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popeye
Guest
The catching away of 1 thes 4 is the gathering of the bride. Jesus directly addressed this at the "last supper"
You can choose to ignore Jesus' coming but you can not say it is "not biblical"
Matthew 24:40-41
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You can choose to ignore Jesus' coming but you can not say it is "not biblical"
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kennethcadwell
Guest
Just because the word rapture is not in the bible, does not make it an unbiblical teaching.
Different people and different times use different words to explain the same event, as the bible calls it resurrection, gathering together, caught up, transformed in a twinkling of an eye, and so on....
Now days generations label it as the rapture, but is speaking of this same event the bible speaks of all over.
Well, what happened within the lifetime of those listeners?
Figure they were mostly probably around 30, or so. Think that sounds about right? So, how much longer would they live?
Whatever it was that was to happen wouldn't be more than several decades down the road.
What do we know happened about that time?
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popeye
Guest
"sheep and goats" is at the white throne judgement aafter the milleneum.But as the days of Noah were so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Matt. 24:37-39
Who were taken away in the days of Noah? Weren't the wicked destroyed and wasn't that their judgment from God? Seems this would tie into the separation of the sheep and goats - those taken away were evil, i.e. goats taken for judgment and those left, i.e. the sheep to enter the kingdom. Still looking into this . . .
The noah story is 100% PRETRIB. (preflood)
What you need is a POST JUDGEMENT MODEL........good luck,I have not seen one.
BTW,noah and family were "taken" into the ark. So no 1st taken wicked scenario here or anywhere else. Righteous are taken first.
Interesting.
Thank you.
'The Rapture' is a popular belief here...sorry.....they might come at you in groups?
I am always interested in seeing others and everyones point of view.
This is how I learn.
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popeye
Guest
3 questins were asked in mat 24.
Yes ad 70 was a partial fulfilment of Jesus' prophecy.
Josephus said no christians died in the seige because they remembered Jesus' words
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popeye
Guest
Rapture,rapture,rapture,rapture,rapture,rapture,rapture,rapture,rapture,rapture,rapture,rapture,rapture,
LOL
LOL
Oh, they'll get over it. I've already lived through at least 15 (I'm guessing) predictions of the "End of The World", and all that's happened is that some of the prognosticators have died, themselves. (So, I guess it WAS the end of the world.... for them. LOL
I have several Jewish friends, so I have the advantage of knowing what "Heaven & Earth" really meant to those Jews. (HINT: It was the Temple) Likewise, what they understood "The End of The Age" to be. (HINT: It had nothing to do with the World ending.)
The Noah story here in Matt. - But as the days of Noah were so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Matt. 24:37-39 - these people continued their life as usual. They did not believe Noah's report of a coming flood - the flood came and killed all those who did not believe God. It is a comparison, comparing how it was in the days of Noah and how it will be in the end. Noah and his family "went willingly" into the ark in obedience to God. The white throne judgment is THE END when those that have not believed will suffer the second death and those that believe will enter into the ETERNAL Kingdom.
Righteous will be taken first when speaking of the rapture. The "gathering together" - rapturo in Latin - is when the dead in Christ shall rise first. [1 Thess. 4]
Wonder how many times and how long the people living during Noah's day lived with dire predictions and watched as this "crazy man" Noah built this huge "ship" waiting for a flood that they thought would not come. Surprise, Surprise! It came when they least expected it because of their unbelief. Wonder how many of these people beat on the door of the ark asking for Noah to help them as the waters continued to rise?
These verses cannot be interpreted outside the confext of verses 37-39:
Matt 24:37-41
37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
KJV
From verse 39, we see that the taking is a taking to judgement or destruction. Those who remain, as those on the ark are preserved unto life.
I am neither Preterist, Post Millenniel, nor amillenniel; but I thought the words Particularly interested did not exclude me.
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popeye
Guest
makes no sense.
During the GT the wicked are preserved while the believers are beheaded.
No place in the word are the wicked removed while the righteous remain.
You left out the context;
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
No hint anyhere of annything post-flood,or "wicked taken first"
Noah was first with his family
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popeye
Guest
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popeye
Guest
It's of the future coming of the Lord, Luke gives important details as well...(son of man is revealed)
Luke 17:26-37[SUP]26 [/SUP]And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man.
[SUP]27 [/SUP]They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.
[SUP]28 [/SUP]Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;
[SUP]29 [/SUP]But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
[SUP]30 [/SUP]Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. (yet future)
[SUP]31 [/SUP]In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back.
[SUP]32 [/SUP]Remember Lot's wife.
[SUP]33 [/SUP]Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.
[SUP]34 [/SUP]I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.
[SUP]35 [/SUP]Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
[SUP]36 [/SUP]Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
[SUP]37 [/SUP]And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.
Notice the mention of the body and the fowls (eagles)......and supper of great day of God....
Revelation 19:15-20
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, King Of Kings, And Lord Of Lords.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;
[SUP]18 [/SUP]That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone."
I just did some counting. Wow! I way underestimated. I've lived through around 60 predictions of the End.... and that's not even counting Hal Lindsey's numerous fiascos.
Harold Camping. What a tool! I saw that idiot by accident and couldn't believe what I was hearing from him and seeing from his zombie drones. Dangerous people indeed.