Parables

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7seasrekeyed said:
we have the meanings of the parables now though, right?
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Yes. And the meanings have spiritual significance only for those who have been born of the Spirit and have the indwelling Holy Spirit. So the principle still applies. The natural man does not receive the things of the spirit, for they are foolishness unto him.
I mean some will always be truly seeking and some will always be frivolous and think it's enough, right?
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God will reveal the truth to those who sincerely seek the truth, but the primary truth which must be embraced is "Ye MUST be born again".

we do not all have the same experience in understanding and certainly not those whose journey with Christ has only begun
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And that is not really relevant, since those who are young in the faith will not have the same spiritual understanding as those who are more mature.
we don't live 2000 + years ago so I don't know what your point is regarding the verse you quoted
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Spiritual truths do not change over time. What was applicable to the naysayers when Christ was on earth is equally applicable to the naysayers today. So God hid spiritual truths from the enemies of Christ in 30 AD and He still does the very same thing today. That is why people like the Jehovah's Witnesses cannot understand Gospel truths. They rejected the deity of Christ.
parables? not so much. the Holy Spirit does not speak to us in parables and the scripture indicates that we have been spoken to plainly...see Hebrews
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Correct. One cannot indiscriminately apply the term "parable" to any and every thing recorded in Scripture. And the narrative of the Rich Man and Lazarus is definitely NOT a parable. It is an unveiling of what happens in the afterlife.
 
Jesus used to explain the parables and even if He didn't, one could still understand from the context of His entire speech. No one today has a problem when it comes to the meaning of the parables even non believers can easily get their meaning when they read- so how could we come to the conclusion that they are used to hide God's truth?

Many have quoted what Jesus said concerning what Isaiah prophesied but they forget that Isaiah prophesied about the entirety of Jesus' speech and actions which are recorded in scriptures not the parables within the scriptures.
Even if Jesus did not speak in parables, the said men would still not understand because there are two ways to understanding salvation: seeing Jesus' (Flesh) actions or hearing his words - that's why Jesus' flesh and words are both called bread of life.

John 6:35Jesus answered, “I am the bread of life. Whoevercomes to Me will never hunger, and whoeverbelieves in Me will never thirst.,..... 55For My flesh is real food, and My blood isreal drink. 56Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood remains in Me, and I in him.

Matt 4:4Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.

John 14:10Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me? The words I say to you, I do not speak on My own. Instead, it is the Father dwelling in Me,performing His works. 11Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me—or at least believe on account of the works themselves.

The parables and indeed the words from Jesus (scriptures) were to be HEARD ONLY, what about the part for seeing?!! Isaiah and Jesus both say seeing they might see but not perceiving- were they really talking about parables? NOOO, they were talking about something bigger than the parables.

 
7seasrekeyed said:
uh

we have the meanings of the parables now though, right? I mean some will always be truly seeking and some will always be frivolous and think it's enough, right?

with me so far?

we do not all have the same experience in understanding and certainly not those whose journey with Christ has only begun

we don't live 2000 + years ago so I don't know what your point is regarding the verse you quoted

probably false teachers and prophets and those who follow them with those over stated itching ears would be the phrase you are thinking of

parables? not so much. the Holy Spirit does not speak to us in parables and the scripture indicates that we have been spoken to plainly...see Hebrews
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Sometimes, after Jesus told a parable He would say, "He that has an ear let him hear what the Spirit is saying." This is the understanding being given to us by the Spirit.
 
Nehemiah6;3530467]Yes. And the meanings have spiritual significance only for those who have been born of the Spirit and have the indwelling Holy Spirit. So the principle still applies. The natural man does not receive the things of the spirit, for they are foolishness unto him.

no it doesn't. if a person is born again and has the indwelling Spirit of God, then He will lead them into truth and that is by God's discretion. from what is apparently well documented in this forum, there are very sincere and godly people who do not agree so what you say cannot possibly be so. look, you have some very strong opinions on certain things and so do others here...I am not talking about obvious heresies or departures from a few thousand years of Christian agreement, so please do not pull the natural man here...it does not apply. as the Holy Spirit now seals and indwells the believer, that verse does not apply to believers anyway (although God knows many apply this way but they are wrong) it applies to those without the Spirit of God in which case, there is no appeal to that verse for the Christian who is seeking God

God will reveal the truth to those who sincerely seek the truth, but the primary truth which must be embraced is "Ye MUST be born again".


And that is not really relevant, since those who are young in the faith will not have the same spiritual understanding as those who are more mature.

and that is what I said ^^^^

Spiritual truths do not change over time. What was applicable to the naysayers when Christ was on earth is equally applicable to the naysayers today. So God hid spiritual truths from the enemies of Christ in 30 AD and He still does the very same thing today. That is why people like the Jehovah's Witnesses cannot understand Gospel truths. They rejected the deity of Christ.

uh...yet we have a far better understanding of Christ than the Apostles themselves had before He was crucified. God says if we seek Him with our whole heart we will find Him. and He says we should ask if we lack wisdom so parables do not apply in the sense in which Jesus used them because if you read further, you will see where He calls us 'friends' ... not everyone within hearing of Jesus' parables rejected Him...so there has to be more than simply stating people reject Christ so they do not understand

listen, I would expect that to go without saying! but again, how do you know God does not have some go through trials of error and disappointment so that they will come to His truth and be able to help those who are in error? you do not know the many ways God can, in His mercy, bring us to points beyond ourselves where we see our need and sometimes ESPECIALLY (do not take this personally here) when we think we have all the answers and everyone else is wrong (again, not meant to you personally)

Correct. One cannot indiscriminately apply the term "parable" to any and every thing recorded in Scripture. And the narrative of the Rich Man and Lazarus is definitely NOT a parable. It is an unveiling of what happens in the afterlife.

I don't think that was a parable either.
 
I am reading a book about the parables , not quite sure if i have read this correctly or not but once the pharisees accused Jesus of having a demon in Him , that was the last straw for Jesus because they had spoke against the Holy Spirit , up until that point , Jesus had remained willing to keep speaking to them plainly , but after that last remark , that was when He started talking in parables , but would then speak plainly to His disciples...

Like I said I am bringing this from the top of my head , I still have much to learn...xox...
 
"Matt. 13:12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance; but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath."

If you want to understand the Word of God, you have to read it. If you still don't understand the Word of God, you have to read it again. The problem is not the parables, it's how badly you want to understand them. So read it again, and again, and again. When the Father decides you're serious, he'll teach you.
 
Thank you for all your replies everyone! :) I will be messaging some of you with some more questions I have.
 
To use the unlearned to shame the learned. (A child can understand better than a Pharisee)
To give us physical examples to understand spiritual meanings.
To make us study and ‘dig’ for the precious ‘pearl’ (truth).
To filter out those who do not have ears to hear and eyes to see.
To make the context clear.
To give kids in Sunday school something to draw.
To jog our memory of things He said when we experience that situation.
To better focus our minds for learning (His ‘sermons’ are more entertaining/engaging then simply saying “be good.”)
To stand out from others’ teaching methods. It was said that He speaks with such authority and great wisdom.
 
Parables were not only in the NT but also in the OT case in point the book of Proverbs.
 
Jesus spoke in parables so that only he that has faith understands the mysteries of God.

Example: note the following insight Jesus gives concerning understanding.

Matthew 16:5 And when his disciples were come to the other side, they had forgotten to take bread.
6 Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.

Notice that Jesus waits until the apostles are thinking about bread for their bellies before he warns them about the dangerous leaven.

He did this to reveal why carnal minds fail
to understand his parables.

7 And they reasoned among themselves, saying, It is because we have taken no bread.

Carnal minded people reason based on their unbelief towards Jesus. For, the unbelieving walk by sight and not by faith.

8 Which when Jesus perceived, he said unto them, O ye of little faith, why reason ye among yourselves, because ye have brought no bread?

Jesus perceived their unbelief and pointed out that “little faith” is what prevents spiritual understanding.

Notice that unbelievers reason among themselves in support of their collective false doctrines that are set contrary to God’s word.

And the conclusions reached by unbelievers are profoundly ignorant and even quite stupid.

9 Do ye not yet understand, neither remember the five loaves of the five thousand, and how many baskets ye took up?
10 Neither the seven loaves of the four thousand, and how many baskets ye took up?

Jesus points out that the apostles had seen Jesus feed thousands without having brought bread to feed them with.

This reveals that when men walk in unbelief of Jesus they are blind spiritually and can’t reason spiritually.

11 How is it that ye do not understand that I spake it not to you concerning bread, that ye should beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees?

They failed to understand because they were walking in the flesh reasoning according to their bellies rather than according to God’s word.

This reveals that reasoning according to faith in God’s word is contrary to reasoning according to doubt.

I hear folks say they understand God’s word, but I find most Christians lack understanding, and few are corrected by God’s word.

Yet the unbelieving think they do understand.

They think that way because their eye isn’t single and so they reason two contrary ways and are in danger of mistaking the darkness of unbelief is enlightenment.

I find that Christians have difficulty understanding today because of having little faith in the written word of God.
Of course they have been taught in church to doubt the written word of God, and to instead reason like heathen scholars do.
 
You readers know that Satan and the unbelieving, war against truth.
And in warfare intelligence is gathered against one’s enemy.
Yet God predicts in plainly written speech what shall come to pass in due time according to his plan.

Yet, the enemies of God remain in the dark.

This shows how wise and knowledgeable God is, for God hides truth in plain sight for the spiritual man, but prevents the blind leaders of the blind from knowing what is going on.

An amazing thing to observe.

Here we are in the end of days and, alas, the churches also are in great darkness as to what the enemy of God is doing, and is going to do, and has no clue as to what the church should be doing, the how, and the why.

This sad state of the churches has occurred because of deep ignorance of what Satan has done to mislead saints, and how to correct the problem.
 
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Every false doctrine I know of is easily refuted by believing what God says. Yet there are at least five false doctrines widespread among the churches that are all designed to destroy the faith of the saints when open warfare becomes apparent to all.

Why will there be a falling away?
And what is it that many will fall away from?
 
He stated why.....because it is not given unto lost men to understand the truth concerning the kingdom and or the word of God which is spiritually discerned and or known.
 
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