Not By Works

[BillG]

You did not die a moment after your abuse. Therefore, you have had plenty of time to forgive, which I believe you have? Am I right. So is this is a mute point?

Not really. Afterall one minute or one hour or one year the consequences are the same.
But you are different, cause you say "That after one minute you would confess it the father from which I believe you feel you would be saved?

Afterall you have one minute to forgive before you died.

So not mute really.

 

[benhur]

Once saved, always saved is not a doctrine. Read the Word of God for the People of God. What work God has done, cannot be undone. The gift once accepted seals the deal.

There are a whole batch of scriptures that tell me that Jesus will never do anything that loses a person from his love and his gift of eternal life. But there are myriads of scriptures that tell us that we may turn against God and lose our gift.

Do you believe that Jesus will force men to heaven?

 

[theanointedsinner]

I'm assuming you are thoroughly up-to-date on the scriptures. No I do not post scripture every time I post. I'm also not going to do your scripture look up for you.

up to date? what happened to complete and eternal word of God "the grass wither, the flower fade, but the word of God last forever", and "God's word will not go void"
what happened to it?

Not that my politics has anything to do with this site nor this thread, (stick to the OP), but I am a die hard conservative who believes in the Republic of the USA and for the Constitution and the Bill of Rights and the Declaration of Independence.

wait a minute, was Jesus a democrat or a republican, was Jesus left or right? up or down?
the bible never say, but Jesus promise to change us inside out, and the millenial kingdom is Jesus's political party
and you vote for him by placing your faith in Jesus, so yes faith always protects.

 

[BillG]

You did not die a moment after your abuse. Therefore, you have had plenty of time to forgive, which I believe you have? Am I right. So is this is a mute point?

Yes I have forgiven but it took time and a lot of healing

 

[justpassinthrough]

Those who are in Him, must abide or remain in Him or be cast into the fire and burned.

Please just read and believe what Jesus said.


6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.
John 15:6


The Lord loves each of us and does not want any of us to become lost.

• If anyone does not abide in Me....

Can’t you see this.


Read what He says about what happens to a person who is IN HIM, but does not remain in Him.


If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.
John 15:6


Here is how a person remains, abides in Christ.

• Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him,

Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
1 John 3:24



JPT

 

[benhur]

Not really. Afterall one minute or one hour or one year the consequences are the same.
But you are different, cause you say "That after one minute you would confess it the father from which I believe you feel you would be saved?

Afterall you have one minute to forgive before you died.

So not mute really.

Actually it is no me that says that. It has been said to this forum that the second (not the minute) you believe in Jesus you are saved forever no matter what you do.

I obviously believe there is a different consequence if you die 1 minute or 1 hour, or 1 day after you are abused, but in your case it is a mute point.

 

[benhur]

Yes I have forgiven but it took time and a lot of healing

It tells me that you are a true Christian and you too are in a position to be forgiven of all your trespasses against God. Good going, I'm glad for you.

 

[star]

John 10:28–29


28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.


Ephesians 4:30

30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

JOHN 3:16


16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life
.

 

[justpassinthrough]

Departing from the faith does not mean, nor is it interpreted as loss of salvation as you falsely assert.

Furthermore, your inflammatory and insulting comments toward a sister are noted and such behavior is asinine on your part.

I see, so pointing out that she insulted me is somehow insulting her.


LOL.



So your teaching that a person does don’t need to have faith any longer to be saved???

Do you even realize what you just said?


How can a person who comes to be in Christ through faith in Him, somehow depart from that very faith by which he was saved, and still remain saved?



That’s is HERESY!!!!



JPT

 

[star]

There are a whole batch of scriptures that tell me that Jesus will never do anything that loses a person from his love and his gift of eternal life. But there are myriads of scriptures that tell us that we may turn against God and lose our gift.

Do you believe that Jesus will force men to heaven?

Jesus never forces us to accept the gift in the first place. Eternal life is His gift but we must accept it. Once a gift is accepted, it is permanent. Do you believe Jesus would take back the eternal life He gave us as His gift?

 

[benhur]

Please just read and believe what Jesus said.


6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.
John 15:6


The Lord loves each of us and does not want any of us to become lost.

• If anyone does not abide in Me....

Can’t you see this.


Read what He says about what happens to a person who is IN HIM, but does not remain in Him.


If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.
John 15:6


Here is how a person remains, abides in Christ.

• Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him,

Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
1 John 3:24



JPT

What a horrible, despicable doctrine you teach, and to think it comes straight out of the bible. I can't stand it. (just kidding)

 

[BillG]

Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 1 Timothy 4:1


You shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free.

4:1 Paul begins a series of instructions specifically for Timothy. the Spirit expressly says: Paul may be referring to various prophecies inspired by the Holy Spirit concerning defection from God’s truth (see Dan. 7:25; 8:23; Matt. 24:4–12), or he might be speaking of a revelation the Spirit had given to him. Depart here means literally “to stand away from.” There will be various seasons in which some people will depart from their faith (1:19, 20). The reference here is not to a loss of salvation but to a failure to walk obediently (see John 19:25–27; 1 Cor. 3:1–3; 11:29, 30). The impact of satanic attack and influence is described in vv. 1–3. Doctrines of demons refers to following occult practices. NKJV Bible study notes.

It's amazing how satan can bring bondage to a believer (genuine beliver) that if you are not 100% obedient or compliant then God is gonna send you to hell.

Gods love for us casts out fear, satans hate for God casts out love.

 

[star]

Departing from the faith does not mean, nor is it interpreted as loss of salvation as you falsely assert.

Furthermore, your inflammatory and insulting comments toward a sister are noted and such behavior is asinine on your part.

If I were to insult JPT, I'd probably be thrown off this site. I would not mince words. Thank you for your support.

 

[theanointedsinner]

https://www.gotquestions.org/give-back-salvation.html

Can a Christian "give back" salvation?


The short answer to this question is, no, a true Christian cannot “give back” salvation. Oddly enough, some who agree that a Christian cannot “lose” his salvation still believe that salvation can be “given back” to God. Some who hold this viewpoint will take Romans 8:38-39 and say that while nothing outside of us can separate us from God, we ourselves can choose, in our free will, to separate ourselves from God. This is not only unbiblical; it defies all logic.

To understand why it is not possible for us to “give back” our salvation, three things are necessary to grasp: the nature of God, the nature of man, and the nature of salvation itself. God is, by nature, a Savior.

The concept of a Christian giving back his salvation is unscriptural and unthinkable.

https://www.gotquestions.org/give-back-salvation.html

 

[justpassinthrough]

28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.

You deliberately left a very important word from verse 28.

Why?


Verse 28 begins with the word “and”.

Verse 28 is the result of obeying verse 27.


27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. John 10:27-28


Eternal comes at the end of a life of hearing His Voice, which means hearing and doing what is heard, and following Him.


Those who “hear”, follow Him and do not become lost.


Those who become lost, have returned to being sinners.


4 “What man of you, having a hundred sheep, if he loses one of them, does not leave the ninety-nine in the wilderness, and go after the one which is lost until he finds it? 5 And when he has found it, he lays it on his shoulders, rejoicing. 6 And when he comes home, he calls together his friends and neighbors, saying to them, ‘Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep which was lost!’ 7 I say to you that likewise there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine just persons who need no repentance.
Luke 15:4-7


Lost = Seperated from God. Dead to God.




JPT

 

[benhur]

Jesus never forces us to accept the gift in the first place. Eternal life is His gift but we must accept it. Once a gift is accepted, it is permanent. Do you believe Jesus would take back the eternal life He gave us as His gift?

If you were to have a situation in your life that made you turn on Christ and you did everything in your power to prove Jesus was a fraud, and you did this till you went to your grave, leading millions away from Jesus, would Jesus bring you into his arms and live with you eternally?

My answer to this is he would bring you into his arms, and he would love you still, but you would not be able to live with him eternally. You would have to live where Jesus does not live.

 

[dcontroversal]

To Ladybug,

Very difficult to fake up fruits. That is because fruits are this:
1) the naked are clothed. Can't fake clothing someone.
2) the hungry are fed. Can't fake feeding someone.
3) the sick are taken care of and even healed. Can't fake taking care of the sick.
4) the imprisoned are visited. Can't fake a visit to the prison.
I can go on, but I hope you see my point.

OTOH, you can fake the reception of the baptism of the Holy Spirit. You can fake the idea that you are a new person in Christ. But you can only fake for a while, until someone notices that you have nothing to do with Christ. You have nothing to do with clothing the naked, or feeding the hungry, or healing the sick etc. Then the jig will be up and you will have to decide whether you want to be a real saved Christian or just a nominal, do-nothing, unsaved Christian.

[/QUOTE]

Ummmm....I suggest you study the word fruit...as in FRUITS of the SPIRIT

 

[BillG]

Actually it is no me that says that. It has been said to this forum that the second (not the minute) you believe in Jesus you are saved forever no matter what you do.

I obviously believe there is a different consequence if you die 1 minute or 1 hour, or 1 day after you are abused, but in your case it is a mute point.

Ok so please explain to me what the different consequences are.
Then I can understand what you are really saying.

Go back and read post 66,748.

I posted a response that you sent to me as follows

"Yes BillG, I believe that if you had not forgiven your abuser, you would not have eternal life with Christ, who forgave all his abusers"

So to me you have said by that quote there is only one consequence.
Its only mute to you because eventually I did forgive.

But you also said that if someone took your life and one minute later you died you could confess it the father (as I read it)
If I read it correctly then you have died before forgiving, so that being the case what is the consequences for you.

 

[dcontroversal]

Psalms 145:8-20
8 The Lord is merciful and compassionate,
slow to get angry and filled with unfailing love.
9 The Lord is good to everyone.
He showers compassion on all his creation.
10 All of your works will thank you, Lord,
and your faithful followers will praise you.
11 They will speak of the glory of your kingdom;
they will give examples of your power.
12 They will tell about your mighty deeds
and about the majesty and glory of your reign.
13 For your kingdom is an everlasting kingdom.
You rule throughout all generations.
The Lord always keeps his promises;
he is gracious in all he does.
14 The Lord helps the fallen
and lifts those bent beneath their loads.
15 The eyes of all look to you in hope;
you give them their food as they need it.
16 When you open your hand,
you satisfy the hunger and thirst of every living thing.
17 The Lord is righteous in everything he does;
he is filled with kindness.
18 The Lord is close to all who call on him,
yes, to all who call on him in truth.
19 He grants the desires of those who fear him;
he hears their cries for help and rescues them.
20 The Lord protects all those who love him,
but he destroys the wicked.

The mercy of the Lord endures FOREVER.........and because that...SALVATION endures forever!

 

[dcontroversal]

Once saved, always saved is not a doctrine. Read the Word of God for the People of God. What work God has done, cannot be undone. The gift once accepted seals the deal.

AMEN.....the words IRREVOCABLE, Eternal, Everlasting, Uttermost, Nothing etc. comes to mind....