Peter's Vision - Kill & Eat

[2ndTimothyGroup]

This means that there was a period of time between the resurrection of Jesus and the inclusion of Gentiles in Acts 10 that is estimated to be around 7-15 years during which all Christians were Torah observant Jews.

Thank you for your kind message. As for above, I have noticed what you're talking about, which is that the early Christians were living a combination of the Law and the brand of Christianity that Paul was introduced and strongly taught.

One of the things that lends credit to your position, is your sense of maturity. I will listen to mature people all day long, but those who nit-pick . . . they're not here to participate, but discourage and disrupt.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

I've never given much thought to the specific instruction of "kill and eat" as it pertains to the Gentiles. Maybe something along the lines of devouring or feeling superior to those man might have deemed unclean? (Just spit-ballin' here.)

I've always paused and examined the parallel of comparing unclean animals to the Gentiles and how God's people were taught by man that they should consider them "unclean to associate with."

I hear you! I have read that set of passages so many times, but it wasn't until the other day that that phrase stuck out to me ("Kill and eat.") The entire Bible is one big metaphor, living analogy, and physical pattern for Spiritual principles, etc . . . so my eyes and ears are dialed in to that train of thought.

I love this Bible of ours. It is so unbelievable.

 

[Soyeong]

Thank you for your kind message. As for above, I have noticed what you're talking about, which is that the early Christians were living a combination of the Law and the brand of Christianity that Paul was introduced and strongly taught.

One of the things that lends credit to your position, is your sense of maturity. I will listen to mature people all day long, but those who nit-pick . . . they're not here to participate, but discourage and disrupt.

Thank you.

Paul spoke about multiple categories of law other than the Law of God, such as the law of sin and works of the law, so the problem is that people often don't bother to distinguish which law he was speaking about. For example, in Romans 7:21-8:2, Paul said that he delighted in obeying the Law of God and served with his mind, but contrasted that with the law of sin that held him captive and that he served with his flesh, and he contrasted the Law of the Spirit with the law of sin and death. People often assume that Romans 7:5-6 is speaking about the Law of God as if Paul delighted in stirring up sinful passions in order to bear fruit unto death and as if he delighted in being held captive to sin even though it is the law of sin that he described as holding him captive.

Likewise, in Romans 3:27, Paul contrasted a law of works with a law of faith, and in Romans 3:31 and Galatians 3:10-12, he contrasted a law that our faith upholds with works of the law that are not of faith. So while Paul spoke against the law of sin and works of the law, he never spoke against anyone obeying the Law of God.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Thank you.

Paul spoke about multiple categories of law other than the Law of God, such as the law of sin and works of the law, so the problem is that people often don't bother to distinguish which law he was speaking about. For example, in Romans 7:21-8:2, Paul said that he delighted in obeying the Law of God and served with his mind, but contrasted that with the law of sin that held him captive and that he served with his flesh, and he contrasted the Law of the Spirit with the law of sin and death. People often assume that Romans 7:5-6 is speaking about the Law of God as if Paul delighted in stirring up sinful passions in order to bear fruit unto death and as if he delighted in being held captive to sin even though it is the law of sin that he described as holding him captive.

Likewise, in Romans 3:27, Paul contrasted a law of works with a law of faith, and in Romans 3:31 and Galatians 3:10-12, he contrasted a law that our faith upholds with works of the law that are not of faith. So while Paul spoke against the law of sin and works of the law, he never spoke against anyone obeying the Law of God.

Well well. Someone has studied the different laws. In my opinion, if a person has not processed the entire Bible in to identify the various Laws, their understanding of the Saving Plan of Jesus Christ will be hindered, especially when the person they're witnessing to starts asking questions.

One of the reasons why I extended the Jewish Red Carpet to you is because of the traditional knowledge that comes with being one of the Blessed. My point is this: If a Christian isn't prepared to "share," or shall I say, explain the Gospel of Christ to a Blessed Jew, then they aren't prepared to share it with anyone. Why? Because the Blessed Jew will have hard knowledge about principles and practices, that is guaranteed to lead to one thing: questions, but lots of them. And it won't take long for them to realize that "you" don't know what "you're" talking about, and the conversation comes to a swift end. And the then "said Christian" walks away with its tail between its legs, not wanting to ever do that again.

If we are going to explain the Gospel Saving Plan of Jesus Christ, it is vital that we understand the complete Story of God, so that when someone strolls up in their carriage, and the Lord tells us to go over and ask this eunuch guy if he understands what he's reading . . . this is written for us today, that we'd better be prepared to step right in like Philip and get the job done. My goodness. We are Christians, and very few in any given church will even have a Bible in their hands. And then there's the sermon . . . they're like mud-puddles, shallow and unclear. Pointless, if not complete, and total rubbish. These things . . . is this why Christians have no presence in the world? Everyone knows who the guys are on the bikes, helmets, and white short-sleeved shirts, but where are the Christians? Crickets. Absolute crickets.

Thanks . . . I had some steam that needed to be steeped off.

Our Bible is so unbelievable.

 

[Moses_Young]

No. My biblical argument is that as a strict Jew Peter was doing exactly what he should have done under the circumstances. And you would have done the same. I also showed you that Christ actually told the apostles to avoid the Gentiles when going out to preach the Gospel. However, Peter did change his attitude afterwards and said that after Pentecost God put no difference between Jews and Gentiles.

And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe. And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? (Acts 15:7-10).

Bringing up the KKK is irrelevant, since it is God who told the Jews to be separate from the Gentiles.

It's not, because racism has a specific meaning, and Peter's actions fit the definition of racism. That his racism was based on scripture or that you or I might have done the same is beside the matter.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

Thanks for sharing and making the association between me and Satan. Have a Blessed day!

What a curious statement.

Neither of us were consulted when the Spirit decided to make his weakness part of (wait for it) The. Bible. It could have been worse: he could have had a man killed so he could marry the man’s wife.

He did repent and of course we love Peter. But there was an aftermath to Antioch, Barnabas and John Mark split with Paul. And those Pharisees who rose up at the Jerusalem conference are the ones [most probably] who followed Paul around everywhere teaching the law.

Heaven help us the church is STILL teaching the law today or half grace and half law which is just as bad.

This was no small matter.

And Peter in his old age confessed that there were many things Paul wrote which he found hard to be understood.

You're all being so self-righteous, that you don't even see that what you're doing - still holding his repented sin over his head like he hadn't repented over it at all is what Satan does.

The way I see Peter is that he, like all of us, was imperfect. I truly believe God made his life open for all of us to see so that we can see God's power at work in him transform him into godly Christlikeness. This should be encouragement for all of us that if God can change Peter, God can change us as well.

As it is with you pointing out his repented sin like he hasn't at all, I just think you're doing this to make yourself look better to other people reading your posts. That's a pretty cheap way to exalt yourselves. Why not just point out the good work God had wrought in Peter and wait for God to exalt you instead?


🥙

 

[Rosemaryx]

Hey there!

Oh, that's right! I forgot that you had bought one of those Bibles. Have you found it helpful to learn the Bible in an actual storyline format? I am about two months away from listening to and reading the entire Bible again. This time . . . oh my goodness. I can't believe what I learned this last pass through the Scriptures!

Kind of , but this is why I need to re-read it...

 

[Rosemaryx]

The way I see Peter is that he, like all of us, was imperfect. I truly believe God made his life open for all of us to see so that we can see God's power at work in him transform him into godly Christlikeness. This should be encouragement for all of us that if God can change Peter, God can change us as well.

Amen to that...

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I'm sorry. It's probably me, as I am swamped, but I'm not understanding what you're referring to.

Alright

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I've never given much thought to the specific instruction of "kill and eat" as it pertains to the Gentiles. Maybe something along the lines of devouring or feeling superior to those man might have deemed unclean? (Just spit-ballin' here.)

I've always paused and examined the parallel of comparing unclean animals to the Gentiles and how God's people were taught by man that they should consider them "unclean to associate with."

The law of Moses taught them that gentiles we’re unclean

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

You're all being so self-righteous, that you don't even see that what you're doing - still holding his repented sin over his head like he hadn't repented over it at all is what Satan does.

The way I see Peter is that he, like all of us, was imperfect. I truly believe God made his life open for all of us to see so that we can see God's power at work in him transform him into godly Christlikeness. This should be encouragement for all of us that if God can change Peter, God can change us as well.

As it is with you pointing out his repented sin like he hasn't at all, I just think you're doing this to make yourself look better to other people reading your posts. That's a pretty cheap way to exalt yourselves. Why not just point out the good work God had wrought in Peter and wait for God to exalt you instead?


🥙

Your extremely judgmental attitude is a very serious thing. Therefore, please tell this group by what authority you have been given to judge our hearts and thoughts regarding Peter. And when you're done fumbling your Spiritual bag, I will then lay $20,000 on the table to prove to you, through my writings, what I really believe about Peter . . . and that you are a false prophet who is incapable to properly judging hearts and minds . . . at all.

Does your sense of knowing everything give you the inner strength to lay $20,000 on the table and read my thoughts on Peter? How about $40,000? How about $80,000? Are you willing to put your money where your foul mouth is? Let me guess . . . this all makes you laugh, doesn't it? And if it does, we know, precisely, who your Father is.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Kind of , but this is why I need to re-read it...

Yes, re-read! I've lost count of how many times I've read through the entire Bible in this way, but this last time was incredibly revealing. In this last year, I don't believe I've ever learned more in a fiscal year!

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

The law of Moses taught them that gentiles we’re unclean

Where? I've just written an article that God had always allowed Jews to enter into relationships with Gentiles, but not the abominations from the Seven Nations. If you could show me that Scripture, wow, I'll start correcting my writings. The last thing that I want it to believe something that isn't true.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

Your extremely judgmental attitude is a very serious thing. Therefore, please tell this group by what authority you have been given to judge our hearts and thoughts regarding Peter. And when you're done fumbling your Spiritual bag, I will then lay $20,000 on the table to prove to you, through my writings, what I really believe about Peter . . . and that you are a false prophet who is incapable to properly judging hearts and minds . . . at all.

Does your sense of knowing everything give you the inner strength to lay $20,000 on the table and read my thoughts on Peter? How about $40,000? How about $80,000? Are you willing to put your money where your foul mouth is? Let me guess . . . this all makes you laugh, doesn't it? And if it does, we know, precisely, who your Father is.

Really, you make bets? That's not from God either, lol!

I'm not at all moved by your accusations. You don't seem to get it that bringing up repented sins of other brothers/sisters in Christ is something Satan does - which was what you were doing.

This is why Satan is called the accuser:

Revelation 12:10 Then I heard a loud voice in heaven say:

“Now have come the salvation and the power
and the kingdom of our God,
and the authority of his Messiah.
For the accuser of our brothers and sisters,
who accuses them before our God day and night,
has been hurled down.

If you don't realize this, Peter is actually alive and he's your own brother in Christ. Forever is also a very, very long time. We will all eventually get to know each other over this very, very long time. That means you WILL eventually meet him face to face sooner or later. And he'll know that you kept bringing up his repented sin to strangers on an internet forum to make yourself look good and not bringing up the fact that he repented of it. What are you going to say to him then?

The point is that we have to be mindful of how we treat and present our brothers and sisters in Christ - even those who have already long gone home to the Lord, who especially CAN'T defend themselves about their pasts.

-=<(*)>=-​

PS: If there are any Christians out there who are being oppressed by Satan bringing up your past even though you've repented, there's a really good article that may help you overcome Satan's tactic:

Spiritual Warfare: When Satan Wants You to Re-Live Your Past​

It shows you why Satan does that (to take your eyes off God and keep you from growing and moving on in Christ). And it also will point you back to how God really positively sees you and the good hopes the Lord has for you.

Here is another article I like:

In what way is Satan the accuser?​

This one is great as well because it is full of Bible verses to encourage and build you up when Satan the accuser tries to attack you.


🏄🏻‍♀️

 

[Aaron56]

You're all being so self-righteous, that you don't even see that what you're doing - still holding his repented sin over his head like he hadn't repented over it at all is what Satan does.

The way I see Peter is that he, like all of us, was imperfect. I truly believe God made his life open for all of us to see so that we can see God's power at work in him transform him into godly Christlikeness. This should be encouragement for all of us that if God can change Peter, God can change us as well.

As it is with you pointing out his repented sin like he hasn't at all, I just think you're doing this to make yourself look better to other people reading your posts. That's a pretty cheap way to exalt yourselves. Why not just point out the good work God had wrought in Peter and wait for God to exalt you instead?


🥙

Jerk Rule: everybody knows at least two jerks. If you know three or more it’s probably you.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Really, you make bets? That's not from God either, lol!

I'm not at all moved by your accusations. You don't seem to get it that bringing up repented sins of other brothers/sisters in Christ is something Satan does - which was what you were doing.

This is why Satan is called the accuser:

Revelation 12:10 Then I heard a loud voice in heaven say:

“Now have come the salvation and the power
and the kingdom of our God,
and the authority of his Messiah.
For the accuser of our brothers and sisters,
who accuses them before our God day and night,
has been hurled down.

If you don't realize this, Peter is actually alive and he's your own brother in Christ. Forever is also a very, very long time. We will all eventually get to know each other over this very, very long time. That means you WILL eventually meet him face to face sooner or later. And he'll know that you kept bringing up his repented sin to strangers on an internet forum to make yourself look good and not bringing up the fact that he repented of it. What are you going to say to him then?

The point is that we have to be mindful of how we treat and present our brothers and sisters in Christ - even those who have already long gone home to the Lord, who especially CAN'T defend themselves about their pasts.

-=<(*)>=-​

PS: If there are any Christians out there who are being oppressed by Satan bringing up your past even though you've repented, there's a really good article that may help you overcome Satan's tactic:

Spiritual Warfare: When Satan Wants You to Re-Live Your Past​

It shows you why Satan does that (to take your eyes off God and keep you from growing and moving on in Christ). And it also will point you back to how God really positively sees you and the good hopes the Lord has for you.

Here is another article I like:

In what way is Satan the accuser?​

This one is great as well because it is full of Bible verses to encourage and build you up when Satan the accuser tries to attack you.


🏄🏻‍♀️

I don't engage with people like yourself. If you would like to demonstrate maturity and self-control, you're welcome to be a part of this thread. If not, please depart.

 

[Stan_the_Man]

Where? I've just written an article that God had always allowed Jews to enter into relationships with Gentiles, but not the abominations from the Seven Nations. If you could show me that Scripture, wow, I'll start correcting my writings. The last thing that I want it to believe something that isn't true.

If God told the Jews to do things that would make them clean, and the gentiles are NOT doing those things, you can see how the Jews would think the gentiles are unclean right?

 

[Evmur]

You're all being so self-righteous, that you don't even see that what you're doing - still holding his repented sin over his head like he hadn't repented over it at all is what Satan does.

The way I see Peter is that he, like all of us, was imperfect. I truly believe God made his life open for all of us to see so that we can see God's power at work in him transform him into godly Christlikeness. This should be encouragement for all of us that if God can change Peter, God can change us as well.

As it is with you pointing out his repented sin like he hasn't at all, I just think you're doing this to make yourself look better to other people reading your posts. That's a pretty cheap way to exalt yourselves. Why not just point out the good work God had wrought in Peter and wait for God to exalt you instead?


🥙

nonsense, Peter is with his Lord in glory, more glory no doubt than I shall ever know. Peter is beautiful.

He would like for the church to learn from his mistakes. The church has not.

The upshot of the Jerusalem conference was that Pete, Jake and John gave Paul the right hand which means they were totally united.

The change of heart which happens when we are saved is easy for the Lord to do but changing the mind, not just opinions but the very way we think requires a longer more difficult exercise.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

Jerk Rule: everybody knows at least two jerks. If you know three or more it’s probably you.

It's not my problem that you won't repent and continue to hold Peter's repented sin over him. You act like you'll never meet him and not have to give account for how you put him in a bad light just so you can virtue signal.


🏄🏻‍♀️

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

nonsense, Peter is with his Lord in glory, more glory no doubt than I shall ever know. Peter is beautiful.

He would like for the church to learn from his mistakes. The church has not.

The upshot of the Jerusalem conference was that Pete, Jake and John gave Paul the right hand which means they were totally united.

The change of heart which happens when we are saved is easy for the Lord to do but changing the mind, not just opinions but the very way we think requires a longer more difficult exercise.

Right, so why couldn't you have emphasized that before? Despite Peter's faults, I really loved that he totally submitted to the Lord and let the Holy Spirit work in him. His growth and how God changed him gave me so much hope when I was learning how to submit to God. Because before that, I was struggling to obey God, not having yet learned to submit to the Holy Spirit. So I'm reading about Peter in the Bible and was greatly encouraged and comforted that Peter did change into wonderful Christlikeness. His story helped me not to give up, but to keep learning from God. Peter is my big brother in Christ and I love that he set an example for us!


🏄🏻‍♀️