New Covenant and Old Covenant

[Shamah]

Hmm so the "completion of days" is what?

Ariel im asking what your view on this is

 

[Ariel82]

Found this Shamah and thought you might like this article if you haven't already read it.

Shavuot: From the Natural to the Supernatural | Messianic Bible

 

[Ariel82]

Ariel im asking what your view on this is

Almost midnight here..,.brain isn't working as fast.

Had to do some research.

The count "completion of days" was for Pentecost (was my first thought but had to make sure that it was in line with scriptures)...why seven day purification? Don't know was reading scriptures to find out if they say anything.

Mitvoh cleansing is often mentioned in Leviticus.

All I have read is purification the day before or day of on Jewish sites..gonna go look at scriptures about the feast of weeks.

 

[Shamah]

Almost midnight here..,.brain isn't working as fast.

Had to do some research.

The count was for Pentecost...why seven day purification? Don't know was reading scriptures to find out if they say anything.

Mitvoh cleansing is often mentioned in Leviticus.

No it was until te end of their nazerite vow they took

Acst 21:
23 Therefore do this that we tell you. We have four men who [f]are under a vow; 24 take them and purify yourself along with them, and [g]pay their expenses so that they may shave their [h]heads; and all will know that there is nothing to the things which they have been told about you, but that you yourself also walk orderly, keeping the Law. 25 But concerning the Gentiles who have believed, we wrote, having decided that they should abstain from meat sacrificed to idols and from blood and from what is strangled and from fornication.” 26 Then Paul [j]took the men, and the next day, purifying himself along with them, went into the temple giving notice of the completion of the days of purification, until the sacrifice was offered for each one of them.

Numbers 6:2-5,2 “Speak to the children of Yisra’ĕl, and say to them, ‘When a man or woman does separate, by making a vow of a Nazirite, to be separate to יהוה,"3 he separates himself from wine and strong drink – he drinks neither vinegar of wine nor vinegar of strong drink, neither does he drink any grape juice, nor eat grapes or raisins."4 All the days of his separation he does not eat whatever is made of the grapevine, from seed to skin."5 All the days of the vow of his separation a razor does not come upon his head. Until the days are completed for which he does separate himself to יהוה, he is set-apart. He shall let the locks of the hair of his head grow long."


and your nt and ot at the same time is something else... never heard this one before...

also i am not mad at you or there is not rudeness we are reasoning togather,

 

[Ariel82]

Nah if you were mad at me I would have just put you on ignore...life is too short for such nonsense.

Figures we were just talking..,nazarite vow?

Why do you think they took one?

Wasn't Samson suppose to be a nazarite?

 

[Shamah]

Nah if you were mad at me I would have just put you on ignore...life is too short for such nonsense.

Figures we were just talking..,nazarite vow?

Why do you think they took one?

Wasn't Samson suppose to be a nazarite?

Yes Sampson took a nazerite vow, if you look at that passage in Acts and you look at a nazerite vow it is pretty clear the shaving of the head, the "completion of days" and purification.

A nazerite vow was basiccally a vow of dedication to YHWH, during this time one would be pure of worldly corruption, mentally, physically and spirtually.

Intersting stuff IMO, kind of like seperation from the world and focus on Yah in pureness.

Have you ever done the "branch" study about Yahshua, as a "nazerite" not a vow but as the "branch" it is off topic here, but anything about the Messiah is awesom, it is probably the most hidden and possiblyamazing prophecy about the Messiah, it details His likeness in each of the 4 gospels, reallly cool stuff

 

[Ariel82]

Old covenant: feast of weeks....celebration of the giving on,the Torah in Mount Sinai with grain offerings, etc.

New covenant ,,,pentecost...celebration of the giving of the Holy Spirit by speaking the Gospel in every tongue and sharing with the nation's the Bread of life, the true Manna from Heaven

 

[Ariel82]

Yes Sampson took a nazerite vow, if you look at that passage in Acts and you look at a nazerite vow it is pretty clear the shaving of the head, the "completion of days" and purification.

A nazerite vow was basiccally a vow of dedication to YHWH, during this time one would be pure of worldly corruption, mentally, physically and spirtually.

Intersting stuff IMO, kind of like seperation from the world and focus on Yah in pureness.

Have you ever done the "branch" study about Yahshua, as a "nazerite" not a vow but as the "branch" it is off topic here, but anything about the Messiah is awesom, it is probably the most hidden and possiblyamazing prophecy about the Messiah, it details His likeness in each of the 4 gospels, reallly cool stuff

No haven't studied it much. Maybe a new thread?

I have a ritual for the last 15 years or so of growing out my hair until it reaches 12 inches and then donating it to locks of love so they can make wigs for cancer victims.

Stopped counting after 5 times

 

[Shamah]

No haven't studied it much. Maybe a new thread?

I have a ritual for the last 15 years or so of growing out my hair until it reaches 12 inches and then donating it to locks of love so they can make wigs for cancer victims.

Stopped counting after 5 times

That is really awesome! praise Yah for His people! you are a gem!

Yeah I will start a new thread on it in a few minutes, well Ill start it now but it will take a few mins!
it is really really awesome!

 

[Shamah]

Old covenant: feast of weeks....celebration of the giving on,the Torah in Mount Sinai with grain offerings, etc.

New covenant ,,,pentecost...celebration of the giving of the Holy Spirit by speaking the Gospel in every tongue and sharing with the nation's the Bread of life, the true Manna from Heaven

do you agree with this:

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Fulfilled already- To be fulfilled in the future

1. Passover/First-fruits – Yahshua's Sacrifice(Passover), burial and resurrection (First Fruits – presenting Himself to YHWH)
2. Feast of Unleavened Bread – Removal of sin by Yahshua's perfect work as the Passover Sacrifice
3. Feast of Weeks – The blessing Holy Spirit of YHWH, coming into our lives stronger than ever
4. Feast of Trumpets – Yahshua's return and gathering of the Saints
5. Day of Atonement – Yahshua leads the army of YHWH to destroy evil rulers of this world and satan is chained for 1,000 years
6. Feast of Tabernacles – Yahshua dwells on earth for 1,000 years teaching truth and righteousness
7. The Last Great Day – satan is loosed and swiftly destroyed, the Kingdom of YHWH reigns forever[/FONT]


d

 

[Ariel82]

Truthfully I would have to study it more.

 

[Shamah]

Truthfully I would have to study it more.

honestly I think that is the correct answer.

If you want I can send you a study, a compreensive study showing in Scrupture how this is prophesied and fulfilled, I made the study myself, if not no worries no offence.

 

[prove-all]

[Fulfilled already]

Jesus Christ, who went to heaven, and sent God’s Holy Spirit
on the day of [Pentecost], who founded the new test. Church.


This is still [ongoing], the calling out of the bride, ends at Christs return.

 

[Ariel82]

[Fulfilled already]

Jesus Christ, who went to heaven, and sent God’s Holy Spirit
on the day of [Pentecost], who founded the new test. Church.


This is still [ongoing], the calling out of the bride, ends at Christs return.

I agree with this.

 

[Studyman]

1. All non-Catholics are not Protestants.

2. Salvation is purely by God's grace and it is the GIFT of eternal life. This is based upon the obedience of Christ and His finished work of redemption.

3. No genuinely saved Christian brags about his or her salvation, since it is not of works lest any man should boast.

4. Genuine children of God are NOT in rebellion but obedience to God and Christ. So you must have pretenders in mind.

5. So your misrepresentation means that you have an axe to grind.

Tell us, on what do you base your salvation -- the grace of God or the merits of your obedience?

19 After a long time the lord of those servants cometh, and reckoneth with them.20 And so he that had received five talents came and brought other five talents, saying, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me five talents: behold, I have gained beside them five talents more.
21 His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.

 

[Yahshua]

Might be interesting to add this to the thread's conversation. This was shown to me by another just recently.

Jeremiah 31:31

Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:


The text says that the Most High will make his new covenant with two groups: the house of Israel & house of Judah. Yah's word doesn't return to him void (Isaiah 55:11) but accomplishes what he sets out to do. And the promises of Yah are without repentance (Romans 11:29).

Both covenants were specifically promised to Israel.


So we can't really say there was a covenant for Israel but a separate one for the church because again the promise of the new covenant was made to the children of Israel, not to gentiles. Gentiles are grafted into Israel's commonwealth (Romans 11:11) becoming children of Israel too. This is important because it means converts are subject to the same law, whatever law that may be (Exodus 12:49, Leviticus 24:22, Numbers 15:29).

-----

Next, we read what the new covenant is and why it was promised to the children of Israel...


32 NOT according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.



I think this is why it's key to see covenants and laws as two separate but related things, because the new covenant isn't described as a change of law but as a change to where the law is written.

Now can Father Yah alter his law? Sure, he can add to his law (like with the sacrifices added after Israel's sin of the golden calf) and also take away from it (like the removal of the sacrifices after the resurrection of Christ), as necessary, though we can't. But a particular law change is not what's being described in the promises in Jeremiah 31. "The law" is not the subject of this passage, but the object:

Subject = I (Yah)
Verb = Put
Direct Object = (my) Law
indirect Object = (Israel's) Inward parts


So the new covenant is about:

1. no longer needing to teach Yah (and his law) to one's Israelite neighbor (from writings & tablets)

2. forgiveness of Israel's iniquity

3. no longer remembering their sins



----

Now we all know what happened during Christ's ministry. His people rejected him (with exception to a few) and judgment fell like Christ said it would, in fulfillment of the scriptures (Luke 21:22-24). So if the majority of his people didn't/don't accept Christ (and thus reject the new covenant) it means they should still be under those curses/punishments of the old covenant - enumerated to follow them forever in the OT scriptures - even to this day. Iniquity still isn't forgiven, sins still are remembered, and they still wouldn't know Yah internally (meaning no Holy Spirit), right?

 

[LW97]

Hebrews 9:16

 

[Ariel82]

So the new covenant is about:

1. no longer needing to teach Yah (and his law) to one's Israelite neighbor (from writings & tablets)

So why are teachers needed in the new covenant?

The laws of The new covenant are DIFFERENT from the Laws in the old. FOR EXAMPLE: no animal sacrifices or circumcision (of all males organs) required in the New covenant

If you can't be honest about the fact that the laws have been changed, then it's pointless to have a conversation.

People have a choice to cling to lies they tell themselves or pray and ask God to show them truth from delusions.

 

[Studyman]

So why are teachers needed in the new covenant?

The laws of The new covenant are DIFFERENT from the Laws in the old. FOR EXAMPLE: no animal sacrifices or circumcision (of all males organs) required in the New covenant

If you can't be honest about the fact that the laws have been changed, then it's pointless to have a conversation.

People have a choice to cling to lies they tell themselves or pray and ask God to show them truth from delusions.

I would just argue that Circumcision was always intended to be from the heart(mind), not just the flesh.

Lev. 26:40 If they shall confess their iniquity, and the iniquity of their fathers, with their trespass which they trespassed against me, and that also they have walked contrary unto me;
41 And that I also have walked contrary unto them, and have brought them into the land of their enemies; if then their uncircumcised hearts be humbled, and they then accept of the punishment of their iniquity:

42 Then will I remember my covenant with Jacob, and also my covenant with Isaac, and also my covenant with Abraham will I remember; and I will remember the land.

So by the time Malachi was written, all God's true people already knew it was the Spiritual intent of Circumcision to be from the heart, just like they knew an Israelite was one from the heart, inwardly not outwardly. That is the intent of the teaching of the Law and Prophets that was revealed by the Christ and His Apostles.

The problem is that those who were given the service of the Priesthood had rejected God's instructions and created their own version of God's Laws as it is written. When God sent His Prophets to set them straight they killed them. So God sent His Son and they killed Him as well. These preachers, the Levites, which were given the Priests office had corrupted God's Word.

Matt. 15:7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,
8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.
9
But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

And again;

Heb. 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

8 For finding fault with them,(Levite Priests) he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

So He did as He said He would do. He became our High Priest, No more Levite Priests, He Forgives our sin, not more Levitical Priesthood sacrificial "Works of the Law" for the remission of sins.

So you are correct that there was a change in the Law, this change was the fulfillment of the change of the Levitical Priesthood given by the Word which became Flesh in Jer. 31, and the duties which were given exclusively to the Levites, have now been inherited by the Christ.

This is not taught because of the man made religious traditions we have been warned of so many times. But if you study the Word you will find this account of the New covenant to be true.

 

[Yahshua]

So why are teachers needed in the new covenant?

That IS the question. Intriguing isn't it? ...worth a ponder?

"Let Yah be truth and everyone else a liar" (Romans 3:4). If Father Yah said in the new covenant that the Israelite "shall no longer teach his neighbor or brother" because all Israel shall know Him...and yet teachers are needed today...what could it possibly mean? What possible conclusions are there based on what we know?

Just sharing food for thought.

The laws of The new covenant are DIFFERENT from the Laws in the old. FOR EXAMPLE: no animal sacrifices or circumcision (of all males organs) required in the New covenant

If you can't be honest about the fact that the laws have been changed, then it's pointless to have a conversation.

I didn't think I was being dishonest. I was just pointing out that changing of the law isn't the subject of the new covenant promise given in Jeremiah 31, but instead where the law is written. Can we agree on that?

People have a choice to cling to lies they tell themselves or pray and ask God to show them truth from delusions.

That's true. Amen.