I agree regarding the translation. I am so used to this translation, and I understand the intent behind Christ's Words, but maybe I might consider mixing it up a little when it come to translations.
Thanks for the input
No Outward Act Can Save You
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I agree regarding the translation. I am so used to this translation, and I understand the intent behind Christ's Words, but maybe I might consider mixing it up a little when it come to translations.
Thanks for the input
Their faith ?? Where did they get the faith in the first place to be “activated”.
Most translations say 'believes' or 'believing'. This speaks of a continuous living by faith. Stop doing that altogether, and you can break the covenant.
Works are the evidence of faith. No evidence, no faith. That's the way it is.
Empty words such as "I believe" will get you nowhere.
Your analagy of a tree is incorrect here. Jesus by example cursed the fig tree when he found it fruitless. The tree died.
Which epistle teaches false christians who they really are? Epistles are NOT for "false christians", because they can't discern the scriptures. Every epistle teaches christians how to live for the Lord.
James is telling christians that their faith without matching, proving works is dead, because it by itself does nothing.
Saying "I believe" doesn't make a christian faithful. Obedience to the law of Christ does.
1. I don't see anyone adding to the work of Christ. This is a strawman argument.
What I DO see is people saying the only faith we need is a one time belief of the Gospel.
That is NOT how we have salvation. It's by grace through faith, "through" indicating throughout your life.The just shall live by faith.
What I also see from the same people is the absence of the Lordship of Christ. If Jesus isn't the Lord(master) of your life, He's not your savior either.
"One does not simply make Jesus 'Lord' without obedience."
If I have to tell them what that's about, then Jesus is not their Lord.
2. Salvation is not by grace through faith in grace. That is a serious error.
It's also an indication of freegrace doctrine, which is heresy.
Freegrace/Hyper-grace/OSAS do not teach anything about Jesus' Lordship.
If Jesus isn't Lord of all, He's not Lord at all.
Jesus isn't a part-time Savior; neither is He a part-time Lord.
Do I really need to answer such a question as this,of course we have the faith of a mustard seed and GOD does the rest.
Saving belief/faith in Christ is a continuous, living faith and is not some shallow, temporary belief that has no root, produces no fruit and withers away.
Amen! Works are the fruit, by product and demonstrate evidence of authentic faith in Christ, but not the essence of faith and not the means of our salvation. Faith is the root of salvation and works are the fruit. No fruit at all demonstrates there is no root.
The point that I was making is that a dead faith does not produce works in order to become a living faith, but BECAUSE it’s a living faith; just as a dead tree does not produce fruit in order to become a living tree, but BECAUSE it’s a living tree. The fig tree represents Israel and just because these Jews were alive physically does not mean they were not dead spiritually. For more on the parable of the fig tree, see:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.gotquestions.org/amp/curse-fig-tree.html
Just because the epistles are addressed to Christians, does not mean that everyone being discussed in the epistles are genuine Christians. The Bible mentions false teachers, false prophets, false brethren and of course, those who merely claim to have faith, but have no works to evidence their claim, demonstrating they have an empty profession of faith/dead faith and not authentic living faith. Obedience and faithfulness is produced from a living faith and not a dead faith.
MMD, I think the real difference between us is you believe once faith is proven to be real, that person's salvation can't be lost no matter what while I believe if a person with real faith can quit believing, and if done so consistently & intentionally, break the covenant with Christ.
Did I get that right?
Did I get that right?
I think you miscomprehended my words. Salvation of our souls is unmerited, undeserved and wholly paid for by Christ's blood sacrifice. We do not maintain our position in His righteousness.
He is the Just One, and He indeed lives, because of His perfect faith and obedience to the Father. We stand by His faith in grace, which will confirm us unto the end, holy, blameless, unreproveable. Praise God, in Christ.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.
We have a ministry, we have a gospel call, we have a house of doctrine, we have an apostle of God, "a witness unto all men" for a pattern of things we are to believe and understand about who we are in Christ and in the household of God.
He is the Just One, and He indeed lives, because of His perfect faith and obedience to the Father. We stand by His faith in grace, which will confirm us unto the end, holy, blameless, unreproveable. Praise God, in Christ.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.
We have a ministry, we have a gospel call, we have a house of doctrine, we have an apostle of God, "a witness unto all men" for a pattern of things we are to believe and understand about who we are in Christ and in the household of God.
I believe in eternal security of the believer/preservation of the saints (Ephesians 1:13-14; 4:30: Psalm 37:28: Jude 1:1) and whom He justified, these He also glorified (Romans 8:30).
Our works are in doctrine, building a house of doctrine into the inner man. This is about us being ambassadors of Christ, the temple of God, and manifesting God in the flesh. At the judgment seat of Christ we are judged for this work we do in our body, whether it be good(spiritual) or bad(fleshly)... gold silver precious stones, wood hay stubble. God works through us by correct doctrine.
I believe in the same thing, as long as we continue believing. The New Covenant requires we live for Christ by a living faith. A permanent stop to believing breaks the New Covenant.
Believing is a process by which one continues to believe in Christ, and doing so also requires us to obey Him as Lord, because He is.
The Apostle Paul continuously speaks of himself the bondservant of the Lord Jesus Christ, declaring Christ as his Lord & master, obeying Him as a slave would obey his master.
It seems to me some leave Jesus' position as Lord of their lives out of their doctrine while Christ's Lordship is all over the NT.
Do you see that?
Being saved through faith includes repentance toward God -- turning from sin and evil and idolatry and turning to the living God and Christ.
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent (Acts 17:30)
Your response does not answer the question.
If God commanded a outward action as the point/moment of salvation would that action be necessary to gain the salvation?
Would fulfilling that command to do the action still be seen as a "work", "law" or "sacrament"?
Were those who covered their doors posts with blood doing a "work", "law" or "sacrament"?.
So where do you draw the line in the sand on Christ's Lordship in the life of a believer and also on how much obedience it takes to maintain the "believing process," as you put it?" The Christian life is one that begins with receiving Christ through faith and also recognizing Jesus as Sovereign ruler and Lord with a progressive degree of experiential submission to Him in all areas of their Christian life as one matures.
I've heard certain people (particularly those in the sinless perfection camp) say that it's not enough to place our faith (belief, trust, reliance) in Jesus Christ as the all sufficient means of our salvation in order to be saved, but that we must ALSO completely surrender to His Lordship if we expect to be saved. If we "completely" surrendered, then we would be sinless, 100% of the time, but that is not the case.
In 1 Corinthians 3:1-3, we read - And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ. 2 I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able; 3 for you are still carnal. For where there are envy, strife, and divisions among you, are you not carnal and behaving like mere men? Does it sound like these believers at Corinth were "completely" surrendered to the Lordship of Christ? Yet Paul still referred to them as babes in Christ. They needed to mature.
The Bible clearly teaches that faith in Christ will result in a changed life (2 Corinthians 5:17; Galatians 5:22–23; James 2:14–26) yet new converts are not instantly transformed into becoming fully mature in Christ. That is a process. It's not our place to judge other believers as insufficiently surrendering to the Lordship of Christ and implying they won't be saved based on their lack of performance, while exalting ourselves as sufficiently surrounding to the Lordship of Christ and implying that surely we will be saved, based on our superior performance.
I haven't read through the other posts as yet, so I don't know if anyone else caught this, but speaking is an outward act, and it is required for salvation, or some other corresponding outward act of faith.
Again, faith alone is dead or useless, and does not save.
Jas 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
But the above scripture verse is talking about the works of faith and not works of the law.
In other words, if you don't have an accompanying corresponding outward act or work to your faith, such as confessing what you believe in your heart, it amounts to nothing.
Define good works and faith please.
What you call byproduct, God calls fruit.
And going to church, giving to the poor, preaching or teaching God's word, singing in the quire, and so forth, are not necessarily byproducts of God's work in you.
If you recall, there are tare among the wheat and wolves among the sheep, that have been in the church for so long, they may even believe they are one of the sheep or wheat.
It also looks like obedience to the voice of the Spirit is involved in keeping one's salvation.
One certainly must keep or continue in the word of God to stay in Christ.
Col 1:22 In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:
Col 1:23 If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;
1Jn 2:24 Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father.
1Jn 2:25 And this is the promise that he hath promised us, even eternal life.
What work or works will prove you are saved?
What kind of things does one have to do that will ultimately show they are saved?
Speaking or confessing Jesus as one's lord and savior, is one form of an outward act that is necessary for salvation, because without a corresponding act/work to one's faith, their faith is rendered useless.
The works/spirit is what gives the faith/body life.
Understand please, that faith is a noun, and a noun is a person, place, or THING.
Notice how James compare the body to that of faith.
Jas 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
If the person Is looking at the bible, belief In the WORD of GOD Is all that's needed but If the person Is looking at salvation from man's point of view then their faith will be proven true by physical action.