they want like killing every day and not lost they salvation?

I answered, AS long AS you repent, feel Sorry ask forgiveness.

He Said, I Will rob the bank, any way I am forgiven, Jesus die for me.

I Said, No, you aren't Christian.

He Said, I Will.

I Said, No, It is OK become Christian for clean our sin, but require repentance not plan to make sin.

How about I am become Christian, for some reason I need money and rob the bank.

I Said, It is sin, but If you repent, you are forgiven.

What happen If cought.

I Said, than you go to prison.

He Said, but the judge of the judge(Jesus) has forgiven me.

I Said, yes Jesus forgiven you, the Wage of sin is death/ hell, Jesus die for you If you repent, you not go to hell, but you has to go to prison, because the world judge not forgive you.

some muslim try to make Christian like foolish.

but I do not believe that is Christian doctrine. Yes Jesus forgive even If you kill every day for 50 years, but you need to repent. And If you get cought, you may go to prison.

the judge of judge and the King of King forgive you, but It do not guaranty free from prison
 
A muslim guy ask me. Is Christian can do what ever they want like killing every day and not lost they salvation? I answered, AS long AS you repent, feel Sorry ask forgiveness. He Said, I Will rob the bank, any way I am forgiven, Jesus die for me. I Said, No, you aren't Christian. He Said, I Will. I Said, No, It is OK become Christian for clean our sin, but require repentance not plan to make sin. How about I am become Christian, for some reason I need money and rob the bank. I Said, It is sin, but If you repent, you are forgiven. What happen If cought. I Said, than you go to prison. He Said, but the judge of the judge(Jesus) has forgiven me. I Said, yes Jesus forgiven you, the Wage of sin is death/ hell, Jesus die for you If you repent, you not go to hell, but you has to go to prison, because the world judge not forgive you. some muslim try to make Christian like foolish. but I do not believe that is Christian doctrine. Yes Jesus forgive even If you kill every day for 50 years, but you need to repent. And If you get cought, you may go to prison. the judge of judge and the King of King forgive you, but It do not guaranty free from prison
Yea Theres no deceiving God so any premeditated sin he sees a mile away. He is forgiving but those who constantly abuse his grace may be in for a rude awakening on judgement day.
 
True christians have separated themselves from the world and the things of the world. there is no involvement of what the world do.
 
no, no body can save himself, need Redeemer.

But to forgive our sin, you have to admit, say Sorry to the Lord and repent.

you believe do not need repent?

Let say today kill 2 person, Tummorow kill 6 people, the folowing day feel Sorry and confest, repent. Than this person forgiven.

Look like your believe, kill every day not make one lost It salvation, Am I correct?

who is this theoretical person of your vivid imagination?

He is certainly not a Christian,
 
Last edited: