predestinated to be saved

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Oct 14, 2013
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God do soften people hearts

Ezra 7:27-28 NKJV

Blessed be the LORD God of our fathers, who has put such a thing as this in the king's heart, to beautify the house of the LORD which is in Jerusalem, and has extended mercy to me before the king and his counselors, and before all the king's mighty princes.



 
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GreenNnice

Guest
Romans 9
[SUP]11 [/SUP](For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;) [SUP]12 [/SUP]It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.


Not of works but of God that Calleth its plain and simple
What I say is not works , not one bit, it's 'choice.' Choosing Him is work, this is true, but, is it 'works,' you ask? No, not at all. It's faith in Him, pure and simple, that's what we MUST have to both accept Christ and also to increase our understanding and our knowledge of Him in our lives working, isisD :)

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And, what's that verse there followed by in a host of verses in the VERY NEXT Romans 10 chapter....... ?
God elects us, by the way, those who decide to be a part of His 'office' are saved. :)

Don't over-complicate things, milady, His ways for us are so simple to have Him, not just some have, but ALL have, who so choose to believe in Him, whoever, whosoever believes IS saved; just look at the Truth, it's soo easy to see that 'The Elect' are those 'few' who chooose to follow Him. "...you follow Me.' John 21:22 :)

You're stuck in Calvinistic thought, God does not play favorites when it comes to people's salvation, ALL can come to Him, they are ALL drawn, not all accept Him--and, God knows this will happen, to His tearing chagrin-- but, yeah, you're a TULIP or similar, I can tell, and, that's OK, we're BOTH going to same place.

But, leading others to BELIEVE that they MAY or MAY NOT be saved by His election of them to be with Him after they die is a false teaching that I would not want to be doing :( Funny, too, you have this verse and in Romans ONE chapter later it says:

Romans 10

Moses writes this about the righteousness that is by the law: “The person who does these things will live by them.”[SUP]a[/SUP] 6But the righteousness that is by faith says: “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’ ”[SUP]b[/SUP] (that is, to bring Christ down) 7“or ‘Who will descend into the deep?’ ”[SUP]c[/SUP] (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). 8But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,”[SUP]d[/SUP] that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim: 9If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved. 11As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.”[SUP]e[/SUP] 12For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, 13for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.
Don't play God. Only He knows. And, we DO say that we KNOW who WILL ascend to heaven when we say that ONLY those who are pre-destined to go to heaven go to heaven. EVERY ONE has a choice to go to heaven :) Don't say they don't. Don't do it, isisD :(

The Lord leads :)
 
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Oct 14, 2013
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What I say is not works , not one bit, it's 'choice.' Choosing Him is work, this is true, but, is it 'works,' you ask? No, not at all. It's faith in Him, pure and simple, that's what we MUST have to both accept Christ and also to increase our understanding and our knowledge of Him in our lives working, isisD :)

------------------
And, what's that verse there followed by in a host of verses in the VERY NEXT Romans 10 chapter....... ?
God elects us, by the way, those who decide to be a part of His 'office' are saved. :)

Don't over-complicate things, milady, His ways for us are so simple to have Him, not just some have, but ALL have, who so choose to believe in Him, whoever, whosoever believes IS saved; just look at the Truth, it's soo easy to see that 'The Elect' are those 'few' who chooose to follow Him. "...you follow Me.' John 21:22 :)

You're stuck in Calvinistic thought, God does not play favorites when it comes to people's salvation, ALL can come to Him, they are ALL drawn, not all accept Him--and, God knows this will happen, to His tearing chagrin-- but, yeah, you're a TULIP or similar, I can tell, and, that's OK, we're BOTH going to same place.

But, leading others to BELIEVE that they MAY or MAY NOT be saved by His election of them to be with Him after they die is a false teaching that I would not want to be doing :( Funny, too, you have this verse and in Romans ONE chapter later it says:

Romans 10

Moses writes this about the righteousness that is by the law: “The person who does these things will live by them.”[SUP]a[/SUP] 6But the righteousness that is by faith says: “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’ ”[SUP]b[/SUP] (that is, to bring Christ down) 7“or ‘Who will descend into the deep?’ ”[SUP]c[/SUP] (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). 8But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,”[SUP]d[/SUP] that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim: 9If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved. 11As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.”[SUP]e[/SUP] 12For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, 13for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.

Don't play God. Only He knows. And, we DO say that we KNOW who WILL ascend to heaven when we say that ONLY those who are pre-destined to go to heaven go to heaven. Don't say it. Don't do it, isisD :)


[h=1]Exodus 10[/h]

[SUP]16 [/SUP]Then Pharaoh called for Moses and Aaron in haste; and he said, I have sinned against the Lord your God, and against you.

[SUP]17 [/SUP]Now therefore forgive, I pray thee, my sin only this once, and intreat the Lord your God, that he may take away from me this death only.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]And he went out from Pharaoh, and intreated the Lord.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]And the Lord turned a mighty strong west wind, which took away the locusts, and cast them into the Red sea; there remained not one locust in all the coasts of Egypt.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]But the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart, so that he would not let the children of Israel go
 
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xodus 10

King James Version (KJV)

10 And the Lord said unto Moses, Go in unto Pharaoh: for I have hardened his heart, and the heart of his servants, that I might shew these my signs before him:

[SUP]2 [/SUP]And that thou mayest tell in the ears of thy son, and of thy son's son, what things I have wrought in Egypt, and my signs which I have done among them; that ye may know how that I am the Lord.

[SUP]3 [/SUP]And Moses and Aaron came in unto Pharaoh, and said unto him, Thus saith the Lord God of the Hebrews, How long wilt thou refuse to humble thyself before me? let my people go, that they may serve me.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Else, if thou refuse to let my people go, be
 
G

GreenNnice

Guest
God do soften people hearts

Ezra 7:27-28 NKJV

Blessed be the LORD God of our fathers, who has put such a thing as this in the king's heart, to beautify the house of the LORD which is in Jerusalem, and has extended mercy to me before the king and his counselors, and before all the king's mighty princes.



[SUP]20 [/SUP]But the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart, so that he would not let the children of Israel go.
This quote you use, IsisD,


See the nature of the word, 'hardened,' it's speaking of a metamorphosis having ALREADY happened.
God makes hardER people's hearts too. Notice, I didn't say God MAKES people's hearts HARD. That IS that person's OWN doing. God just HARDENS that person's heart that is NOT accepting Him. And, God will even make that person's heart harder and harder to get His will accomplished when they just won't believe . Think this: Thy will be done. And, guess what. His will WILL be done, isisD :)

That's right, HARDENED an ALREADY HARD HEART that Pharoah NEVER wanted to become flesh, if you want to use Ezekiel, Pharoah's heart REMAINED ALL HIS LIFE, by his own volition, HARD.
 
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GreenNnice

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Do you understand, isisD?

God HARDENED Pharoah's HARD heart.


See, Scripture does not say that God made Pharoah's heart HARD. No. NOwhere. But it does say that God hardened Pharoah;s heart. Logical thought is that Pharoah's heart was HARD before God hardened it .
 
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[SUP]
John 6

44 [/SUP]No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
 
Oct 14, 2013
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Do you understand, isisD?

God HARDENED Pharoah's HARD heart.


See, Scripture does not say that God made Pharoah's heart HARD. No. NOwhere. But it does say that God hardened Pharoah;s heart. Logical thought is that Pharoah's heart was HARD before God hardened it .
Deuteronomy 2:30 KJV

But Sihon king of Heshbon would not let us pass by him: for the LORD thy God hardened his spirit, and made his heart obstinate, that he might deliver him into thy hand, as appeareth this day.
 
G

GreenNnice

Guest
Deuteronomy 2:30 KJV

But Sihon king of Heshbon would not let us pass by him: for the LORD thy God hardened his spirit, and made his heart obstinate, that he might deliver him into thy hand, as appeareth this day.
That's RIGHT !

God HARDENED his spirt. Sihon's HEART was already HARD, because that was Sihon's OWN choice. God WANTED to unharden it, just like Pharoah, but, Pharoah would not believe, would not obey God who kept saying ," LET MY PEOPLE GO!"


Scripture is clear too, here, and, other places, God then will bring the wicked to their OWN destruction because of those choices they HAVE made :(
 
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GreenNnice

Guest
YOU have to WANT a new heart, isisD, you have to be hopelessly devoted to God, or, the perfect way to put it is: hope-FULLY devoted to God :) THEN, God will act in a great way and we will become with a heart of flesh that is no longer stone, we will receive His Spirit and become holy (different), WANTING to serve Him, do His will :)

God INITIATES the action of saving us, but, He SEES OUR HEARTS (1 Sam. 16:7) , KNOWS ALL; He most certainly lets us REACT to His CALL :)

Not like THIS guy, who is DEVOTED to his own evil deeds :( :

"And I will give them one heart, and put a new spirit within them. And I will take the heart of stone out of their flesh and give them a heart of flesh, 20that they may walk in My statutes and keep My ordinances and do them. Then they will be My people, and I shall be their God. 21"But as for those whose hearts go after their detestable things and abominations, I will bring their conduct down on their heads," declares the Lord GOD
 
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GreenNnice

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I guess no one is predestinated?

Eph 1:5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Why am I falling into this labrynth?
Everyone is predestinated. Some, we are told courtesy of the Pharoah and Moses story, have hard hearts. I mean, 12 plagues that Pharoah went through and finally he let's the Israelites go ! But, then Pharoah sets off chasing them !!!

Some are like Pharoah, unfortunately :( They have hope if they would choose Christ, and, God gives them many opportunities to become a part of 'the few.' :)