Question for OSAS believers...

[dcontroversal]

Now if a square (without stopping being a square) were round would it stop being a square? And if the sky were blue and stayed blue, but became red (while staying blue), would it be yellow?
And if I always tell the truth, yet always lie, would I be telling the truth?

I affirm an axiom, self-evident truth: A thing cannot be so & not so at the same time.

Now if you want to know about Once Saved, Saved (the rocket science theory that if a man is saved then he is saved [duh!]), stop postulating this & that, & consider the plain statements by the Lord:

Ps 34
YHWH redeems the soul of his servants;
And none of them who take refuge in him shall be condemned.

Ps 52
But as for me, I am like a green olive-tree in the house of God:
I trust in the lovingkindness of God for ever and ever.
I will give thee thanks for ever, because thou hast done it;

1 Thes 5 end:
"And the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved entire, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. Faithful is He Who calls you, Who will also do it.

Col 3
If then ye were raised together with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated on the right hand of God. Set your mind on the things that are above, not on the things that are upon the earth. For ye died, and your life is hid with Christ in God. When Christ, who is our life, shall be manifested, then shall ye also with him be manifested in glory.

2 Thes 2:16
Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace, comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word.
End of Rom 8:
And we know that to them that love God all things work together for good, even to them that are called according to his purpose. For whom
he foreknew,
he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: and whom
he foreordained, them
he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom
he justified, them
he also glorified.

31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? 3He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not also with him freely give us all things? Who shall lay anything to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth; who is he that condemneth? It is Christ Jesus that died, yea rather, that was raised from the dead, who is at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or anguish, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? Even as it is written,
For thy sake we are killed all the day long;
We were accounted as sheep for the slaughter.

Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

< 1 Pet 1
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

THE OVERCOMER
Revelation 3:5
The one who overcomes will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father… 1 John 5:4-5 For whatsoever is begotten of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. And who is he who overcomes the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

. . . I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. He that overcometh shall inherit these things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. But for the fearful, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and fornicators, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, their part shall be in the lake that burneth with fire and brimstone; which is the second death.

In II Thess. 3:3 “But the Lord is faithful, who shall establish you, and guard you from the evil one.”

In II Tim. 1:12 he sounds a note of rejoicing: “For I know Him whom I have believed, and I am persuaded that He is able to guard that which I have committed unto Him against that day.”
< 2 Tim 4:18
The Lord will deliver me from every evil work, and will save me unto his heavenly kingdom;


2 Tim 1:8-9
… God; who saved us, and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before times eternal,

2 thes 2:16-17 Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace, comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word.
Rm 6:23b
the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

John 10:27-29
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.

John 6:37
All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.

John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
2 Corinthians 1:22
And who has also put his seal on us and given us his Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.
Romans 11:29
For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.

Philippians 1:6
And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.

1 John 5:10-13
Whoever believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself. Whoever does not believe God has made him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has borne concerning his Son. And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.

Romans 11:6
But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works; otherwise grace would no longer be grace.

Romans 8:34
Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died—more than that, who was raised—who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us.

Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Philippians 3:20-21
But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself.

Ps 138
"thy right hand will save me.
YHWH will perfect that which concerns me:"
Ephesians 1:13
In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,

For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.
1 John 5:13
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
Philippians 1:6
And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.

1 John 5:10-13
Whoever believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself. Whoever does not believe God has made him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has borne concerning his Son. And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.

1 John 2:19
They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us.
John 6:40
For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in
For this is the will of my Father, that every one that beholdeth the Son, and believeth on him, should have eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
Hebrews 10:14
For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified.

John 4:14
But whoever drinks of the water that I will give him will never be thirsty again. The water that I will give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life.
John 6:47
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life.
John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.
John 3:18
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
Psalm 34:22
The Lord redeems the life of his servants; none of those who take refuge in him will be condemned.
Jude 1:24
Now to him who is able to keep you from stumbling and to present you blameless before the presence of his glory with great joy,
1 Peter 1:3-5
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, 5 who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
Colossians 1:13
He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son,
Romans 8:32
He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things?
Romans 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus
John 1:12
But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,
Revelation 3:5
The one who overcomes will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father… 1 John 5:4-5 For whatsoever is begotten of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. And who is he who overcomes the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

Hebrews 9:15
Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant.

Ephesians 1:11
In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,

< ps 138
thy right hand will save me.
Jehovah will perfect that which concerns me:
Thy lovingkindness, O Jehovah, endureth forever;

Heb 11:19ff

And these all, having had witness borne to them through their faith, received not the promise, God having provided some better thing concerning us, that apart from us they should not be made perfect. Therefore let us also, seeing we are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, looking unto Jesus the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross,


looking unto Jesus the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross,


Isaiah 26:12
Jehovah, thou wilt ordain peace for us; for thou hast also wrought all our works for us.

Eph 2
but God, being rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace have ye been saved), and raised us up with him, and made us to sit with him in the heavenly places, in Christ Jesus: that in the ages to come he might show the exceeding riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus: for by grace have ye been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not of works, that no man should glory. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.

Philip 1:6
And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.

Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins.

Amen for sure and people still erroneously believe that they can loose their salvation by taking a few scriptures out of context
and misapplying them...even though every verse you quoted totally contradicts the ability to loose salvation.....

 

[Kerry]

I don't want to go into Hermeneutics and essential teachings. I think a person can lose their salvation. Take a man that loves God but His wife doe's not and she is threatening to leave him and take their three children and he blows a gasket and kills the children and himself. Is He saved? I know the answer. He was never saved to begin with, he just thought he was.

Well do you think your saved?

 

[dcontroversal]

I don't want to go into Hermeneutics and essential teachings. I think a person can lose their salvation. Take a man that loves God but His wife doe's not and she is threatening to leave him and take their three children and he blows a gasket and kills the children and himself. Is He saved? I know the answer. He was never saved to begin with, he just thought he was.

Well do you think your saved?

So did David loose his salvation when he Killed Uriah or was he forgiven because someone else took his place under the death penalty?

 

[Kerry]

So did David loose his salvation when he Killed Uriah or was he forgiven because someone else took his place under the death penalty?

No David repented and was given as example of leaders that fail as we all do. But the man that blew a gasket and killed his children and wife is he still saved, although He loved God.

 

[elf3]

Does God love you enough to keep you safe in His hands once you truly give your life to Him or not?

 

[royalscot]

I read the first few pages and then skipped ahead.. so forgive me if this has already been asked and answered.. How many of you believe you can accept the mark of the beast and still go to heaven? Can I? could I verbally renounce God, knowing that I am saved for all of eternity?

define what the mark of the beast is.
given revelations is a dream/vision (having a spiritual or different meaning to what is wrote. )

how can it be understood ,just by reading it.

yet some, quote this book as read as wrote.

 

[royalscot]

if, you get your definition to what sin is through the law given to moses,

after 70 ad who can follow the full law without a temple of stone.

so are you trying to follow this law in part(ie not fully )whats the point of following in part.

how many apostles were still alive.

acts 15 , what law was given to a gentile.

how can sin that comes from this law, hold a gentile believer that was never given this law.

2 Corinthians 3: Ministers of a New Covenant
1 Are we beginning to commend ourselves again? Or do we need, as some, letters of commendation to you or from you?2 You are our letter, written in our hearts, known and read by all men;3 being manifested that you are a letter of Christ, cared for by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.
4 Such confidence we have through Christ toward God.5 Not that we are adequate in ourselves to consider anything as coming from ourselves, but our adequacy is from God,6 who also made us adequate as servants of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
7 But if the ministry of death, in letters engraved on stones, came with glory, so that the sons of Israel could not look intently at the face of Moses because of the glory of his face, fading as it was,8 how will the ministry of the Spirit fail to be even more with glory?9 For if the ministry of condemnation has glory, much more does the ministry of righteousness abound in glory.10 For indeed what had glory, in this case has no glory because of the glory that surpasses it.11 For if that which fades away was with glory, much more that which remains is in glory.
12 Therefore having such a hope, we use great boldness in our speech,13 and are not like Moses, who used to put a veil over his face so that the sons of Israel would not look intently at the end of what was fading away.14 But their minds were hardened; for until this very day at the reading of the old covenant the same veil remains unlifted, because it is removed in Christ.15 But to this day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their heart;16 but whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit.

 

[Atwood]

Now if a man has the ability to trust Christ and does so and thus receives a new birth, becoming a child of God, does He have the ability to be unborn again? Can the man chose not to have had a new birth?

How about your physical birth. Now if your parents have the will to bring you forth as their child and they do so & your birth certificate is duly signed & sealed (long form in Hawaii), can your parents by an act of will cause you to have never been born? Can they unbirth you?

Just because you can do something, does not mean you can undo it. Try unscrambling an egg.

scripture says different....

No it does not & your Heb passage does not say that.
Heb says the gifts & calling of the Lord are irrevocable/without repentance

Hebrews 3:12-13King James Version (KJV)

[SUP]12 [/SUP]Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.

Heb 3:12 does not mention the new birth (word not there), nor does it speak of ceasing to be born again, nor ceasing to be a child of God. If you have a son, he may depart from you, but he is never unborn from you; he will always be your son, & you cannot undo the relationship.

[SUP]13 [/SUP]But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.[/QUOTE]

Your son may indeed be hardened through sin (as hearts may be hardened vs the truth that Christ gives eternal life & the recipient never perishes). But if your son should become hardened through sin, he will still be your son; he cannot become unborn.

But as to departing from God, those who are saved do not depart, and 1 John 2 says; anyone who departs from the Body of Christ shows he was never a child of God to begin with and never part of the body. He never had the things that pertain to salvation, as Heb 6:9 tells us.

Apostasy happens, but apostasy just shows who was a pretender.

19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they all are not of us.


They went out from us = departure, apostasy.

but they were not of us; = not part of the Body of Christ ever.

for if they had been of us [in the Body],

they would have continued with us: [those who are once part of the Body of Christ abide there; they continue there; they do not depart]

but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they all are not of us.

Apostasy shows who was the faker. They were never "His people," for "His people" get saved from their sins by a Savior who performs salvation.

There are many pretend Christians, even persons who post here, persons who never trusted Christ as Savior. There are those who trust their works in self-righteous and will not take the role of the Publican, "God be merciful to me a sinner."

Now you who post here, but actually do not trust Christ with your destiny:
How long will you continue denying the Savior?
Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for
He shall save His people from their sins.

 

[Atwood]

I don't want to go into Hermeneutics and essential teachings. I think a person can lose their salvation. Take a man that loves God but His wife doe's not and she is threatening to leave him and take their three children and he blows a gasket and kills the children and himself. Is He saved? I know the answer. He was never saved to begin with, he just thought he was.

Well do you think your saved?

Kerry, the answer is to stop making up this or that scenario and just take God at His word.
"I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish."
Can't you just believe it?

As to David, you might consider him responsible for the death of
Uriah the Hittite &
David's child by Bathsheba;
also of the rape of his daughter Tamar by her brother Amnon,
Amnon's death by Absalom,
Absalom's death hanging in a tree, heart jabbed by Joab the jabber,
Adonijah's rebellion & Solomon killing Adonijah,
Shimei's execution by Solomon (though David had promised Shimei, "Thou shalt not die").
21 But Abishai the son of Zeruiah answered and said, Shall not Shimei be put to death for this, because he cursed Jehovah’s anointed? 22 And David said, What have I to do with you, ye sons of Zeruiah, that ye should this day be adversaries unto me? shall there any man be put to death this day in Israel? for do not I know that I am this day king over Israel? 23 And the king said unto Shimei, Thou shalt not die. And the king sware unto him.


Moreover, David was ready to slaughter Nabal & all the men working (KJV, everyone who p---eth against the wall) for Nabal in a fit of rage when Nabal refused to share his festival food with David.

The flesh (Old Man) of a Christian is exceeding wicked and does not get better with age; it waxeth corrupt. Yet David was a man after God's own heart!

Nevertheless, David's Savior saved David from David's sin. And today David does not sin but is in perfect harmony with his Savior.

Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for
He shall save His people from their sins.

 

[ChosenbyHim]

Would you agree that if a Christian attempted to leave God as Jonah did, saying, "Good riddin's!" and never attempted to come back, but lived the rest of their life doing whatever evil came to their mind, that they would still be saved? And I'm not talking about if someone must not have been saved in the first place, but those that you agree we're actually saved. If, if, if this WERE the case, would they still be saved?

If a Christian becomes so carnal that he stops serving God altogether. And the Christian continues to get more worldly. That Christian will first be chastened by his Heavenly Father (See Hebrews 12:7-11). And if that Christian still does not repent of his rebellion and disobedience to God and His holy word. Then eventually I believe that God Almighty will at that point strike down that Christian and take him home early.

And while that Christian goes to Heaven since he CANNOT at all lose his salvation, still though, he is going to have a very, very tough time standing before his Lord at the Judgment Seat of Christ. For he will face the TERROR of the Lord, as mentioned by Paul the apostle in this following Scripture:


2 Corinthians 5:10-11 King James Version (KJV)

[SUP]10 [/SUP]For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

 

[BradC]

I don't want to go into Hermeneutics and essential teachings. I think a person can lose their salvation. Take a man that loves God but His wife doe's not and she is threatening to leave him and take their three children and he blows a gasket and kills the children and himself. Is He saved? I know the answer. He was never saved to begin with, he just thought he was.

Well do you think your saved?

Did Christ shed his blood and suffer death for the sins of this man? The sin is brutal, the act comes from actions comes from a depraved heart but it is not beyond what the heart can do even in the life of a child of God. This man would have to face the consequences of his reckless actions but to conclude that this man was unsaved because of his sin is not the criterion we use to judge what God has done in the heart of a sinner. If you want to judge this man and God's saving grace for sinners you can do that for we will all.be judged according to the word.

Why would God raise up a man like Paul when he had the kind of brutal history with the slaughter of Christians and persecuting the church? When we can answer that in the wisdom of God then we will understand in a much greater way that his ways are past finding out and that we have no basis to judge those ways.

 

[Atwood]

If a Christian becomes so carnal that he stops serving God altogether. And the Christian continues to get more worldly. That Christian will first be chastened by his Heavenly Father (See Hebrews 12:7-11). And if that Christian still does not repent of his rebellion and disobedience to God and His holy word. Then eventually I believe that God Almighty will at that point strike down that Christian and take him home early.

And while that Christian goes to Heaven since he CANNOT at all lose his salvation, still though, he is going to have a very, very tough time standing before his Lord at the Judgment Seat of Christ. For he will face the TERROR of the Lord, as mentioned by Paul the apostle in this following Scripture:


2 Corinthians 5:10-11 King James Version (KJV)

[SUP]10 [/SUP]For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

Good points, Chosen.

There is a sin unto death.
Some are saved by the instrumentality of satan destroying the body.

And some are saved, yet as through fire.
That fire which burns up the wood, hay, & stubble with loss of reward (it does not burn the Christian), possibly can be viewed as coming from the eyes of Christ as He examines & judges with eyes as a flame of fire (Rev 1).

Forr he that has entered into his rest hath himself also rested from his works, as God did from his. Let us therefore give diligence to enter into that rest, that no man fall after the same example of disobedience. For
the Word of God [Christ]
is living,
and active,
and sharper than any two-edged sword, and
piercing even to the dividing
of soul and spirit,
of both joints and marrow, and
quick to disern the thoughts and intents
of the heart.
And there is no creature that is not
manifest in his sight: but all things are
naked and laid open before the eyes of Him with whom we have to do.

He sees right through us, through & into our soul, spirit, & heart.

And his head and his hair were white as white wool, white as snow; and his
eyes were as a flame of fire;

 

[notuptome]

Ah, just like Fred Astaire. You dance a good dance around the answer. And I only bumped it up because I had a hankering to pull your chain.

Sorry.

I do not see any side stepping to avoid false assumptions and deal directly with the truth. Man is not greater than God and man is not greater than the devil. Man survives because he has an intellect to choose between life and death through choosing whom he will serve.

It seems to me to be intellectually dishonest to say that one who knows the difference between life and death would choose to forfeit life for death. For me everything changed the moment I received Christ as my Savior. I have never considered going back to death eternal. Why would I give up life with Christ to die eternally in the lake of fire?

Greater is He that is in you than he that is in the world.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[newbirth]

Now if a man has the ability to trust Christ and does so and thus receives a new birth, becoming a child of God, does He have the ability to be unborn again? Can the man chose not to have had a new birth?

How about your physical birth. Now if your parents have the will to bring you forth as their child and they do so & your birth certificate is duly signed & sealed (long form in Hawaii), can your parents by an act of will cause you to have never been born? Can they unbirth you?

Just because you can do something, does not mean you can undo it. Try unscrambling an egg.

the new birth is of the Spirit in Christ....if you disobey the laws o the natural world you will pay the penalty...same in the spiritual world...if you jump of a 20 story building thinking you can fly you will die....if you are drawn away from Christ and sin ...if you remain in sin you will die....

No it does not & your Heb passage does not say that.
Heb says the gifts & calling of the Lord are irrevocable/without repentance

Hebrews 3:12-13King James Version (KJV)

[SUP]12 [/SUP]Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.

Heb 3:12 does not mention the new birth (word not there), nor does it speak of ceasing to be born again, nor ceasing to be a child of God. If you have a son, he may depart from you, but he is never unborn from you; he will always be your son, & you cannot undo the relationship.

[SUP]13 [/SUP]But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.

this epistle is to believers ...brethren....the scripture does not talk about anything being revoked...it says if you depart...it is a clear indication that one can depart from the living God....and I cannot see someone who was never walking with God ...departing from God...

Your son may indeed be hardened through sin (as hearts may be hardened vs the truth that Christ gives eternal life & the recipient never perishes). But if your son should become hardened through sin, he will still be your son; he cannot become unborn.

if your son is an outlaw and the police is looking for him to pay for his crimes...does being his father make you an accomplice to his crimes???

But as to departing from God, those who are saved do not depart, and 1 John 2 says; anyone who departs from the Body of Christ shows he was never a child of God to begin with and never part of the body. He never had the things that pertain to salvation, as Heb 6:9 tells us.

are you the one who says God gives you everything when you first believe...??scripture is clear they depart from the living God...

Apostasy happens, but apostasy just shows who was a pretender.

even the word you use shows you to be a liar....
apos·ta·sy noun \ə-ˈpäs-tə-sē\
plural apos·ta·sies


[h=2]Definition of APOSTASY[/h]1
: renunciation of a religious faith

2
: abandonment of a previous loyalty :

19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they all are not of us.


They went out from us = departure, apostasy.

but they were not of us; = not part of the Body of Christ ever.

for if they had been of us [in the Body],

they would have continued with us: [those who are once part of the Body of Christ abide there; they continue there; they do not depart]

but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they all are not of us.

Apostasy shows who was the faker. They were never "His people," for "His people" get saved from their sins by a Savior who performs salvation.

There are many pretend Christians, even persons who post here, persons who never trusted Christ as Savior. There are those who trust their works in self-righteous and will not take the role of the Publican, "God be merciful to me a sinner."

Now you who post here, but actually do not trust Christ with your destiny:
How long will you continue denying the Savior?
Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for
He shall save His people from their sins.

your understanding is flawed...they went out from us... from who??? had they continued would you say they were never saved???....all they had to do was continue...the scripture is saying what it always say....if you reject him he will reject you...