Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
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@EleventhHour they should stop tempting you to touch your face; it's inconsiderate of them. 
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I live peaceably with others just fine. But you're presenting a false dichotomy with your use of the word "works". As I said, living peaceably is a work. Let me give you an example, let's say you've got some leftovers in the fridge. You've been looking forward to them all day and it's been a rough one. You get home, all amped up to eat those leftovers only to discover someone else has gotten to them and eaten them. Now, are you without effort going to be able to accept this injustice and move on or are you going to confront the food thief for infringing on your rights? Perhaps you'll react passive aggressively, not confronting them directly but instead waiting until they leave some choice leftovers to turn the tables on them?
E
I have never in all my life of churches, books, videos, bible studies etc., etc., heard a pastor state now that you are saved you can go sin all you want, God is okay with it and your life will be great...
This would be the sermon I guess......
"If you feel really angry and want to kill someone go for it, and you know God will not care if you steal that expensive pretty dress.
Also feel free to go after that married guy you can have him too just be discrete, if you need to lie to your coworkers it is all good...this
is no time to deny yourself being a little vindictive can be good for the soul, guess what folks we are saved it is open season with sin."
But if you say so... not something I believe I know that much.
This would be the sermon I guess......
"If you feel really angry and want to kill someone go for it, and you know God will not care if you steal that expensive pretty dress.
Also feel free to go after that married guy you can have him too just be discrete, if you need to lie to your coworkers it is all good...this
is no time to deny yourself being a little vindictive can be good for the soul, guess what folks we are saved it is open season with sin."
But if you say so... not something I believe I know that much.
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You're welcome. But there's no need to speculate..you can read the dang thread yourself. Better yet, here's the synopsis:
1) Dude asked me a question
2) I asked for clarification in order to answer it
3) I go back to talking OSAS with others
4) Next thing I know, he launches an attack salvo of insults about me being to much of a coward to answer
5) He keeps up his rule violating attacks
6) I finally tell him I ain't gonna dialogue b/c I don't want my IQ to drop and I'm practicing Proverbs 26:4
Reporting him not an option - no good to risk a ban on anyone that so desperately needs the love of Jesus, right?
7) He then has the audacity to report another opponent of his OSAS ideas for "rules" violation
8) I call him out for his blatant hypocrisy by asking him how the flip is his attacks against me not a violation of the same?
Somebody said I was crying victim....of a keyboard warrior? LOL I just want the record straight. Still think the scales are dippin my way?
1) Dude asked me a question
2) I asked for clarification in order to answer it
3) I go back to talking OSAS with others
4) Next thing I know, he launches an attack salvo of insults about me being to much of a coward to answer
5) He keeps up his rule violating attacks
6) I finally tell him I ain't gonna dialogue b/c I don't want my IQ to drop and I'm practicing Proverbs 26:4
Reporting him not an option - no good to risk a ban on anyone that so desperately needs the love of Jesus, right?
7) He then has the audacity to report another opponent of his OSAS ideas for "rules" violation
8) I call him out for his blatant hypocrisy by asking him how the flip is his attacks against me not a violation of the same?
Somebody said I was crying victim....of a keyboard warrior? LOL I just want the record straight. Still think the scales are dippin my way?
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I get your analogies, but it is more subtle than that, but not by much. Do some investigating. Look for Zane Hodges teachings, Lewis Sperry Chafer, Charles Stanley (and don't let the big name dictate premature disbelief one could ever teach such a thing) and FGT proponents. You may also look for a video by GES that preaches antinomianism, that is, no matter what you do after "salvation" you're "going to heaven."
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E
no matter what you do after "salvation" you're "going to heaven.
See I get what you are stating for sure... I think in reassuring people that salvation is secure we must always embed teaching the fact sin will have dire consequences and it not what God desires of us and we are called to live out our holy status... so both messages need to go together.
What bothers me is when @Judges1318 and @Phoneman-777 are equating secure salvation/OSAS with license to sin.
As if the two go hand in hand .. they do not.
See I get what you are stating for sure... I think in reassuring people that salvation is secure we must always embed teaching the fact sin will have dire consequences and it not what God desires of us and we are called to live out our holy status... so both messages need to go together.
What bothers me is when @Judges1318 and @Phoneman-777 are equating secure salvation/OSAS with license to sin.
As if the two go hand in hand .. they do not.
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yes
knowledge isn't causation - and in this instance Satan had desired to sift Simon like wheat. what we are looking at in him is chaff being removed; threshing. the kernel of his faith endured, tho he stumbled and fell even three times.
what are we seeing here?
would the God Of Our Salvation have given Satan the go-ahead knowing that Simon would be damned by his 'works' and lose his salvation, in hopes that he might repent & return to Him, maybe?
or would the LORD Mighty To Save have given the Evil One permission because He knows He hold Simon's soul under His wing, no matter how he might stumble?
knowledge isn't causation - and in this instance Satan had desired to sift Simon like wheat. what we are looking at in him is chaff being removed; threshing. the kernel of his faith endured, tho he stumbled and fell even three times.
what are we seeing here?
would the God Of Our Salvation have given Satan the go-ahead knowing that Simon would be damned by his 'works' and lose his salvation, in hopes that he might repent & return to Him, maybe?
or would the LORD Mighty To Save have given the Evil One permission because He knows He hold Simon's soul under His wing, no matter how he might stumble?
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ain't no new kind of story
one thing has been made clear by the last 6,500 pages --
that a person would seek righteousness and turn away from evil for any reason other than fearing damnation is to many people, something "beyond belief"
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one thing has been made clear by the last 6,500 pages --
that a person would seek righteousness and turn away from evil for any reason other than fearing damnation is to many people, something "beyond belief"
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E
ain't no new kind of story
one thing has been made clear by the last 6,500 pages --
that a person would seek righteousness and turn away from evil for any reason other than fearing damnation is to many people, something "beyond belief"
__________________________________________________________
one thing has been made clear by the last 6,500 pages --
that a person would seek righteousness and turn away from evil for any reason other than fearing damnation is to many people, something "beyond belief"
__________________________________________________________
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Yes. Your flippant attitude does indeed tip the scales. When you draw the ire of a real gentleman such as PennEd, all the while engaging in snarky conversations with others, the onus falls on you.
It’s fine by me; I’m the king of sarcasm, on screen and in person. I rejoice with with everyone who wants to rejoice, teach and learn from whoever wants to teach and learn, and I shake the dust off my feet when necessary. For me it’s just another day in the office. Personally, I’m glad you’re here and look forward to future conversations regarding God.
It’s fine by me; I’m the king of sarcasm, on screen and in person. I rejoice with with everyone who wants to rejoice, teach and learn from whoever wants to teach and learn, and I shake the dust off my feet when necessary. For me it’s just another day in the office. Personally, I’m glad you’re here and look forward to future conversations regarding God.
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Hey haaay! My "intelligent" brawny friend has unwittingly answered my question!! Bravo Phoneman!
He has agreed that hypocrisy IS indeed a presumptive sin. So our sinless perfectionist claims wants to slice and dice sin into neat little packages, and say that these sins over here are paid for, but those sins over there are not covered by the Blood of Christ.
So I am guessing he also believes that PETER has lost his Salvation. Ya know, the same Peter that traveled with Jesus, and wrote 1 and 2 Peter. Peter ABSOLUTELY committed the presumptive sin of hypocrisy, and therefore, according to Phoneman, has lost his Salvation for committing this presumptive sin. None other than Paul himself told Peter to his face that he was committing hypocrisy.
Galatians 2:11-13 New King James Version (NKJV)
No Return to the Law
11 Now when [a]Peter had come to Antioch, I [b]withstood him to his face, because he was to be blamed; 12 for before certain men came from James, he would eat with the Gentiles; but when they came, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing [c]those who were of the circumcision. 13 And the rest of the Jews also played the hypocrite with him, so that even Barnabas was carried away with their hypocrisy.
Goodnight Johnboy!
He has agreed that hypocrisy IS indeed a presumptive sin. So our sinless perfectionist claims wants to slice and dice sin into neat little packages, and say that these sins over here are paid for, but those sins over there are not covered by the Blood of Christ.
So I am guessing he also believes that PETER has lost his Salvation. Ya know, the same Peter that traveled with Jesus, and wrote 1 and 2 Peter. Peter ABSOLUTELY committed the presumptive sin of hypocrisy, and therefore, according to Phoneman, has lost his Salvation for committing this presumptive sin. None other than Paul himself told Peter to his face that he was committing hypocrisy.
Galatians 2:11-13 New King James Version (NKJV)
No Return to the Law
11 Now when [a]Peter had come to Antioch, I [b]withstood him to his face, because he was to be blamed; 12 for before certain men came from James, he would eat with the Gentiles; but when they came, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing [c]those who were of the circumcision. 13 And the rest of the Jews also played the hypocrite with him, so that even Barnabas was carried away with their hypocrisy.
Goodnight Johnboy!
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