Luke 17 - Where are they taken?

[tanakh]

Luk 17:34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.
Luk 17:35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Luk 17:36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Luk 17:37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

I wish I could remember who pointed this out to me so I could give them credit for it, but someone on CC showed me this a year or two ago and I got busy and kind of forgot about it. That person showed me that the ones that were taken, were taken to the dead body in verse 37.

I believe the dead body was the body of Christ and the eagles are believers. One reason I believe this is because we mount up with eagles wings and we feed on the body of Christ... there are other reasons to, but now I have satisfied the requirements of p_rehbein, I've given my thoughts lol.

What are your thought?
What is the dead body and what do the eagles represent?

Just as it was in the days of Noah, so also will it will be in the days of the Son of man
People were eating and drinking,marrying and being given in marriage up to the day
Noah entered the ark. Then the flood came and destroyed them all.

Luke 17: 26-27 NIV

It was the same in the days of Lot. People were eating and drinking, buying and selling
planting and building. But the day Lot left Sodom fire and sulphur rained down from
heaven and destroyed them all.

Luke 17: 28 -29 NIV

It will be just like this on the day the Son of Man is revealed. On that day no-one
who is on the roof of his house with his goods inside should go down and get them
Likewise no-one in the field should go back for anything. Remember Lots wife!
Whosoever tries to keep his life shall lose it and whosoever loses his life shall
shall preserve it.

Luke 17: 30 - 33 NIV

I tell you on that night two people will be in one bed
one will be taken and another left. Two women will be grinding
corn together one will be taken and the other left. Where Lord they asked
He replied where there is a dead body the vultures will be gathered together.

Luke 17: 34 - 37 NIV

And I saw an Angel standing in the Sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the
birds flying in mid air Come gather together for the great supper of God
So that you may eat the flesh of kings generals and mighty men, of horses and their
riders and the flesh of all people free and slave small and great.

Rev 19: 17 - 19 NIV

Now brothers about times and dates we do not need to write to you for you know very well the day of the lord will come like a thief in the night. While people are saying peace and safety destruction will come on them suddenly as labour pains on a pregnant woman and they will not escape

1 Thess 5: 1 - 3

To understand what Jesus is saying to his disciples we need to read the conversation in context. He gives examples of Noah and Lots
days and what happened to the people outside the Ark and inside Sodom. He goes on to advise them to flee and not bother to collect anything from their homes. If this was about some silent pre tribulation rapture what would be the point of telling them all this?
The emphasis is on sudden destruction when its not expected by the world in general and Israel in particular. Paul confirms this
in 1 Thessalonians. Jesus is not talking about the rapture. He is talking about the second coming and Armageddon. The rapture
happens at the second coming. Its not the people left behind who are destroyed but the people who are taken. Noah was left behind in the Ark and Lot was left behind when Sodom was destroyed.

 

[Noose]

Many prophets talked about resurrection, but none of them talked about rapture (hope i'm not mistaken). So is rapture a new thing started by Jesus and the apostles or maybe people have misrepresented them?

 

[posthuman]

I believe the dead body was the body of Christ and the eagles are believers.

but He lives; He's not dead, neither is His body.
and per Leviticus 11:13 & Deuteronomy 14:12, eagles are unclean

this doesn't take away what you're seeing here, but it's something to consider.


we should also consider this --

When they finish their testimony, the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit will make war against them, overcome them, and kill them. And their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified. Then those from the peoples, tribes, tongues, and nations will see their dead bodies three-and-a-half days, and not allow their dead bodies to be put into graves. And those who dwell on the earth will rejoice over them, make merry, and send gifts to one another, because these two prophets tormented those who dwell on the earth.​

(Revelation 11:7-10)​

​

people gathered over dead bodies.

and also this:

When he was gone, a lion met him on the road and killed him. And his corpse was thrown on the road, and the donkey stood by it. The lion also stood by the corpse. ​

(1 Kings 13:24) ​

​

a lion and a donkey gathered around a dead body.

it could be, both are represented - on the cross, there are two deaths: i am crucified with Him, and the world crucified to me. from the direction you approach it, is the perspective of it that is seen.

 

[SoulWeaver]

One taken = the wicked (taken by the angels to be killed)

One left = The righteous (gathered after the wicked)

Matthew 13:30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

This seems to suggest that the wicked are the ones taken.

 

[KJV1611]

Just as it was in the days of Noah, so also will it will be in the days of the Son of man
People were eating and drinking,marrying and being given in marriage up to the day
Noah entered the ark. Then the flood came and destroyed them all.

Luke 17: 26-27 NIV

It was the same in the days of Lot. People were eating and drinking, buying and selling
planting and building. But the day Lot left Sodom fire and sulphur rained down from
heaven and destroyed them all.

Luke 17: 28 -29 NIV

It will be just like this on the day the Son of Man is revealed. On that day no-one
who is on the roof of his house with his goods inside should go down and get them
Likewise no-one in the field should go back for anything. Remember Lots wife!
Whosoever tries to keep his life shall lose it and whosoever loses his life shall
shall preserve it.

Luke 17: 30 - 33 NIV

I tell you on that night two people will be in one bed
one will be taken and another left. Two women will be grinding
corn together one will be taken and the other left. Where Lord they asked
He replied where there is a dead body the vultures will be gathered together.

Luke 17: 34 - 37 NIV

And I saw an Angel standing in the Sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the
birds flying in mid air Come gather together for the great supper of God
So that you may eat the flesh of kings generals and mighty men, of horses and their
riders and the flesh of all people free and slave small and great.

Rev 19: 17 - 19 NIV

Now brothers about times and dates we do not need to write to you for you know very well the day of the lord will come like a thief in the night. While people are saying peace and safety destruction will come on them suddenly as labour pains on a pregnant woman and they will not escape

1 Thess 5: 1 - 3

To understand what Jesus is saying to his disciples we need to read the conversation in context. He gives examples of Noah and Lots
days and what happened to the people outside the Ark and inside Sodom. He goes on to advise them to flee and not bother to collect anything from their homes. If this was about some silent pre tribulation rapture what would be the point of telling them all this?
The emphasis is on sudden destruction when its not expected by the world in general and Israel in particular. Paul confirms this
in 1 Thessalonians. Jesus is not talking about the rapture. He is talking about the second coming and Armageddon. The rapture
happens at the second coming. Its not the people left behind who are destroyed but the people who are taken. Noah was left behind in the Ark and Lot was left behind when Sodom was destroyed.

I think you're mixing two coming's of Jesus into one lump. Some of those verses apply to Jesus coming back from the dead at his resurrection and some apply to the second advent.

 

[KJV1611]

but He lives; He's not dead, neither is His body.
and per Leviticus 11:13 & Deuteronomy 14:12, eagles are unclean

Exactly my point, he is not dead now BUT his body was dead for three days 2000 years ago.... so when does that put the timing of Luke 17?

Jesus even told us flat out that the coming he's speaking of in Luke 17 all pertain to - THE KINGDOM THAT COMES WITHOUT OBSERVATION.

Luk 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
Luk 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

Most people totally ignore this kingdom and are looking for the kingdom that WITH OBSERVATION.

 

[garee]

Eze 17:1 And the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
Eze 17:2 Son of man, put forth a riddle, and speak a parable unto the house of Israel;
Eze 17:3 And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; A great eagle with great wings, longwinged, full of feathers, which had divers colours, came unto Lebanon, and took the highest branch of the cedar:
Eze 17:4 He cropped off the top of his young twigs, and carried it into a land of traffick; he set it in a city of merchants.
Eze 17:5 He took also of the seed of the land, and planted it in a fruitful field; he placed it by great waters, and set it as a willow tree.
Eze 17:6 And it grew, and became a spreading vine of low stature, whose branches turned toward him, and the roots thereof were under him: so it became a vine, and brought forth branches, and shot forth sprigs.

Who is that eagle?

The eagle is a unclean animal used to represent unbelief. Just as Balaam's Ass was used in another parables giving us the same kind of understanding of the gospel hid .

I would say the eagle represents a messenger that brings the word of God. But it is not the invisible source of the word . Even the Son of man refused to stand in that holy unseen place , but rather gave glory to the father unseen .In that way we look to what the eyes see the temporal to give us the unseen eternal understanding of the parable revealing the gospel.

How beautiful are the feet of them .I would say he uses different metaphors to express he is not served by human hands typified as unclean . we plant the seed or the eagle plants it but Only God not seen can cause the growth.

 

[KJV1611]

I am Letting the verse say what it says and bringing in the other scriptures which support the end of the age. It's just a matter of you understanding the events which take place as Jesus is returning to the earth to end the age.

"Two men will be in the field: one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left."

Where, Lord (where are they going to be taken?)

"Jesus answered, “Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather.”

Those who are taken, are taken by the angels as the Lord is returning to the earth to end the age. They are alive when they are taken and are then killed by that double-edged sword that proceeds from the mouth of the Lord. Below is what happens to them when the angels take them to the Lord:

"And I saw an angel standing in the sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the birds flying in midair, “Come, gather together for the great supper of God, so that you may eat the flesh of kings, generals, and the mighty, of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all people, free and slave, great and small.”

"The rest were killed with the sword coming out of the mouth of the rider on the horse, and all the birds gorged themselves on their flesh."

In conclusion, the "one taken" group who are being compared to the wicked who are taken in the flood, will be collected/taken by the angels at the end of the age and will be brought to where Armageddon is taking place and all of those kings, generals, mighty men, horses and the "one taken" group will be killed. This entire group will be made up of all the wicked who survive the tribulation period.

It's like you're putting together a jigsaw puzzle from a picture that's not a picture of the puzzle you're putting together. You're forcing pieces to fit together that don't fit.

 

[garee]

Those who are taken will become the dead bodies. They're being taken by the angels to be killed by that double-edged sword.

When Jesus said, "one will be taken" the disciples said, "Where, Lord," i.e. where are they going to be taken? Then Jesus answers "wherever the carcass (dead body) is, there will the vultures be gathered. Therefore, the "one taken" group, which represent the wicked, are those who will be collected by the angels at the end of the age and will be taken to Jesus to be killed by that double-edged sword, where their spirits are thrown into the furnace.

The ones taken(resurrected) are the believers. The dead ones remain here where eagles and vultures eat the flesh .Those taken are those who do have part in the ressurection. Its the last day

 

[JamOn]

Just as it was in the days of Noah, so also will it will be in the days of the Son of man
People were eating and drinking,marrying and being given in marriage up to the day
Noah entered the ark. Then the flood came and destroyed them all.

Luke 17: 26-27 NIV

It was the same in the days of Lot. People were eating and drinking, buying and selling
planting and building. But the day Lot left Sodom fire and sulphur rained down from
heaven and destroyed them all.

Luke 17: 28 -29 NIV

It will be just like this on the day the Son of Man is revealed. On that day no-one
who is on the roof of his house with his goods inside should go down and get them
Likewise no-one in the field should go back for anything. Remember Lots wife!
Whosoever tries to keep his life shall lose it and whosoever loses his life shall
shall preserve it.

Luke 17: 30 - 33 NIV

I tell you on that night two people will be in one bed
one will be taken and another left. Two women will be grinding
corn together one will be taken and the other left. Where Lord they asked
He replied where there is a dead body the vultures will be gathered together.

Luke 17: 34 - 37 NIV

And I saw an Angel standing in the Sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the
birds flying in mid air Come gather together for the great supper of God
So that you may eat the flesh of kings generals and mighty men, of horses and their
riders and the flesh of all people free and slave small and great.

Rev 19: 17 - 19 NIV

Now brothers about times and dates we do not need to write to you for you know very well the day of the lord will come like a thief in the night. While people are saying peace and safety destruction will come on them suddenly as labour pains on a pregnant woman and they will not escape

1 Thess 5: 1 - 3

To understand what Jesus is saying to his disciples we need to read the conversation in context. He gives examples of Noah and Lots
days and what happened to the people outside the Ark and inside Sodom. He goes on to advise them to flee and not bother to collect anything from their homes. If this was about some silent pre tribulation rapture what would be the point of telling them all this?
The emphasis is on sudden destruction when its not expected by the world in general and Israel in particular. Paul confirms this
in 1 Thessalonians. Jesus is not talking about the rapture. He is talking about the second coming and Armageddon. The rapture
happens at the second coming. Its not the people left behind who are destroyed but the people who are taken. Noah was left behind in the Ark and Lot was left behind when Sodom was destroyed.

Lot was not left behind on the contrary, angels help them by Taken them by the hand to get to Zoar.
Gen 19
15At daybreak the angels hurried Lot along, saying, “Get up! Take your wife and your two daughters who are here, or you will be swept away in the punishment of the city.” 16But when Lot hesitated, the men grabbed his hand and the hands of his wife and his two daughters. And they led them safely out of the city, because of the LORD’s compassion for them.

Swept away in punishment just as the people in Noah’s time, the ark had taken Noah and his family away

 

[KJV1611]

This refers directly to the Battle of Armageddon, and not the Rapture as some think! Ezek. 39:17

JSM

I didn't see Armageddon or anything that even hints of any kind of battle in Luke 12. The whole premise of Luke 17 is:

Luk 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
Luk 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

How does Armageddon play a part in the kingdom of God that comes without observation. I would think Armageddon will be visible to the entire world.

 

[KJV1611]

The eagle is a unclean animal used to represent unbelief. Just as Balaam's Ass was used in another parables giving us the same kind of understanding of the gospel hid .

I would say the eagle represents a messenger that brings the word of God. But it is not the invisible source of the word . Even the Son of man refused to stand in that holy unseen place , but rather gave glory to the father unseen .In that way we look to what the eyes see the temporal to give us the unseen eternal understanding of the parable revealing the gospel.

How beautiful are the feet of them .I would say he uses different metaphors to express he is not served by human hands typified as unclean . we plant the seed or the eagle plants it but Only God not seen can cause the growth.

What difference does it make if the eagle is clean or unclean... is any person clean without the blood of Christ? What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.

Can you provide us with a verse that equates the eagle with unbelief or a messenger of God?

Also where did the bible say that Jesus refused to stand in that holy unseen place?

 

[Absolutely]

Luk 17:34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.
Luk 17:35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Luk 17:36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Luk 17:37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

I wish I could remember who pointed this out to me so I could give them credit for it, but someone on CC showed me this a year or two ago and I got busy and kind of forgot about it. That person showed me that the ones that were taken, were taken to the dead body in verse 37.

I believe the dead body was the body of Christ and the eagles are believers. One reason I believe this is because we mount up with eagles wings and we feed on the body of Christ... there are other reasons to, but now I have satisfied the requirements of p_rehbein, I've given my thoughts lol.

What are your thought?
What is the dead body and what do the eagles represent?

It is a phrase,not a place.
If i say "where there is smoke,there is fire" in answer to a question "is that bully gonna cause problems at school today"
I am not connecting ANYTHING in that phrase to smoke or fire.

That is why it is confusing.
In Jesus's answer He gave them a riddle.

The vulture dead body guessing game is a rabbit trail.

It was prophesied the messiah would come teacjing in riddles (parables)
We see it in pharoas dream and Joseph's dream.

If you miss the q and a you miss the meaning.

If you compile the ascribed answers to the bodies and vultures you will see a maze of guesswork. One guess after another.

 

[Absolutely]

IOW, Play it backwards or come at it from the backside.
See who they are and the context of where/who/ timing of Jesus.

Jesus is basically calling it a no brainer.

 

[KJV1611]

It is a phrase,not a place.
If i say "where there is smoke,there is fire" in answer to a question "is that bully gonna cause problems at school today"
I am not connecting ANYTHING in that phrase to smoke or fire.

That is why it is confusing.
In Jesus's answer He gave them a riddle.

The vulture dead body guessing game is a rabbit trail.

It was prophesied the messiah would come teacjing in riddles (parables)
We see it in pharoas dream and Joseph's dream.

If you miss the q and a you miss the meaning.

If you compile the ascribed answers to the bodies and vultures you will see a maze of guesswork. One guess after another.

That could be the case but we are also told that the disciple would not cover the cities of Israel until the Son of man be come. Couple those verses together and you get the resurrection of Christ.

Mat 10:23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

 

[Absolutely]

Jesus could have said "where you see construction workers,you see trash"
"Where you see a picnic,you find ants"
"Where there is food/trash,there are flies"

All he is saying is, where you see the rapture,heaven is the destination/place

 

[Absolutely]

That could be the case but we are also told that the disciple would not cover the cities of Israel until the Son of man be come. Couple those verses together and you get the resurrection of Christ.

Mat 10:23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

If you think the son of God has already come (second coming)then we are on separate planets.

Half the bible is going to be either a cunning interpretation or confusion

 

[KJV1611]

If you think the son of God has already come (second coming)then we are on separate planets.

Half the bible is going to be either a cunning interpretation or confusion

I don't think the second advent has taken place but I do know that the kingdom of God that comes without observation is here right now and that's what Jesus is talking about in Luke 17.

 

[PERFECTION]

Luk 17:34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.
Luk 17:35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Luk 17:36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Luk 17:37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

I wish I could remember who pointed this out to me so I could give them credit for it, but someone on CC showed me this a year or two ago and I got busy and kind of forgot about it. That person showed me that the ones that were taken, were taken to the dead body in verse 37.

I believe the dead body was the body of Christ and the eagles are believers. One reason I believe this is because we mount up with eagles wings and we feed on the body of Christ... there are other reasons to, but now I have satisfied the requirements of p_rehbein, I've given my thoughts lol.

What are your thought?
What is the dead body and what do the eagles represent?

Looking at the word "body" it does appear (to me at least) that we are talking about a Body of Deliverance ,which would be Christ, and of course the overcomes "or eagles" thats my two cents.
Love the the thread. Good meat on this bone.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

He goes on to advise them to flee and not bother to collect anything from their homes. If this was about some silent pre tribulation rapture what would be the point of telling them all this?

I agree with you that this context is NOT about our Rapture [though I am pre-trib, just to be clear to the readers]

The emphasis is on sudden destruction when its not expected by the world in general and Israel in particular. Paul confirms this in 1 Thessalonians. Jesus is not talking about the rapture. He is talking about the second coming and Armageddon.

I agree that Jesus is talking about the Second Coming and Armageddon (time-frame).

I disagree that the "sudden destruction" referred to in 1Th5 is speaking of that point in the chronology (IOW, it is not equal to the Lk17:27,29 passage/context, which IS the Second Coming to the earth context).

1Th5:2-3 is the ARRIVAL of the DOTL time period (which will unfold upon the earth); "destruction" coming UPON "them" (like an INITIAL "birth PANG [SINGULAR; equal to the Matt24:4/Mk13:5 aka SEAL #1 at the BEGINNING of the trib yrs]") is I believe set in contrast to those who (in and DURING the same time period [the trib yrs] will "...may have strength to FLEE OUT OF each and every thing coming on the earth [during the trib yrs], and to stand before [in a judicial sense] the Son of man [His Second Coming to the earth designation]" in Lk21:36, not a Rapture verse/passage), neither of which is "the Church which is His body" (to/of whom the Rapture SOLELY pertains).

[compare also the two distinct words (for "destroy") in, say, 1Tim6:9]

The rapture happens at the second coming.

Disagree.

Its not the people left behind who are destroyed but the people who are taken. Noah was left behind in the Ark and Lot was left behind when Sodom was destroyed.

Agreed. The "taken" are "taken away in judgment," just as in Noah's day.

(the "left" are left to experience this: Gen9:1 and Dan2:35 "fill/filled the [whole] earth")

This context is His Second Coming to the earth FOR the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom (not our Rapture).